I'm pretty happy with Jerian Grant. Though when we got pick 4, my first gut instinct (and post on UK) was just "Keep it simple and take Mudiay, don't get fancy!"

Time will tell. I like KP and Grant a ton and I'm happy with that draft. Mudiay is gonna be good though. I don't think he would have fit the culture the Knicks are trying to build. I feel like personality-wise he may not be a fit here.

Though that Mudiay to Faried give and go looks like something that will terrorize the league. And it'd be nice to see Wilson Chandler have a little bit of a comeback playing with a good passing PG.

holfresh wrote:

martin wrote:

holfresh wrote:

martin wrote:

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:Holfresh - I like Mudiay. If we had picked him, he was one of the few I would have been happy with, though in the triangle would not have been his strong suite.

The problem I have if we picked Mudiay, is who would Phil have taken instead of Grant? Not in hindsight seeing guys do well in pre season. Who were we eying?

I think KP and Grant was just an insane hall.

My view of the whole current situation is a little in-dept..I think it's a mistake that Phil is implementing his style of play from the GM box..The players won't buy in...I said this at the beginning of last year before the season even started..I would have preferred if Fish came up with his own strategy..I think it's the entire reason we weren't successful last year..So he bought in "character guys" who will supposedly buy in and not question Fish's authority on the subject matter..I'm thinking that is why Fish wants Phil around more.. It's a difficult task for a new head coach.. No other team does this in the NBA by the way..If Phil was coaching, then by all means let's run the triangle..But for me, talent trumps system... You bring in the best talent and run a system off that talent in the vision of your coach..Player will then play for the coach..We have a situation where players are playing for the GM..So what happens on a 4 game road trip late in February when Phil isn't around...Supposedly this group of character guys will give the extra effort with prodding thru a proxy??..OK..I hope so...I don't think we can bring in the necessary talent and compete at a high level with the current structure.

As for KP and Grant...I'm in the camp that KP needs to develop a post up game...That's when 7'3" matters...I'm not sure why the excitement for a 7'3" three point shooter..Interior players effective when you can score at will down low...So he shoots the 3 at 36 or 40%...So?..If he can score in the post at will, game changer...

Grant isn't a bad pickup, He is ahead of most rooks because he is 23 with 4 years in school while most played one year...That will even out by the end of the year...But I'm looking at him as Charlie Ward, hopefully slightly better..

I call BS big time on that train of thought. It's exactly what the Spurs do. From GM to head coach to players to assistants, everyone is on the same page and in agreement what to do.

BS..POP implement style of play..Not Buford...Everyone is on the same page because POP say so...

You understand that Pop was the GM before Buford, right? Hand picked replacement. Pop is pulling the strings everywhere.

The bigger point is that everyone is on the same page, and so are the Knicks. From top to bottom, as it should be when an organization has a good ship. Phil wanted to run a system, Fish wanted to run same system, and he does.

I'm not sure if you are missing the point or trying to steer it in another direction..My point is that the head coach has to implement style of play which currently happens in SA but not in NY..

So what happened to the Knicks last year when they went 5-36 before Phil cleaned house??..Wasn't everyone on the same page then too??..Why the huge underperformance?

They might have said they were on the same page. JR say's lots of things doesn't he? Amare is always a public optimist. Its the NBA, ask a question and your gonna hear what you want.

This year the roster is dominated by players outside of Melo who were drafted to be here (they have to learn the nba, learn the triangle at the same time) or signed as free agents. If a free agent they choose to be in the system. The Rookies buy in because they have no choice. Grant has lineage from uncle Horace and knows what he is getting himself into. KP has the skills.

Last year had its reasons. This year has not started yet. Fish was hired to run the triangle. Make no bones about it.

If you read Phil's books you won't turn into a dumb homer, but you'll gain insight on how it works. IN fact the Triangle gods think its not a superstar system and average players benefit more.
Im not sure Jordan or Kobe is convinced of that.

Last year happened. THis year has not. I guess we'll see. Logic dictates the team will improve.

earthmansurfer wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Mudiay looks to be impressive. I think he'll be a sort of weird PG though... like a mini-Bron or Harden or Tyreke Evans...

I'm pretty happy with Jerian Grant. Though when we got pick 4, my first gut instinct (and post on UK) was just "Keep it simple and take Mudiay, don't get fancy!"

Time will tell. I like KP and Grant a ton and I'm happy with that draft. Mudiay is gonna be good though. I don't think he would have fit the culture the Knicks are trying to build. I feel like personality-wise he may not be a fit here.

Though that Mudiay to Faried give and go looks like something that will terrorize the league. And it'd be nice to see Wilson Chandler have a little bit of a comeback playing with a good passing PG.

Funny you compare Mudiay to Lebron, I can see that. I do see Tyreke too as you state.
I also am happy about KP with Grant but that is because we run the triangle.
No triangle and I might have gone with Mudiay and ? (Mudiay and KP at 4 was who I was looking at.)
That said, Grant has basically shocked everyone, really, the kid is like another Mudiay, yeah, he is older but we got a great pick where we picked him at. He was looked at by many as top 10 most of the year, but his age hurt him. Sounds funny. The guy is Incredibly skilled and VERY intuitive with the ball.
And KP, so young, so much potential, really, another Dirk with a more complete game. (potential)

KP if he pans out is the kind of guy you can build a perennial 50 win team around - like Dirk or Pau.

Mudiay can be an "all-star" talent... but maybe not be on winning teams... I don't think he is as much of a game changer as KP... if KP pans out. I think the injury concern with KP is pretty high, whereas Mudiay looks like a horse.

Jerian Grant, I love this kid. He really reminds me of Jeff Teague - which I consider a pretty high compliment. He's also quite a bit taller than Teague, but something about the way Grant starts the break and finishes really reminds me of Teague. You can win a lot of games with Grant as your starting PG, once Grant learns the league.

crzymdups wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Mudiay looks to be impressive. I think he'll be a sort of weird PG though... like a mini-Bron or Harden or Tyreke Evans...

I'm pretty happy with Jerian Grant. Though when we got pick 4, my first gut instinct (and post on UK) was just "Keep it simple and take Mudiay, don't get fancy!"

Time will tell. I like KP and Grant a ton and I'm happy with that draft. Mudiay is gonna be good though. I don't think he would have fit the culture the Knicks are trying to build. I feel like personality-wise he may not be a fit here.

Though that Mudiay to Faried give and go looks like something that will terrorize the league. And it'd be nice to see Wilson Chandler have a little bit of a comeback playing with a good passing PG.

Funny you compare Mudiay to Lebron, I can see that. I do see Tyreke too as you state.
I also am happy about KP with Grant but that is because we run the triangle.
No triangle and I might have gone with Mudiay and ? (Mudiay and KP at 4 was who I was looking at.)
That said, Grant has basically shocked everyone, really, the kid is like another Mudiay, yeah, he is older but we got a great pick where we picked him at. He was looked at by many as top 10 most of the year, but his age hurt him. Sounds funny. The guy is Incredibly skilled and VERY intuitive with the ball.
And KP, so young, so much potential, really, another Dirk with a more complete game. (potential)

KP if he pans out is the kind of guy you can build a perennial 50 win team around - like Dirk or Pau.

Mudiay can be an "all-star" talent... but maybe not be on winning teams... I don't think he is as much of a game changer as KP... if KP pans out. I think the injury concern with KP is pretty high, whereas Mudiay looks like a horse.

Jerian Grant, I love this kid. He really reminds me of Jeff Teague - which I consider a pretty high compliment. He's also quite a bit taller than Teague, but something about the way Grant starts the break and finishes really reminds me of Teague. You can win a lot of games with Grant as your starting PG, once Grant learns the league.

spot on post.

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Kemet wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Its easier to find guards with Mudiays skills then it is to find bigs with KPs skills. His last pre season game he grabbed 10rebs in 20min over the Wizards frontcourt. Shot 3s, put the ball on the floor for pull up jumper, posted up and finished on Gortat.

Triangle or no Triangle KP is just as much a talent that Mudiay is except he is even more rare to find.

I wouldve waited until after 25 games in the season to make that comment ..

Why? Is it false to say it harder to find 7'3" athletic players who can shoot lights ot and defend than it is to find big PG's who can distribute, defend but not shoot well? And I really like Mudiay.

earthmansurfer wrote:Mudiay with a good statline in the loss. 8-17fg, 6-7 ft, 3 assists, 5 to's. I'm going to guess he scored well on drives but not from the outside?

mreinman - Yeah about the shooting, that video showed he scored from the outside too. That was my and everyones concern with him. His TO's were terrible. I can't understand why he had only 3 assists, he normally seems to dish it well.

Grant so far is right there with Mudiay, though funnily enough, Grant hasn't shown much with his shot. Grant seems like he might help us forget Mudiay in the short term and KP in a few years...

earthmansurfer wrote:Holfresh - Thanks for the video! Man, I have to admit, he looks like a talent. Lost on defense but as mreinman said, I almost expect that. Even great defenders can't guard Westbrook and the like much.
I would have been happy if we got him (not based on that video.) I was leaning towards KP due to him maybe amounting to something special.

mreinman - Yeah about the shooting, that video showed he scored from the outside too. That was my and everyones concern with him. His TO's were terrible. I can't understand why he had only 3 assists, he normally seems to dish it well.

Grant so far is right there with Mudiay, though funnily enough, Grant hasn't shown much with his shot. Grant seems like he might help us forget Mudiay in the short term and KP in a few years...

Grant is not in the same class as Mudiay...

holfresh wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:Mudiay with a good statline in the loss. 8-17fg, 6-7 ft, 3 assists, 5 to's. I'm going to guess he scored well on drives but not from the outside?

Mudiay has faced Chris Paul, Westbrook and Curry in the preseason..Sprinkle in a little Jimmy Butler...Mudiay is lost on defense..He is getting caught on so many back screen cuts...