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OT:U.S. Soldiers Told to Ignore Sexual Abuse of Boys by Afghan Allies..
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holfresh
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9/21/2015  11:00 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/21/world/asia/us-soldiers-told-to-ignore-afghan-allies-abuse-of-boys.html?&target=comments&hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&modref=HPCommentsRefer&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news#commentsContainer

KABUL, Afghanistan — In his last phone call home, Lance Cpl. Gregory Buckley Jr. told his father what was troubling him: From his bunk in southern Afghanistan, he could hear Afghan police officers sexually abusing boys they had brought to the base.

“At night we can hear them screaming, but we’re not allowed to do anything about it,” the Marine’s father, Gregory Buckley Sr., recalled his son telling him before he was shot to death at the base in 2012. He urged his son to tell his superiors. “My son said that his officers told him to look the other way because it’s their culture.”

Rampant sexual abuse of children has long been a problem in Afghanistan, particularly among armed commanders who dominate much of the rural landscape and can bully the population. The practice is called bacha bazi, literally “boy play,” and American soldiers and Marines have been instructed not to intervene — in some cases, not even when their Afghan allies have abused boys on military bases, according to interviews and court records.
Photo
Gregory Buckley Sr. believes the policy of looking the other way was a factor in his son's killing. Credit Kirsten Luce for The New York Times

The policy has endured as American forces have recruited and organized Afghan militias to help hold territory against the Taliban. But soldiers and Marines have been increasingly troubled that instead of weeding out pedophiles, the American military was arming them in some cases and placing them as the commanders of villages — and doing little when they began abusing children.

“The reason we were here is because we heard the terrible things the Taliban were doing to people, how they were taking away human rights,” said Dan Quinn, a former Special Forces captain who beat up an American-backed militia commander for keeping a boy chained to his bed as a sex slave. “But we were putting people into power who would do things that were worse than the Taliban did — that was something village elders voiced to me.”

The policy of instructing soldiers to ignore child sexual abuse by their Afghan allies is coming under new scrutiny, particularly as it emerges that service members like Captain Quinn have faced discipline, even career ruin, for disobeying it.

After the beating, the Army relieved Captain Quinn of his command and pulled him from Afghanistan. He has since left the military.

Four years later, the Army is also trying to forcibly retire Sgt. First Class Charles Martland, a Special Forces member who joined Captain Quinn in beating up the commander.

“The Army contends that Martland and others should have looked the other way (a contention that I believe is nonsense),” Representative Duncan Hunter, a California Republican who hopes to save Sergeant Martland’s career, wrote last week to the Pentagon’s inspector general.

In Sergeant Martland’s case, the Army said it could not comment because of the Privacy Act.

When asked about American military policy, the spokesman for the American command in Afghanistan, Col. Brian Tribus, wrote in an email: “Generally, allegations of child sexual abuse by Afghan military or police personnel would be a matter of domestic Afghan criminal law.” He added that “there would be no express requirement that U.S. military personnel in Afghanistan report it.” An exception, he said, is when rape is being used as a weapon of war.

The American policy of nonintervention is intended to maintain good relations with the Afghan police and militia units the United States has trained to fight the Taliban. It also reflects a reluctance to impose cultural values in a country where pederasty is rife, particularly among powerful men, for whom being surrounded by young teenagers can be a mark of social status.

Some soldiers believed that the policy made sense, even if they were personally distressed at the sexual predation they witnessed or heard about.

“The bigger picture was fighting the Taliban,” a former Marine lance corporal reflected. “It wasn’t to stop molestation.”

Still, the former lance corporal, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to avoid offending fellow Marines, recalled feeling sickened the day he entered a room on a base and saw three or four men lying on the floor with children between them. “I’m not a hundred percent sure what was happening under the sheet, but I have a pretty good idea of what was going on,” he said.

But the American policy of treating child sexual abuse as a cultural issue has often alienated the villages whose children are being preyed upon. The pitfalls of the policy emerged clearly as American Special Forces soldiers began to form Afghan Local Police militias to hold villages that American forces had retaken from the Taliban in 2010 and 2011.

By the summer of 2011, Captain Quinn and Sergeant Martland, both Green Berets on their second tour in northern Kunduz Province, began to receive dire complaints about the Afghan Local Police units they were training and supporting.

First, they were told, one of the militia commanders raped a 14- or 15-year-old girl whom he had spotted working in the fields. Captain Quinn informed the provincial police chief, who soon levied punishment. “He got one day in jail, and then she was forced to marry him,” Mr. Quinn said.

When he asked a superior officer what more he could do, he was told that he had done well to bring it up with local officials but that there was nothing else to be done. “We’re being praised for doing the right thing, and a guy just got away with raping a 14-year-old girl,” Mr. Quinn said.
Photo
A portrait of Lance Cpl. Gregory Buckley Jr. in his family's home in Oceanside, N.Y. He was shot to death in 2012 by a teenage "tea boy" living on his base in Helmand Province. Credit Kirsten Luce for The New York Times

Village elders grew more upset at the predatory behavior of American-backed commanders. After each case, Captain Quinn would gather the Afghan commanders and lecture them on human rights.

Soon another commander absconded with his men’s wages. Mr. Quinn said he later heard that the commander had spent the money on dancing boys. Another commander murdered his 12-year-old daughter in a so-called honor killing for having kissed a boy. “There were no repercussions,” Mr. Quinn recalled.

In September 2011, an Afghan woman, visibly bruised, showed up at an American base with her son, who was limping. One of the Afghan police commanders in the area, Abdul Rahman, had abducted the boy and forced him to become a sex slave, chained to his bed, the woman explained. When she sought her son’s return, she herself was beaten. Her son had eventually been released, but she was afraid it would happen again, she told the Americans on the base.

She explained that because “her son was such a good-looking kid, he was a status symbol” coveted by local commanders, recalled Mr. Quinn, who did not speak to the woman directly but was told about her visit when he returned to the base from a mission later that day.

So Captain Quinn summoned Abdul Rahman and confronted him about what he had done. The police commander acknowledged that it was true, but brushed it off. When the American officer began to lecture about “how you are held to a higher standard if you are working with U.S. forces, and people expect more of you,” the commander began to laugh.

And we're bringing more of these people here. Not only do they abuse others they are apparently slaves. The liberal left continues to allow...
Jeff Just now

Why the surprise that Obama's worldwide scourge of low grade wars, unauthorized and endless, lead to chronic misery?

Where is Obama? Where is the Pope? Of course we have all known that the treatment of women and girls is mere slavery, and neither the Pope...


“I picked him up and threw him onto the ground,” Mr. Quinn said. Sergeant Martland joined in, he said. “I did this to make sure the message was understood that if he went back to the boy, that it was not going to be tolerated,” Mr. Quinn recalled.

There is disagreement over the extent of the commander’s injuries. Mr. Quinn said they were not serious, which was corroborated by an Afghan official who saw the commander afterward.

(The commander, Abdul Rahman, was killed two years ago in a Taliban ambush. His brother said in an interview that his brother had never raped the boy, but was the victim of a false accusation engineered by his enemies.)

Sergeant Martland, who received a Bronze Star for valor for his actions during a Taliban ambush, wrote in a letter to the Army this year that he and Mr. Quinn “felt that morally we could no longer stand by and allow our A.L.P. to commit atrocities,” referring to the Afghan Local Police.

The father of Lance Corporal Buckley believes the policy of looking away from sexual abuse was a factor in his son’s death, and he has filed a lawsuit to press the Marine Corps for more information about it.

Lance Corporal Buckley and two other Marines were killed in 2012 by one of a large entourage of boys living at their base with an Afghan police commander named Sarwar Jan.

Mr. Jan had long had a bad reputation; in 2010, two Marine officers managed to persuade the Afghan authorities to arrest him following a litany of abuses, including corruption, support for the Taliban and child abduction. But just two years later, the police commander was back with a different unit, working at Lance Corporal Buckley’s post, Forward Operating Base Delhi, in Helmand Province.

Lance Corporal Buckley had noticed that a large entourage of “tea boys” — domestic servants who are sometimes pressed into sexual slavery — had arrived with Mr. Jan and moved into the same barracks, one floor below the Marines. He told his father about it during his final call home.

Word of Mr. Jan’s new position also reached the Marine officers who had gotten him arrested in 2010. One of them, Maj. Jason Brezler, dashed out an email to Marine officers at F.O.B. Delhi, warning them about Mr. Jan and attaching a dossier about him.

The warning was never heeded. About two weeks later, one of the older boys with Mr. Jan — around 17 years old — grabbed a rifle and killed Lance Corporal Buckley and the other Marines.

Lance Corporal Buckley’s father still agonizes about whether the killing occurred because of the sexual abuse by an American ally. “As far as the young boys are concerned, the Marines are allowing it to happen and so they’re guilty by association,” Mr. Buckley said. “They don’t know our Marines are sick to their stomachs.”

The one American service member who was punished in the investigation that followed was Major Brezler, who had sent the email warning about Mr. Jan, his lawyers said. In one of Major Brezler’s hearings, Marine Corps lawyers warned that information about the police commander’s penchant for abusing boys might be classified. The Marine Corps has initiated proceedings to discharge Major Brezler.

Mr. Jan appears to have moved on, to a higher-ranking police command in the same province. In an interview, he denied keeping boys as sex slaves or having any relationship with the boy who killed the three Marines. “No, it’s all untrue,” Mr. Jan said. But people who know him say he still suffers from “a toothache problem,” a euphemism here for child sexual abuse.

AUTOADVERT
arkrud
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9/21/2015  11:31 AM
This is a part of their culture (or absence of culture in our understanding of what culture is).
This people are not far away from stone age so we should leave them alone.
It is not our dem business how they are leaving their life.
If we have some strategic need to have military presence in this areas its fine but we should mind our own business.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Nalod
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9/21/2015  12:19 PM
War is hell.
holfresh
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9/21/2015  3:41 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/21/2015  3:42 PM
Couple of post from the NYTimes site by readers of this article..

Unfortunately our military is trained for war and not to police. The Afghani culture that allows for sexual relationships with boys is horrific, but our military has no power to change this practice. Afghanistan is a sovereign country with a history and culture we as Americans will always fail to understand. The errors of our military intervention are bringing the dark sides of Afghani culture to our moral attention. The crimes occurring in that region of the world are immeasurable. Why are we still there?

Heroin production is rampant in Afghanistan and is flooding the world with cheap and powerful narcotics, the government just looks the other way and many Afghani officials are heavily invested in the drug trade. The Taliban are still very active and the Coalition is falling apart. The wasted US treasure and lives, is small compared to the damage this poor country has endured through endless wars and suffering. The practice of pedophilia in this distant country is just one of the many horrors that continue to occur in this remote, time-forgotten land.

The quagmire of Vietnam palls to the disaster which is Afghanistan.

holfresh
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9/21/2015  3:41 PM
The chasm between the culture of Afghanistan, and most of the countries in that region, and the US, is so vast that we cannot hope to change it. Unless we are willing to completely occupy the place and make the people submit to us for many generations. We are not willing to do so, nor should we be.

Of course, the military and political leadership would say that changing the culture is not our intent, and they are correct. We are there for...some ill defined realpolitik motive. Keeping China contained, Russia off base, Iran surrounded, etc., etc., etc. But at least we should be a bit less hypocritical about it.

How about stating we won't tolerate it? This is the British Commander-in-Chief's response @ 1850 to Hindu priests complaining about the ban of Sati, the burning alive of widows on the funeral pyre:
"Be it so. This burning of widows is your custom; prepare the funeral pile. But my nation has also a custom. When men burn women alive we hang them, and confiscate all their property. My carpenters shall therefore erect gibbets on which to hang all concerned when the widow is consumed. Let us all act according to national customs."

My son is an active service Marine, and I have no doubt he will be railroaded out like Capt. Quinn if he finds himself in a similar situation. And I'll be proud of him.

BTW, the essence of this story was related to me way back in 2005 by a neighbor who had an Army deployment to Afghanistan. He told us about "man love Thursday." Disgusting.

arkrud
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9/21/2015  4:11 PM
I am sure people of other cultures will find some things we accustom to disgusting for them.
This does not mean we have to change our ways.
The countries exist to separate cultures which do not mix.
This is the only use of sovereignty with all the reset just a political bull...
When cultures became close the borders became nominal like in EU or between US and Canada.
Still we have some differences in culture so the separate countries still exist.
When people of different cultures are thrown by foreign powers into one country to reach their own goals this formation cannot last long. We see this fake conglomerate states breaking in front of us. bringing war, misery, and suffering to all people.
But we continue the helpless efforts to keep this failed states together.
We should stop doing this for our own sake and for the sake of all this people.
It will be civil war, displacement, and misery... but there is no other way for this nations to build their own countries.
Some of them will fail and vanish but some will build their own future.
In the end every nation will get what it deserves.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Cartman718
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9/22/2015  10:50 AM
arkrud wrote:This is a part of their culture (or absence of culture in our understanding of what culture is).
This people are not far away from stone age so we should leave them alone.
It is not our dem business how they are leaving their life.
If we have some strategic need to have military presence in this areas its fine but we should mind our own business.

there are cannibalistic primitive tribes in various parts of the world and somehow they are protected. but guess...they leave us alone and we leave them alone.

the difference with afghanistan is that it wants to commit these horrific human rights violations and yet be part of the world economy. if you are going to be part of the global economy, you have to play by the global economy rules.

such blatant violations should not be tolerated and its really sad that the afghan government permits such violations of minors who literally have ZERO say in what happens to them in these countries.

Nixluva is posting triangle screen grabs, even when nobody asks - Fishmike. LOL So are we going to reference that thread like the bible now? "The thread of Wroten Page 14 post 9" - EnySpree
simrud
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9/22/2015  11:06 AM
This all comes down to not committing to a certain goal / way of doing things fully.

Either we are just there to have a military base in the region (I don't know why, this is Russia's sphere of geopolitical influence anyways) or we are there to nation build.

To put things into more perspective we have successful examples of both approaches.

Exhibit A - military base with no involvement in internal affairs - any Arab country in them middle east with a US military base there. They are kingdoms with slavery as a major part of their culture, no rights for women, minorities and so on. We don't hear about it and don't care about it because we approach the situation as nothing more than a military base.

Exhibit B - nation building - South Korea - we have been there for generations with no intentions of going away ever.

So either have a military base or nation build - don't be stuck in the middle flailing around and wasting resources. But understand that the more different the culture is from ours the more brutal you need to be if you are going to nation build. Ironically if you were to enact real change in Afghanistan you would have to use the same methods as the Taliban - line the roads with the bodies of the dead.

A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
Nalod
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9/22/2015  1:06 PM
We have not colonized Afghanistan and thus don't rule over it as did the Brits to control burning of Widows.

Soldiers are MEN who are there to police and defend those who can't defend themselves. We must respect the rules and customs of others even if we are repulsed by them.

holfresh
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9/22/2015  1:31 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/22/2015  1:33 PM
Nalod wrote:We have not colonized Afghanistan and thus don't rule over it as did the Brits to control burning of Widows.

Soldiers are MEN who are there to police and defend those who can't defend themselves. We must respect the rules and customs of others even if we are repulsed by them.

If we are there to police and protect those who can't defend themselves, doesn't protection from kidnapping and rape fall into that category?..There are no rules or anyone to enforce them..Which is why the Warlords/powerful regional men have their way with the population...It's considered a custom because they have gotten away with it for some long..

newyorknewyork
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9/22/2015  7:39 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/22/2015  7:39 PM
Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.
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arkrud
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9/22/2015  10:24 PM
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
holfresh
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9/22/2015  10:40 PM    LAST EDITED: 9/22/2015  10:41 PM
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

Eating lamb every third Friday of the month with your family is tradition and culture...Kidnapping, chaining young boys to the bed, and continued raping them is a crime against humanity...Morality knows no boundaries of culture or borders...When you violate another human being is where the line is drawn...The liberal behavior is not blowing their heads off at first glance...

Nalod
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9/22/2015  10:42 PM
holfresh wrote:
Nalod wrote:We have not colonized Afghanistan and thus don't rule over it as did the Brits to control burning of Widows.

Soldiers are MEN who are there to police and defend those who can't defend themselves. We must respect the rules and customs of others even if we are repulsed by them.

If we are there to police and protect those who can't defend themselves, doesn't protection from kidnapping and rape fall into that category?..There are no rules or anyone to enforce them..Which is why the Warlords/powerful regional men have their way with the population...It's considered a custom because they have gotten away with it for some long..

We are not at war with them, nor do we rule over them installing our laws.
Im not saying its right, and Im sure its very difficult to fight along or for men that rape ANYONE.

arkrud
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9/22/2015  10:49 PM
holfresh wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

Eating lamb every third Friday of the month is tradition and culture...Kidnapping, chaining young boys to the bed, and continued raping them is a crime against humanity...Morality knows no boundaries of culture or borders...When you violate another human being is where the line is drawn...The liberal behavior is not blowing their heads off at first at first glance...

Liberal ideas of our leader are in fact blowing thousands of heads of just because we are forcing our military to places we should not be. In the name of humanity and generosity.
There is no such thing as some "human culture". Cultures are many and every society and even tribe has their own brand.
Making society human take time and effort of countless generations. Some people are not even in the infancy of the culture you are talking about.
How many "cultures" get extinct like Native Americans, North people, etc. just because they were consumed by superior society.
Was it brutal. No doubt. But it was no other way then and no other way now.
Let them be like a "Culture Parks" for us to watch and research or blow them in peaces and force then to be "human".
Which of this two evils you prefer?

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
newyorknewyork
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9/22/2015  10:59 PM
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

There is no benefit for any culture to rape and or sexually abuse children. It only benefits the perversions of the ppl that choose to do so. Anyone who wants rape and sexual abuse over childern as part of there culture does not deserve to have a culture.

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arkrud
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9/22/2015  11:16 PM
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

There is no benefit for any culture to rape and or sexually abuse children. It only benefits the perversions of the ppl that choose to do so. Anyone who wants rape and sexual abuse over childern as part of there culture does not deserve to have a culture.

If the culture is centered on making most of the people leaving in fear and humiliation under the power of few this is very beneficial for this culture goals.
This culture assumed that most of the people are not capable to sustain their live and need strong leadership which should be enforced by any means.
This nations do not have enough wealth for every member to enjoy. So they consider a lot of human beings just a material which can be used and thrown away...
This how all human race used to leave in primitive times. And a lot of humans are still leave in societies like this.
Colonialism was a process of spreading more human culture to primitive societies by brutal means.
They were thinking that Goal approves the means.
Now we are not sure any more... Time to get our-self clear on this. We may have no choice but make a choice.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
newyorknewyork
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9/22/2015  11:45 PM
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

There is no benefit for any culture to rape and or sexually abuse children. It only benefits the perversions of the ppl that choose to do so. Anyone who wants rape and sexual abuse over childern as part of there culture does not deserve to have a culture.

If the culture is centered on making most of the people leaving in fear and humiliation under the power of few this is very beneficial for this culture goals.
This culture assumed that most of the people are not capable to sustain their live and need strong leadership which should be enforced by any means.
This nations do not have enough wealth for every member to enjoy. So they consider a lot of human beings just a material which can be used and thrown away...
This how all human race used to leave in primitive times. And a lot of humans are still leave in societies like this.
Colonialism was a process of spreading more human culture to primitive societies by brutal means.
They were thinking that Goal approves the means.
Now we are not sure any more... Time to get our-self clear on this. We may have no choice but make a choice.

I get what your saying but that's not culture that's dictatorship. Claiming culture is making it seem as if there society as a whole wants there children and women to be raped.

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arkrud
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9/23/2015  8:14 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

There is no benefit for any culture to rape and or sexually abuse children. It only benefits the perversions of the ppl that choose to do so. Anyone who wants rape and sexual abuse over childern as part of there culture does not deserve to have a culture.

If the culture is centered on making most of the people leaving in fear and humiliation under the power of few this is very beneficial for this culture goals.
This culture assumed that most of the people are not capable to sustain their live and need strong leadership which should be enforced by any means.
This nations do not have enough wealth for every member to enjoy. So they consider a lot of human beings just a material which can be used and thrown away...
This how all human race used to leave in primitive times. And a lot of humans are still leave in societies like this.
Colonialism was a process of spreading more human culture to primitive societies by brutal means.
They were thinking that Goal approves the means.
Now we are not sure any more... Time to get our-self clear on this. We may have no choice but make a choice.

I get what your saying but that's not culture that's dictatorship. Claiming culture is making it seem as if there society as a whole wants there children and women to be raped.

Dictatorship is how culture manifest itself, secondary thing.
The human race is still young and still wild for the most part.
We did a lot of strides forward to secure, prosperous, human society.
But it is very uneven across the globe.
We need to have more compassion to those who born and raised into primitive cultures.
They need help not angry dismissal. This does not help.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
newyorknewyork
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9/23/2015  11:18 AM
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:
arkrud wrote:
newyorknewyork wrote:Regardless of culture the sexual abuse of a child is wrong. If that isn't worth fighting and going to war over then nothing is.

Why raping women which is basically how treatment of women in general is from our perspective in any traditional Muslim country is not a big deal but raping boys is?
Or honor killing, or heads cutting, or stoning, or whatever?
Is making some nation follow the rules they do not yet understand worth killing 1 of 10 to enforce it?
You cannot be liberal with cannibals - they will broil you and eat you together with you liberal ideas and will not even choke.

There is no benefit for any culture to rape and or sexually abuse children. It only benefits the perversions of the ppl that choose to do so. Anyone who wants rape and sexual abuse over childern as part of there culture does not deserve to have a culture.

If the culture is centered on making most of the people leaving in fear and humiliation under the power of few this is very beneficial for this culture goals.
This culture assumed that most of the people are not capable to sustain their live and need strong leadership which should be enforced by any means.
This nations do not have enough wealth for every member to enjoy. So they consider a lot of human beings just a material which can be used and thrown away...
This how all human race used to leave in primitive times. And a lot of humans are still leave in societies like this.
Colonialism was a process of spreading more human culture to primitive societies by brutal means.
They were thinking that Goal approves the means.
Now we are not sure any more... Time to get our-self clear on this. We may have no choice but make a choice.

I get what your saying but that's not culture that's dictatorship. Claiming culture is making it seem as if there society as a whole wants there children and women to be raped.

Dictatorship is how culture manifest itself, secondary thing.
The human race is still young and still wild for the most part.
We did a lot of strides forward to secure, prosperous, human society.
But it is very uneven across the globe.
We need to have more compassion to those who born and raised into primitive cultures.
They need help not angry dismissal. This does not help.

Afghanistan has been a civilization longer then the US. A lot of the moral laws the US and other counrties use today were first established around that area. Humanity no matter how many yrs we live will always put selfish desires of there own over the needs of others. Leaders who view people at property to satisfy there perversions or even in general aren't fit to be leaders. And most likely are only in that position due to massive wealth and not due to there moral standing and leadership skills. True leaders would be looking to improve the living conditions of there ppl and using there allied pack with US to attempt to create something better.

I don't believe for them to be viewed as dumb savages. The people at the top and there tierney need to be removed from power.

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OT:U.S. Soldiers Told to Ignore Sexual Abuse of Boys by Afghan Allies..

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