Jmpasq wrote:Am I the only one who doesnt see how you can build a championship team with a Super Max player "Outside of Lebron". Carmelo makes to much money and is to flawed to build a team around. Adding Greg Monroe makes the Knicks a borderline 8 seed

There are a few other guys I think are worth that much but they haven't been in the league long enough to qualify. The problem is you have to have at least 10 years experience to get the supermax. So you're paying a guy the supermax for his 11th to 15th seasons, which is a bad gamble. Or 12th to 16th in Melo's case.

While providing much needed leadership for Orlando, some solid defense, and played SG and SF, he also improved his 3pt shot in the 40% + , lead the league in points, FT attempts, and a decent FG% for a guard that took mainly jump shots, mid range, and 3pters with a team that lacked scorers/talent

However, after his career year in Orlando and being then traded back to save money on draft night for a LATE 50 something pick and Evan Fornier swap
He just hasn't been the same player even though he got the minutes and is nearing the age of 30, Portland decides to trade with Denver for him as they did for Raymond Felton with a 1st rounder and a younger prospect in Will Barton

Portland tried to add depth and possibly add the pieces to contend this year after the improvements Portland made last year by adding Kaman, Steve Blake, and the development of Meyers Leanard, CJ Mcclaum, after Lilliard knocked out Houston with the buzzer beater...

Despite that Wesley Matthews was injured and out for the season followed by many other injuries last year on their entire roster
Owner Paul Allen and GM knew they had to make a decision to pay a bunch of 30 year olds BIG MONEY or not, while they tried to add as much talent as they could, they couldn't overcome their poor timing of injuries and Memphis's DEFENSE, despite not having Mike Conley for a couple of games as well

I have watched Affalo the past 2 seasons and he has just struggled more importantly struggled with a team in Denver with a core of talents that he already had chemistry with, though it seems as Brian Shaw just lossed the team and needed a new voice
In Portland he struggled with PLAYING TIME and a limited role, however, he was a poor fit with Portland as well, with many GUNNERS playing in the 2nd unit and little ball movement and playing as the 4th/5th option
I can not tell if he is just passed his prime as player approaching 30 like Felton and MANY OTHERS do/did but I hope CA realizes this and doesn't expect the same Affalo he played with years ago
He does try to post up but rarely got opportunities as the 4th/5th option but failed to get even double digit scoring when he was the starter playing about 25-30minutes a game
Then he had injuries that kept in out in the play offs as well, so I really do not know what to expect from him but I would not even consider him for MLE type money

The rise of the cap complicates things, as teams are trying to save money and accumulate as much talent as possible while filling needs
It is hard to put a value on Affalo given the circumstances of the rising cap but I think it is more possible that he is entering his 30s as he is 29 and as he is a player that is unable to adapt to the NBA as his body is declining, along with his speed/quickness/jumping ability affecting both his OFF and DEF

I know Phil Jackson likes players that could POST UP however, though he had a few games where he did pretty well in Denver, he generally struggled throughout the year and doesn't look like the same player he was even with a core he has chemistry with...

I do not go on any message boards but I know some of you do here, try asking REAL GM or wherever in Portland and Denver what they thought of Affalo this year compared to the past
Again many players struggle as they reach about 10years of a 82 game season *with majority of him in play offs and he always liked to play with contact on both ends....

I would stay as far away from him and do not think he is worth considering at a HUGE discount, VERY SURPRISED he opted out of his deal, with the way he has struggled this year
At best he is a taxpayers or bi annual exemption of under 3m on a short term deal
If you are going to sign him for veteran leadership for locker room that the general public does not see *maybe, though Denver was horrible this year as well*

Randy Foye/Jameer Nelson though play PG and PG/SG would probably be cheaper and better players as well as Will Barton

I repeat, HE IS NOT THE SAME AFFALO as 2 seasons ago and before that, like Fred Jones and many other 30 year olds, he is closer to a vet min player and closer to retirement, like Gilbert Areana's, Iverson, Raymond Felton and many others the have retired early once their physical decline sets in

Either that or he just had a horrible 1 season with a team that he was already familiar with.... and with Portland, I wouldn't want to pay to find out

meloshouldgo wrote:

Finestrg wrote:Well, for anyone who wants Monroe, this has got to make you feel a little better after hearing speculation today that Monroe may not sign here. I definitely want Monroe -- this dude can be a 20/12 player in this league with only a few more mins a night and a couple more shots up at the basket a night. No question in my mind about that. They go about it a little differently but basically everything I like about Enes Kanter I like about this guy as well. He's basically everything we'd want out of Jahlil Okafor if we had drafted that kid. I honestly don't see much of a difference in Greg Monroe and Okafor. If anything, Greg Monroe is a lot closer to realizing 20/10 production than Okafor is. I find it funny that 99% of people would've loved Okafor in the draft but it feels like less than 50% of the peeps around here don't want Monroe. What's the big difference between the two? Okafor a little wider/thicker (which could present a problem down the road if Jahlil doesn't take care of himself) but honestly, I don't really see any difference.. With Monroe, ya figure there's a lot less waiting to get close to that 20/10 level of play...He'd be a very good signing.

Afflalo? I don't know about that one -- nice player, he's in that Wes Matthews class for me. How much is this guy looking for? I'm tellin' ya -- I wouldn't look to throw a ton of money at the 2G spot. Try to bring back Shved, add and continue cultivating Ricky Ledo then look to the DL and/or inexpensive Euro. FAs for a 3rd 2G for depth -- guys like Daniel Hackett (let's see what he's got in SL), Scotty Hopson, Kevin Murphy (innate ability to go out there and score the ball), Orlando Johnson, Jerrell Eddie, Dominique Jones (Phil likes bigger versatile 2s that can handle and distribute the ball--that's exactly what this guy is), maybe Michael Frazier (just because GS is bringing him in for SL doesn't mean his their property -- we can still swoop in an make an offer. Can't picture him sticking with that team anyway--and if he did, how much PT is he ever really getting there? Dude can really shoot it)...Afflalo is a good player but I don't like him for Wes Matthews money. I want Monroe -- that's $15-16mm right there. And I want Monroe as my starting PF. I still want a C. If you told me we could go out an add Monroe and Alexis Ajinca first and then take a crack at Afflalo knowing we also have Shved locked up -- OK. One good thing about bringing in Afflalo though -- he might make NY that much more of an attractive place for a Greg Monroe to sign with. I dunno--my gut tell me conserve cap space here and look for a cheaper solution.

Okafor wasn't my choice in he draft but he would be on a rookie contract. Monroe would be on teh max salary. Are you really comparing those two?

Yes, I am comparing them. You bet...I hear what you're saying -- it would've been ideal to add that same type of ready-to-go post scorer on a rookie contract (I remember talking about the same thing, how beneficial that would've been) but it wasn't in the cards. He never slipped to us.. Time to move on and build the team a different way. So what--because we missed out on Okafor, that was our only option to add a post scorer?? I still want that low post presence, just gonna have to pay a steeper price for it now, whether it's LaMarcus Aldridge, Greg Monroe or someone else. What are ya gonna do? Just the reality of things post draft...Monroe will command less money than Aldridge and for that and several other reasons (younger, more efficient) I like Monroe better. We wound up taking a player in this draft that's a little bit of a project. Safe to say Okafor is definitely more NBA-ready at this point over Porzingis. No argument. That's not to say Porzingis can't contribute this year--I think he can, he just has a little more evolving to do physically and skill/position-wise compared to Okafor. No way are we done enhancing the frontline because we drafted KP -- it's still an ongoing process to continue rebuilding that frontcourt--I feel like we need at least two real solid FA bigs in place this way we can bring KP along at a slower pace. The two bigs I want are Monroe and Alexis Ajinca, two of the better FA bigs out there in terms of value. Both guys are on the young side, skilled and complement KP and Melo pretty well..

The point I was trying make is that skill-wise at that position, there's very little difference between Okafor and Greg Monroe when you get right down to it. I was attempting to compare their games, not their salaries...They are very similar talents and at each player's ceiling, you're looking at roughly the same projection -- a 20/10 PF/C down on the low block. One thing where Monroe has the edge--he's been around a little bit now and is closer to reaching that 20/10 plateau over Okafor--it'll probably take Okafor a shorter duration to reach his ceiling than Porzingis but it's still gonna take some time for him to develop and adjust. Monroe's just the more mature player right now in terms of realizing his full potential. No question we could definitely use that, esp. when you consider we're rebuilding, yes, but still trying to win now with Melo. Another thing that concerns me a little about Okafor -- his weight. He trimmed down for the draft--does he put the extra weight back on now? Interested to see if he turns out to be one of those guys whose weight is an on-going issue to keep under control. That could hinder his development if so. No such issue with Monroe, not that I know of anyway..

Jmpasq wrote:Am I the only one who doesnt see how you can build a championship team with a Super Max player "Outside of Lebron". Carmelo makes to much money and is to flawed to build a team around. Adding Greg Monroe makes the Knicks a borderline 8 seed

Thats where you start. Got to get to 8th seed before you get to Conf finals. Then you can contend. its 3 years at the very least. You can't see it, neither can I. Im not telling you its gonna happen, but I know that you need to have progress and players with upside.

Monroe SHOULD have upside because the system should enhance his game, Melo is better outside threat than anyone they had, and the Zinger SHOULD improve over three years and hopefully be a 20-5-3 player.

Rosters evolve.

crzymdups wrote:I wonder if the plan is to offer David West the full MLE - he gets the same amount of dollars but over longer years and transitions into more of a mentor / coaching role?

This is a decent ten man rotation -

Calderon / Grant
Afflalo / Galloway
Melo / Early
West / Porzingis
Monroe / Cole

Love it! Except replace Calderon with Grant. We need athletic defensive wings. Signing both Monroe(my #1 target all along) and West would be huge. Zings & Monroe will learn some much about how to be a professional from West. He will hold down the fort for when Zings shines as a starter. Not crazy about Affalo but like others have said we are not prying Carroll, Drey Green & Butler away from their current teams. You the your best with what's out there. I actually rather have Affalo than Danny Green. More athletic and better fit IMO. If he can regain his form. Still only 29.

Let's do it:
C Monroe/Cole/Hernan(2016-17)
PF West(MLE)/Zings/Amundson
SF Melo/Early/Thanasis/Thomas
SG Affalo/Shved
PG Grant/Galloway/Calderon(deadline trade)

I think we drafted the 2nd best player in the draft. Certainly the 2nd best fit. We needed a top do it all big in this system. And that was Towns and Porzingis. We didn't need ball dominant guards like Russell and Mudiay. Grant is the perfect PG for this system. Big, defends, a basketball player, doesn't need to score 20 a night to be effective and plays with pride. New York will love this kid. Drafting Hernangomez was nice too because Zings will be comfortable with him around. It will help making am the massive transition into the states and the NBA easier on the 19yr old.

If this all pans out we just took a big step towards becoming a year in year out contender in the East. The youth assures that this current group will be able to grow together and have longevity. Then every year you fill in the gaps as all contenders do.

dwiley20 wrote:I want Ellis or Shumpert backz!!! We should go hard after Butler then Monroe

Id love to get Shumpert back. I truly believe his offense will come along on day and he was will have a Trevor Ariza like career or at worst Matt Barnes/Bruce Bowen. Maybe he breaks out like Jimmy Butler

This new norm for role players is going to make it very hard to field a competive team. Monroe at least is young and has the ability to improve. Affalo probably isn't that much of an upgrade over Galloway. But, I guess if the cap goes up and the team adds another free agent next season, you will have a veteran team, with Zinger, Monroe, Miller and potentially another allstar.