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Knicks have serious developmental issues...that's the main thing that needs to change
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Knixkik
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5/18/2015  2:57 PM
Fields, Shump, Hardaway Jr., and now Galloway. 4 players in the past 5 years to be named to all-rookie teams. And none of them even lottery picks. On paper, that makes us one of the most impressive drafting teams in the league. Not only drafting players who had successful rookie seasons each year, but finding them later in the draft. But there's a problem; with the jury still out of Galloway, each of the other 3 were most successful during their rookie seasons. In general we saw a decline each year. Some of it can be attributed to drafting more nba-ready players (as for them making all-rookie teams), but the declines are alarming. Fields, Shumpert, and Hardaway Jr. should all be major contributors on the Knicks right now, but they aren't. Fields is almost out of the league, Shumpert is a poor offensive player, and Hardaway Jr. lost all of his offensive spark he had last season until the last 5 games this year. Things would look a lot different in NY if we could have properly developed some of our draft choices.
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Knixkik
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5/18/2015  2:59 PM
on the plus side...congrats to Gallo...hopefully he does not continue this trend and turns into a major contributor/role player/starter who is a Knick for the next 10-15 years.
mreinman
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5/18/2015  3:06 PM
good post.

We crush young players but the bigger problem is that we way overhype them and set ridiculous expectations like comparing THJ to Reggie Miller (yes ... this was done by a couple of posters ... I know ... crazy)

We need to let our kids grow and stop crowning them as future HOFers before they took their first NBA shyt.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
RicanHavok
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5/18/2015  3:07 PM    LAST EDITED: 5/18/2015  3:09 PM
I think it has more to do with continuity or lackthereof than anything else. Shump & Timmy jr went through coaching & system changes. (imho Woodson did more bad than good for Shump. Constantly yanking him in and out of different lineups, using him at SF when he was still learning his position/role) I think if Gallo can continue to grow in the same system it will only benefit him.
BRIGGS
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5/18/2015  3:42 PM
Yeah for a long time.

The mandate should be like this

You should strive to win your SL team games
Your D league team should be a top team
Do not let agents have any input on your team--you dictate to them.
No problem players

If you promote winning hard work and high character your franchise should be a winning franchise--in any facet.
We dont promote winning--we promote entertainment.
The hiring of Isiah Thomas as the Liberty President is a disgrace and if it goes through the shame on the women who allowed it and worse shame on the idiots who forced it on them--the man who creates poor culture for the Knickd--Dolan. He doesn't mess with the Rangers and the Rangers are turning into the team in the NHL.

RIP Crushalot😞
WaltLongmire
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5/18/2015  4:01 PM
RicanHavok wrote:I think it has more to do with continuity or lackthereof than anything else. Shump & Timmy jr went through coaching & system changes. (imho Woodson did more bad than good for Shump. Constantly yanking him in and out of different lineups, using him at SF when he was still learning his position/role) I think if Gallo can continue to grow in the same system it will only benefit him.

^^I would lean in this direction, too.^^

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
nixluva
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5/18/2015  4:32 PM
IMO this regime has nothing to do with the previous one. You can't really make comparisons over different management groups. Phil and his team is nothing like the previous groups. We can only really look at what happens with the young developmental players we have under this regime. Phil liked Shump but didn't draft or sign him. He seems to be willing to give THJ one more chance to develop. Of course he could also be talking him up for a trade. They have some D League prospects and that kid Labeyrie stashed. It's going to be interesting to see how those players figure into things as well as the other young prospects we had with the big team this year. How many come back next year will be very interesting to see as well as what new prospects are brought in along with our top pick.

Cleanthony Early
Thanasis Antetekounmpo
Langston Galloway
Shane Larkin
Quincy Acy
Travis Wear
Ricky Ledo
Nalod
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5/18/2015  4:36 PM
The cultural revolution hopefully addresses this issue and going forward a commitment to drafting and cultivating talent. Even if stashing in europe.
Of course the first thing is STOP TRADING PICKS!

The other thing is have a plan to draft certain type of players.
Moonangie
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5/18/2015  4:44 PM
Nalod wrote:The cultural revolution hopefully addresses this issue and going forward a commitment to drafting and cultivating talent. Even if stashing in europe.
Of course the first thing is STOP TRADING PICKS!

The other thing is have a plan to draft certain type of players.

And let's not forget Dolan keeping his filthy opinions out of the picture from now on.
VCoug
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5/18/2015  4:51 PM
It's because being named to the All-Rookie team is meaningless. With the influx of underclassmen and Euro players, many rookies need more time to develop than they did 20 years ago. Because of this, it's very difficult to fill 10 spots with good players so the voters end up having to grasp at straws to put together a 1st and 2nd team.
Now the joy of my world is in Zion How beautiful if nothing more Than to wait at Zion's door I've never been in love like this before Now let me pray to keep you from The perils that will surely come
Moonangie
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5/18/2015  6:57 PM
Nalod wrote:The cultural revolution hopefully addresses this issue and going forward a commitment to drafting and cultivating talent. Even if stashing in europe.
Of course the first thing is STOP TRADING PICKS!

The other thing is have a plan to draft certain type of players.

And let's not forget Dolan keeping his filthy opinions out of the picture from now on.
JamesLin
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5/18/2015  7:10 PM
Young players generally deteriorate fast when a team's leader, coach and organization sucks. It's the spirit mentality that they cannot handle, no matter how promising they are. They need the winning mentality to strive and guess what, our team is nowhere near that.. not even close.
Get busy living or get busy dying. ---- Andy Dufresne
JamesLin
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5/18/2015  7:16 PM
Moonangie wrote:And let's not forget Dolan keeping his filthy opinions out of the picture from now on.

Amen

Get busy living or get busy dying. ---- Andy Dufresne
CrushAlot
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5/18/2015  7:16 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
RicanHavok wrote:I think it has more to do with continuity or lackthereof than anything else. Shump & Timmy jr went through coaching & system changes. (imho Woodson did more bad than good for Shump. Constantly yanking him in and out of different lineups, using him at SF when he was still learning his position/role) I think if Gallo can continue to grow in the same system it will only benefit him.

^^I would lean in this direction, too.^^

This. Also, as Nix said it is a new regime and this past year a lot of young guys were brought in. There is a d league team now and they will be running the same system as the Knicks. Early was sent down to get minutes and work his way back from injury. Galloway is the only undrafted guy on either of the all rookie teams.
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Nalod
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5/18/2015  11:43 PM
Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!
fishmike
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5/19/2015  8:51 AM
Nalod wrote:Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!

agree... if this isnt evidence what else can you ask for?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Knixkik
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5/19/2015  9:11 AM
Nalod wrote:Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!


We have had 4 players named all rookie in the past 5 years. It changes when we help that player take the next step. That was the whole point of the thread.
Nalod
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5/19/2015  11:27 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Nalod wrote:Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!


We have had 4 players named all rookie in the past 5 years. It changes when we help that player take the next step. That was the whole point of the thread.

We? what can I do? I want to help!
fishmike
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5/19/2015  12:01 PM
Knixkik wrote:
Nalod wrote:Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!


We have had 4 players named all rookie in the past 5 years. It changes when we help that player take the next step. That was the whole point of the thread.
which one of those players do you think the Knicks failed to groom to the next level???
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Knixkik
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5/19/2015  12:18 PM
fishmike wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Nalod wrote:Langston named to 2nd team all rookie! 1st knick to go undraftedd to be named.
Since we trade them, its no surprise.

Not a franchise defining moment but "Thats the main thing that needs to change"......

dude, its changing!


We have had 4 players named all rookie in the past 5 years. It changes when we help that player take the next step. That was the whole point of the thread.
which one of those players do you think the Knicks failed to groom to the next level???

Well Fields, Shumpert, and Hardaway all performed their best on the offensive end in their rookie seasons. There are always exceptions, but that generally shouldn't happen. Players should improve from their rookie years.
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