BRIGGS wrote:

meloanyk wrote:He is everything that I expected. Given expectations, no high praise or heavy criticism. A role player who was overpaid in FA like most but he contributes in what he does

14.5mm per?

13.5

newyorknewyork wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:I can see Paul Gasol opting out with the Bulls after this season. Don't think he loves the offense they run. While playing for a contender is his preference after LA and maybe Bulls with the new coach. He may opt for a style he thrived at since we are in a better situation.

you think that he will thrive here without a kobe?

Sarcasm meter is ringing

no seriously. we have nobody who can break down an offense and make the triangle and a guy like gasol look good.

Gasol was a pretty damn good player before he ever played for LA. He was a stud last yr as well with the Bulls. Look at the role Seraphin or Lopez play and then replace them with Gasol.

He was good in Memphis but no where near how good he was with Kobe.

His shot selection this year is weird. It almost as if they are trying to extend him slowly to beyond the arc.

Well he was in the prime of his career, playing with one of the best players in the NBA, with one of the best coaches of all time in a system tailor made for his skill set.

I don't expect him to duplicate what he did in LA. But he would do well here. Giving us 3 7fters with one unique one capable of stretching the paint out and guarding perimeter players well off the switches and picks.

can't argue that he would be a valuable player for us. Just may not be able to realize his true value here. Phil tried to get him and failed. How would we get him now and how much would it cost? Probably way too much.

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:our guards are killing lopez's value. He needs to clean sh1t up and there is nothing being created for him to do his sh1t.

he is a very good player who has not changed and who is healthy that is being horribly appropriated.

he is however making a big difference in KP's development but not sure if some of you can grasp this.

No they can't. There's a lot of people that think they have all this basketball knowledge but they really don't and they're the people that i like to call stat watchers. Stats are what they use to determine how good or bad a player is but there's sooooo much more to being a professional basketball player then just the stats you put up. Rolo is doing what he was brought in to do but the stat watchers don't like his stats so they think he's no good. hahaha

who are these stat watchers that you speak of?

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:our guards are killing lopez's value. He needs to clean sh1t up and there is nothing being created for him to do his sh1t.

he is a very good player who has not changed and who is healthy that is being horribly appropriated.

he is however making a big difference in KP's development but not sure if some of you can grasp this.

No they can't. There's a lot of people that think they have all this basketball knowledge but they really don't and they're the people that i like to call stat watchers. Stats are what they use to determine how good or bad a player is but there's sooooo much more to being a professional basketball player then just the stats you put up. Rolo is doing what he was brought in to do but the stat watchers don't like his stats so they think he's no good. hahaha

who are these stat watchers that you speak of?

I don't need to name names cause i don't really pay attention to exactly who it is but whoever uses stats as the only way to say if a player is good or bad is a stat watcher and Rolo does so much more then put up stats. I've seen him soooo many times box out his man or men and let another of his teammates grab the rebound that he easily could have got but he would rather hold a guy or two back from getting it while boxing out and letting one of his teammates get it instead of going for it himself.

you are preaching to the choir with rolo. I am a huge rolo supporter for both his intangibles and his consistent efficiency. His efficiency is way down which is a bit alarming to some of us. We can all see that something is diff this year. Is it an injury? The system (my take)? The Personnel? A bit of each? Something is pulling down his play from previous years though he is still helping the team with non-box-score intangibles.

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:our guards are killing lopez's value. He needs to clean sh1t up and there is nothing being created for him to do his sh1t.

he is a very good player who has not changed and who is healthy that is being horribly appropriated.

he is however making a big difference in KP's development but not sure if some of you can grasp this.

No they can't. There's a lot of people that think they have all this basketball knowledge but they really don't and they're the people that i like to call stat watchers. Stats are what they use to determine how good or bad a player is but there's sooooo much more to being a professional basketball player then just the stats you put up. Rolo is doing what he was brought in to do but the stat watchers don't like his stats so they think he's no good. hahaha

who are these stat watchers that you speak of?

I don't need to name names cause i don't really pay attention to exactly who it is but whoever uses stats as the only way to say if a player is good or bad is a stat watcher and Rolo does so much more then put up stats. I've seen him soooo many times box out his man or men and let another of his teammates grab the rebound that he easily could have got but he would rather hold a guy or two back from getting it while boxing out and letting one of his teammates get it instead of going for it himself.

you are preaching to the choir with rolo. I am a huge rolo supporter for both his intangibles and his consistent efficiency. His efficiency is way down which is a bit alarming to some of us. We can all see that something is diff this year. Is it an injury? The system (my take)? The Personnel? A bit of each? Something is pulling down his play from previous years though he is still helping the team with non-box-score intangibles.

And a lot of this can be quantified too. There were posts about how much better KP's rebounding is with Lopez on the floor. I'm guessing Lopez is why Melo's rebounding is better this year too. But yeah, the offensive efficiency decline is worrisome with Lopez. His FG% over the past 2 years is 55% and it's 44% this year. The difference is obvious in the advanced stats too. That said, if he doesn't get his offense better, then he is only a marginal NBA starter. Right now, the poor offense is just an aberration for him though.

bonn take a look at my other thread regarding a drop in efficiency for all our bigs last year and this year. Really strange and makes you think that this system is a problem (for now)

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:our guards are killing lopez's value. He needs to clean sh1t up and there is nothing being created for him to do his sh1t.

he is a very good player who has not changed and who is healthy that is being horribly appropriated.

he is however making a big difference in KP's development but not sure if some of you can grasp this.

No they can't. There's a lot of people that think they have all this basketball knowledge but they really don't and they're the people that i like to call stat watchers. Stats are what they use to determine how good or bad a player is but there's sooooo much more to being a professional basketball player then just the stats you put up. Rolo is doing what he was brought in to do but the stat watchers don't like his stats so they think he's no good. hahaha

who are these stat watchers that you speak of?

I don't need to name names cause i don't really pay attention to exactly who it is but whoever uses stats as the only way to say if a player is good or bad is a stat watcher and Rolo does so much more then put up stats. I've seen him soooo many times box out his man or men and let another of his teammates grab the rebound that he easily could have got but he would rather hold a guy or two back from getting it while boxing out and letting one of his teammates get it instead of going for it himself.

you are preaching to the choir with rolo. I am a huge rolo supporter for both his intangibles and his consistent efficiency. His efficiency is way down which is a bit alarming to some of us. We can all see that something is diff this year. Is it an injury? The system (my take)? The Personnel? A bit of each? Something is pulling down his play from previous years though he is still helping the team with non-box-score intangibles.

And a lot of this can be quantified too. There were posts about how much better KP's rebounding is with Lopez on the floor. I'm guessing Lopez is why Melo's rebounding is better this year too. But yeah, the offensive efficiency decline is worrisome with Lopez. His FG% over the past 2 years is 55% and it's 44% this year. The difference is obvious in the advanced stats too. That said, if he doesn't get his offense better, then he is only a marginal NBA starter. Right now, the poor offense is just an aberration for him though.

bonn take a look at my other thread regarding a drop in efficiency for all our bigs last year and this year. Really strange and makes you think that this system is a problem (for now)

Yeah, I saw that. Good info. It's worrisome. I still would expect Lopez to get closer to his career #s even if there is a dip.

looks like the long learning curve for a team running or trying to run the triangle really takes a huge efficiency hit on bigs.

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

mreinman wrote:our guards are killing lopez's value. He needs to clean sh1t up and there is nothing being created for him to do his sh1t.

he is a very good player who has not changed and who is healthy that is being horribly appropriated.

he is however making a big difference in KP's development but not sure if some of you can grasp this.

No they can't. There's a lot of people that think they have all this basketball knowledge but they really don't and they're the people that i like to call stat watchers. Stats are what they use to determine how good or bad a player is but there's sooooo much more to being a professional basketball player then just the stats you put up. Rolo is doing what he was brought in to do but the stat watchers don't like his stats so they think he's no good. hahaha

who are these stat watchers that you speak of?

I don't need to name names cause i don't really pay attention to exactly who it is but whoever uses stats as the only way to say if a player is good or bad is a stat watcher and Rolo does so much more then put up stats. I've seen him soooo many times box out his man or men and let another of his teammates grab the rebound that he easily could have got but he would rather hold a guy or two back from getting it while boxing out and letting one of his teammates get it instead of going for it himself.

you are preaching to the choir with rolo. I am a huge rolo supporter for both his intangibles and his consistent efficiency. His efficiency is way down which is a bit alarming to some of us. We can all see that something is diff this year. Is it an injury? The system (my take)? The Personnel? A bit of each? Something is pulling down his play from previous years though he is still helping the team with non-box-score intangibles.

And a lot of this can be quantified too. There were posts about how much better KP's rebounding is with Lopez on the floor. I'm guessing Lopez is why Melo's rebounding is better this year too. But yeah, the offensive efficiency decline is worrisome with Lopez. His FG% over the past 2 years is 55% and it's 44% this year. The difference is obvious in the advanced stats too. That said, if he doesn't get his offense better, then he is only a marginal NBA starter. Right now, the poor offense is just an aberration for him though.

bonn take a look at my other thread regarding a drop in efficiency for all our bigs last year and this year. Really strange and makes you think that this system is a problem (for now)

Yeah, I saw that. Good info. It's worrisome. I still would expect Lopez to get closer to his career #s even if there is a dip.

looks like the long learning curve for a team running or trying to run the triangle really takes a huge efficiency hit on bigs.

"Learning curve" makes it sound like the players would eventually return to normal or even exceed their career averages. Hopefully that's the case.

right but it may take lots of time. I read somewhere that it takes 2 years for smart players to learn the triangle.

BRIGGS wrote:This guy has been a 14.5 mm disappointment. I really believe we'd be much better with Monroe.

Lopez owned Monroe in the last meeting. You're going to see games where one gets the better of the other, just like most matchups in this league.

No denying that its been ugly out there at times with Lopez, but I cant disagree more strongly that we dont need him patroling the paint. We get some consistent scoring from the PG position and this team will be in very good shape.

I cant remember which stat/article indicated Lopez and KP were a borderline elite defensive tandem, but you dont need stats to see that they're exactly what we need defensively in the playoffs. Cant go anywhere in the playoffs without a strong defensive frontline.