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has anyone heard of this (from nypost)
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TMS
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6/24/2004  11:04 AM
nah, i'd rather keep the pick & go after a young talent like Araujo or Smith...shedding Shandon's contract doesn't bring this team under the cap anyway.
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newyorknewyork
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6/24/2004  11:43 AM
But it would give the team more room and flexability. With Anderson & Norris off the books. The only long term contracts we would have would be Marbury & Houston. And u could probably land the same potential in the 20s as u would with #12 in this draft.
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TMS
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6/24/2004  11:45 AM
i don't think you could...what guy like Araujo or Josh Smith can you get in the 20s?
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newyorknewyork
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6/24/2004  11:56 AM
JR Smith, Dornell Wright, David Harrison, Kevin Martin, Anderson Varjeo, A.Vujacic, Sebastion Telfair, Jaime Lloreda, Ales Chan, Ha-Seung Jin.


There might be others who slip & some of these who go higher so its hard to tell who will be there in the 20s. Id prefer to Unload Anderson & Norris and draft a Kevin Martin or Harrison or Ales Chan or Telfair as trade bait.

From Smith to Arajuo to Telfair all the players in between have just as much potental to be allstar calibre players.
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VDesai
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6/24/2004  12:09 PM
Isiah doesnt want a project, he wants someone who can help right away. He's said this numerous times. The only way to get a quick contributor in this draft is to be in the lottery...
TMS
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6/24/2004  12:12 PM
i think Araujo or Josh Smith would be the perfect types for Isiah to bring in...Telfair is not needed (plus many experts are saying he's overrated) & i don't see Isiah taking a flyer on Ha either...i have no idea about those other guys you listed, but i've heard some good things about Harrison & Varejao.

anyway, whether you trade the pick & move down or keep it & take the best prospect available, it gives us options...it's too much of a no-brainer, so like you said in another thread, there has to be more to this than is being reported if the rumor is true to begin with...i'm not sure i'd give up Frank Williams w/KT for the #12 pick for instance.
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Andrew
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6/24/2004  12:13 PM
Posted by VDesai:

Isiah doesnt want a project, he wants someone who can help right away. He's said this numerous times. The only way to get a quick contributor in this draft is to be in the lottery...

I'd disagree with that. Most guys in the lottery are young and getting drafted on potential. Alot of college seniors will drop to the later portion of the draft and be able to contribute much quicker to a team, but have smaller upsides than the HS players.
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VDesai
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6/24/2004  12:24 PM
Posted by Andrew:
Posted by VDesai:

Isiah doesnt want a project, he wants someone who can help right away. He's said this numerous times. The only way to get a quick contributor in this draft is to be in the lottery...

I'd disagree with that. Most guys in the lottery are young and getting drafted on potential. Alot of college seniors will drop to the later portion of the draft and be able to contribute much quicker to a team, but have smaller upsides than the HS players.

A lot of good seniors are gonna go late and might be able to contribute, but they are less talented and the probablilty of a lot of them being a player isnt that high. Besides we can get a solid senior like Tim Pickett or Romain Sato with the 2nd rounder. The true impact college players in this draft are gonna go lottery level: Okafor, Devin Harris, Gordon, Arajuo, Jackson, Snyder, Igodoula, Childress, Deng etc. Maybe one slips but you can't bank on trading from 12 to the 20's (which is what was suggested) to get one. IMO if you trade all the down to the late 20's and want to take a solid senior who can play a role, you might just as well wait till our 2nd round pick. IMO there is little difference between a Tony Allen, Emmett, Sato, Pickett etc.
VDesai
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6/24/2004  2:49 PM
Someone just told me Seattle radio was saying this is very close. It would be Kurt Thomas and Frank Williams for Jerome James, Flip Murray, Reggie Evans and the no.12 pick, and apparently we want Telfair with the 12th pick.

He had no link so I don't know if this is reliable. I thought I'd pass it on.
Andrew
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6/24/2004  2:51 PM
Posted by VDesai:

...and apparently we want Telfair with the 12th pick.

And that should throw up flags of doubt. Even if we wanted Telfair, we shouldn't be taking him with the 12th when he shoujld go no higher than 20.
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VDesai
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6/24/2004  2:55 PM
If we're giving up Frank it makes some sense. I don't doubt Telfair is overrated by us because he's Marbury's cousin, is from NYC, and because Isiah like PG's. I think he could very easily take him at 12, though I dont believe its the right move. Keep in mind Portland wants him, and may take him at 13 because they are not sure if he will fall to 22.
Chico
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6/24/2004  2:58 PM
We're obviously not going to take telfair with the 12th pick.
1) he's projected way below 12

2) we need swingmen and athletic bigmen, not another point guard...we have 3 and charlie ward is ours for the taking if we want him

3) most importantly: he and stephon hate each other. They don't even speak.

As to the original post, The first trade is awesome. the second trade (flip and frank included) is just good. i'd still do both.
s3231
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6/24/2004  2:58 PM
Posted by Andrew:
Posted by VDesai:

...and apparently we want Telfair with the 12th pick.

And that should throw up flags of doubt. Even if we wanted Telfair, we shouldn't be taking him with the 12th when he shoujld go no higher than 20.










I agree, even if we wanted Telfair we definitely wouldn't get the 12th pick to get him there when he will drop in the low 20s. If we get the 12th pick I would imagine that we would take either Snyder, Josh Smith, or Araujo.
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TMS
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6/24/2004  3:03 PM
Posted by VDesai:

Someone just told me Seattle radio was saying this is very close. It would be Kurt Thomas and Frank Williams for Jerome James, Flip Murray, Reggie Evans and the no.12 pick, and apparently we want Telfair with the 12th pick.

He had no link so I don't know if this is reliable. I thought I'd pass it on.

that's an even bigger no brainer than the 1st rumor involving only KT, James & the pick...where are these rumors coming from?
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VDesai
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6/24/2004  3:09 PM
The guy who told me this said Seattle radio. There's no link here, so really take this with a grain of salt. The Telfair thing was what he told me too. I know it doesnt make a ton of sense, but I figured I'd pass what I heard. Obviously there is something to this as the NY-Seattle talks were mentioned by Vecsey in today's POST.
TMS
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6/24/2004  3:12 PM
i appreciate you relaying the info...i just don't understand how these rumors pop up when they seem to 1 sided in our favor.
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simrud
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6/24/2004  3:49 PM
The 2nd trade is awesome.

We basically swap FW for Flip which makes so much more sense for us. Flip is a combo guard who can flatout score, he averaged like 20+ pts a game before Ray Allen came back. FW has potential too, but for us, we need a guy that can play a lot of 2 and Flip is perfect for that.

Jerome James is a solid C, especially in the East and if he gets in any kind of shape. I like Evans a lot, he is a hussle big who plays great D and rebounds like a beast, a pure energy guy. Having him as a backup is great, he would provide instant spark of the bench.

And selecting Telfair with 12 would make sense if we turn around and swing a deal with Portalnd who are in love with him as part of a deal that would bring Reef to town.

So this is def a plausible deal, the only questoin being, is this too good to be true?
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
VDesai
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6/24/2004  3:59 PM
simrud...I hadn't thought about how we could send Telfair to Portland. James, Evans and Flip are all expring deals and that gives us more ammo to use to get someone like Reef. I dont know if Portland is the team that wants all that cap space, but maybe we could work out some kind of 3 team deal.
VDesai
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6/24/2004  4:13 PM
If this was also somehow true the Knicks would have enough assets to grab Erick Dampier in a sign and trade.
TMS
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6/24/2004  4:21 PM
assuming Frank Williams may be involved in this deal if KT is actually someone the Sonics are interested in trading for, what do you guys think about signing someone like Keyon Dooling w/the LLE to be the backup PG? he's young, very athletic, & has potential...but he has bad shot selection & isn't really a good orchestrator...but i think Isiah & Lenny could work w/him...Dooling will probably not be tendered a contract & become a free agent once the Clippers take either Livingston or Gordon in the draft tonight.

that way, you could use the pick you get from the KT deal to take a young swingman w/big upside like Smith or a more NBA ready bigman prospect like Araujo.
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