All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

fishmike wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I constantly read about how overrated guys are also, but folks dont want to post who they believe in. Just the phantom two-way highly eff% player with great advanced stats, willing to leave money on the table and when interviewed wont ever say anything stupid.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

I've never been a fan of Tim Jr either- even when he was playing well, he just didn't click with me. I think JR Smith will be gone Dec 15th- seems like Phil is on a mission to vanquish him. I like him, but he doesn't fit in with what we're trying to do. Just hope we can don't take on any more salary.

Knicks1969 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

fishmike wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I constantly read about how overrated guys are also, but folks dont want to post who they believe in. Just the phantom two-way highly eff% player with great advanced stats, willing to leave money on the table and when interviewed wont ever say anything stupid.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

I've never been a fan of Tim Jr either- even when he was playing well, he just didn't click with me. I think JR Smith will be gone Dec 15th- seems like Phil is on a mission to vanquish him. I like him, but he doesn't fit in with what we're trying to do. Just hope we can don't take on any more salary.

Did you say that you always like JR Smith, but never cared for THJ? Really?

why not? JR smith is a special talent with a Steve Francis future. Really sad.

THJ has a pedigree and has not proven that he even has game.

bench:

Greek
JR (I know ... crazy)
Cole (fat chance)
Wear
Euro find
Early
Stiff

Lets do it. Mix of One way and 1.5's.

Knicks1969 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

fishmike wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I constantly read about how overrated guys are also, but folks dont want to post who they believe in. Just the phantom two-way highly eff% player with great advanced stats, willing to leave money on the table and when interviewed wont ever say anything stupid.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

I've never been a fan of Tim Jr either- even when he was playing well, he just didn't click with me. I think JR Smith will be gone Dec 15th- seems like Phil is on a mission to vanquish him. I like him, but he doesn't fit in with what we're trying to do. Just hope we can don't take on any more salary.

Did you say that you always like JR Smith, but never cared for THJ? Really?

Yep- some players you like, some you don't, it's not always about stats or advanced stats. JRs off the court stuff doesn't bother me, it's pretty light weight stuff that gets blown out of proportion. He was good for us during the 54 win season- in fact he was instrumental. A shame he only managed to put it all together for a few weeks or months. Since then, the bad performances have outweighed the good. I think he could be a good contributor as sixth man on a team packed with veteran leadership, but that ain't going to be here.

fishmike wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I constantly read about how overrated guys are also, but folks dont want to post who they believe in. Just the phantom two-way highly eff% player with great advanced stats, willing to leave money on the table and when interviewed wont ever say anything stupid.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

Great post, completely agree. Everyone wants some imaginary player (especially one who will leave money on the table.)

When i think of this team moving forward, i think Melo and Calderon are the only starters to stay long-term (Shumpert was possible, but will price himself out of the market most likely.) Next year we will likely see 3 new starters at the SG, PF, and center. I like Acy, Wear, THjr, Prigioni, and Early off the bench as they are cheap and have upside to be good role players. Hopefully we can trade JR and free up enough room for 1 max player and 1 almost max player. 2-way players i see available are Gasol (probably unlikely), Millsap (good all-around player, much more likely), Greg Monroe, Reggie Jackson, Aaron Afflalo, Wes Matthews, and Gordan Dragic. I am really hoping for 2 players out of that group. And of course getting a young prospect in the middle of the lottery, where we are likely to fall. We should be able to add 2 starters via free agency and 1 future starter via draft and turn into a good team very quickly.

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

I constantly read about how overrated guys are also, but folks dont want to post who they believe in. Just the phantom two-way highly eff% player with great advanced stats, willing to leave money on the table and when interviewed wont ever say anything stupid.

I thought they would try to compete this year. It pretty clear a tank and purge is in the works. I think its a simple formula right now:
Calderon: stop gap floor general, possibly stays around in shooter role as he gets older (stays)
Melo: elite scorer (stays)
Early: warm body (stays)
Wear: warm body (stays)
THjr: Never thought he was as good as others here, but his future here is his to earn I believe
Shump: Might be the dumbest player on the roster (he prices himself gone)

Goodbye: Amare, Sammy, Jason Smith, Prigs, Larkin, Bargs

On the (wrong side) fence:
JR: his contract might keep him here if we cant find a deal. I could also see him being a Fisher/Phil pet project

Basically this team is Melo a few unwanted contracts in Calderon and Smith and three bit players. Philidelphia is in better position going 4wrd than us.

Next year they will likely have Embiid Noel MCW Saric K J Mcdaniels Tony Wroten and a top 3 pick added to their roster with maximum cap space for two max guys.

Yeah that's great if u are playing Kentucky tomorrow..But you are coming up against OKC, Spurs and Cleveland..

They need a 2 guard that can shoot 3s and play good defense. I also think they need some back bigs that rebound,score, and plays d. A starting quality center would help the cause too.

I would like to keep Calderon but I would trade him at the right price. I think he has value to a competing team that needs shooting, passing, and a veteran presence that can play on the ball or off.

dribble drivers - Dragic, Jackson, Lin(highly unlikely but his price will probably be back up level),

3pt/D guards or wings- Jimmy Butler(Extremely unlikely unless Chicago is dumb), Wes Matthews jr, Danny Green, Gerald Green

Back up bigs - Brandan Wright, Ed Davis, Brandon Bass,

Cs- R. Lopez, Omer Asik, Enes Kanter

Splat wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:There really is not much to talk about with the way the season has been going for the knicks so the only relevant topic is how to improve the team going forward. What are some of the similarities between the good/great teams that have competed for championships over the years and how can the Knicks build a roster similar within the framework of their systematic beliefs and Cap space. What we know is that Carmelo has a no trade clause so any ideas/suggestions of trading him would be silly but everyone else is probably on the trade table.

All over this board I see post for two way players but who exactly is considered a two way player? Will these 2way players be available in FA or had through a trade. I would like to get into creating categories of players and maybe even sub-categories within position: Rebounders, drivers, shooters, Bigs, wings, ball handlers, low usg/high usg players, and etc.

The knicks do have a draft pick this year so that is another piece to puzzle to figure out.

Talent on defense is not required. Willingness to play it is. When people say the league has few 2-way players, there is no reply to such a comment since it is the org's job to recruit willing and able defenders. There is no excuse. If the org is committed and builds the right culture eventually the majority of the roster will play defense willingly and TOGETHER while still having their other various skill sets.

I don't think it requires sub-categories at all. It is a driven by the franchise's imperatives to find and develop coachable players, something that has not been a priority here for 15 years.

They found Wear. One itty bitty player, but you keep looking for guys who are teachable.

And you don't sign any more Amare and Melo types. Having Melo is plenty in the dumb star category.

Dude, I disagree. You have to have both (talent and willingness)