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ESPN picks Knicks to finish 37-45 and #10 in the east
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Silverfuel
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8/12/2014  8:41 AM
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11334160/2014-summer-forecast-east-standings

10

New York Knicks* 37 45 .451 37 45 .451
@NYKnicksPodcast: Come on, losing Felton and Woodson should result in at least a 5-game improvement.

@m_shantz: I'm really excited to re-watch the 2012-2013 Toronto #Raptors (34-48), Calderon, Bargnani, Acy, and Melo as Rudy Gay.


We will make the playoffs but I'm not sure what the record will be this season.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
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Silverfuel
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8/12/2014  8:47 AM
One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Bonn1997
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8/12/2014  8:48 AM
Silverfuel wrote:One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.


Interesting. I thought this thread was based on SCHOENE predictions but it looks like it's just a survey of ESPN writers. The 48 prediction above should rule out any claims that they are just Knicks haters.
Bonn1997
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8/12/2014  8:52 AM
Both the comments below the prediction are silly. On the critical side, you can't assume replacing one of coaches with the best winning % in our organization with a rookie will have a positive impact. Coaching changes rarely matter anyway.
On the optimistic side, although I'm critical of Melo he's way better than Rudy Gay.
fishmike
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8/12/2014  8:52 AM
Silverfuel wrote:One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.

they are not only wrong but they are waaaaaay wrong. But good job on the Raptors, Knicks, Cha, Dallas, Portland, Suns...

They are ok at predicting the predictable. The elite teams and the bottom dwellers. These teams that could go either way they totally whiffed on.

Its good. It will give the folks around here who hate the team something to feel warm and fuzzy about for the next few months. Im happy for them.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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8/12/2014  8:54 AM
Silverfuel wrote:There are no big teams in the east after Cleveland and Chicago. We can make the 5th seed if Melo, Amare + JR are healthy all season. Would love to see the haters at ESPN eat crow.

Haters? You just said they predicted 48 wins last year. Maybe they're Knicks lovers!
Silverfuel
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8/12/2014  8:54 AM
fishmike wrote:
Silverfuel wrote:One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.

they are not only wrong but they are waaaaaay wrong. But good job on the Raptors, Knicks, Cha, Dallas, Portland, Suns...

They are ok at predicting the predictable. The elite teams and the bottom dwellers. These teams that could go either way they totally whiffed on.

Its good. It will give the folks around here who hate the team something to feel warm and fuzzy about for the next few months. Im happy for them.


There are no dominant teams in the east after Cleveland and maybe Chicago is Rose is around. We can make the 5th seed if Melo, Amare + JR are healthy all season. Would love to see the haters at ESPN eat crow.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
fishmike
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8/12/2014  9:02 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/12/2014  9:04 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:Both the comments below the prediction are silly. On the critical side, you can't assume replacing one of coaches with the best winning % in our organization with a rookie will have a positive impact. Coaching changes rarely matter anyway.
On the optimistic side, although I'm critical of Melo he's way better than Rudy Gay.
3 times Phil has coached in the NBA.

Bulls:
Collins 47 wins
Phil: 55 wins

Lakers:
Dell Harris: 50 wins (adjusted)
Phil: 67 wins

Lakers 2nd time:
Rudy T: 34 wins
Phil: 45 wins

Im going to guess the sampling size is too small for your taste but every time Phil has taken over as a coach the team has won significantly more than the year before. This time he's not coaching but running the whole show and putting every piece in place.

Im sure you will dismiss this, but most fans of the team are looking forward to this transition under this person with a great rate of success and a great history of simply getting more from players who were already established.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Silverfuel
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8/12/2014  9:02 AM
Also, Kyle Lowry was awesome but it was his contract year. He is an awesome player but we have seen players have huge seasons when they are playing for a contract. Not completely sold on Raptors winning the division.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
newyorknewyork
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8/12/2014  9:04 AM
Looking over the roster.

We could have 4 good scoring options (not in any order meaning Amare could replace Hardaway jr) in Melo(24), Jr(16), Hardaway jr(12), Calderon(11). Amare could be a 5th scoring option(12-14).

Bargnani or Amare have to be the odd man out(most likely Bargnani). Around those 4-5 scoring options the rest of the players need to excel at the dirty work in order to keep the balance. Bargnani hurts the balance with guys like Hardaway jr & Amare already able to do some scoring. If Bargnani becomes a scoring option that just means Hardaway jr or Amare would need to do the dirty work which also isn't there game.

We should not force Bargnani or Amare into the rotation. One of them has to receive DNPs unless/until someone gets injured.

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
fishmike
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8/12/2014  9:13 AM
Silverfuel wrote:Also, Kyle Lowry was awesome but it was his contract year. He is an awesome player but we have seen players have huge seasons when they are playing for a contract. Not completely sold on Raptors winning the division.
I dont really have a problem with ESPN picking the same win total as last year. Doesnt show much thought, but fine. Knicks need to go earn it, and play like they are trying to earn it. Im confident they will do that, but the season hasnt started yet so just going status quo is fine.

I like the comment on the Heat... "Curious to see Bosh, Wade & Deng together. Crazy to think those 3 alone can't get more than 45 wins in weak East"

Are they not aware that Deng/Wade missed 50+ games last year?

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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8/12/2014  9:16 AM
newyorknewyork wrote:Looking over the roster.

We could have 4 good scoring options (not in any order meaning Amare could replace Hardaway jr) in Melo(24), Jr(16), Hardaway jr(12), Calderon(11). Amare could be a 5th scoring option(12-14).

Bargnani or Amare have to be the odd man out(most likely Bargnani). Around those 4-5 scoring options the rest of the players need to excel at the dirty work in order to keep the balance. Bargnani hurts the balance with guys like Hardaway jr & Amare already able to do some scoring. If Bargnani becomes a scoring option that just means Hardaway jr or Amare would need to do the dirty work which also isn't there game.

We should not force Bargnani or Amare into the rotation. One of them has to receive DNPs unless/until someone gets injured.

Just earn it... Amare was probably the main reason we finished 16-5 last year. I know Phil said Bargs would suprise some but I dont see his skill set fitting in with the rest of the players. Time will tell...
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
F500ONE
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8/12/2014  9:17 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:Sounds a little harsh but they have a good track record with predictions. I was thinking closer to 40 wins.

Actually 3gm difference from where you're picking isn't harsh at all.

I'm probably am being harsh I have them winning 34


If we catch some breaks in games we could peak at 40wins.

I highly doubt we crack above 40


I think ESPN is spot on.

If you take the East and league as a whole the majority got equally if not more so better


The proof will be in the pudding

fishmike
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8/12/2014  9:20 AM
Nets are poised to have an epic collapse. Oh wait.. they have Deron Williams and Brook Lopez, never mind.

I would take anyone's money who wants to bet... Amare will play more games, more minutes and have more PPG and rebounds than Brook Lopez. Unless Brook puts up 25/12 in the two weeks he plays before he breaks more bones in his feet.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
F500ONE
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8/12/2014  9:21 AM
I think these predictions change next year if Phil makes 2015 count.

Assuming this is the year of noticeable change

Bonn1997
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8/12/2014  10:00 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/12/2014  10:03 AM
fishmike wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:Both the comments below the prediction are silly. On the critical side, you can't assume replacing one of coaches with the best winning % in our organization with a rookie will have a positive impact. Coaching changes rarely matter anyway.
On the optimistic side, although I'm critical of Melo he's way better than Rudy Gay.
3 times Phil has coached in the NBA.

Bulls:
Collins 47 wins
Phil: 55 wins

Lakers:
Dell Harris: 50 wins (adjusted)
Phil: 67 wins

Lakers 2nd time:
Rudy T: 34 wins
Phil: 45 wins

Im going to guess the sampling size is too small for your taste but every time Phil has taken over as a coach the team has won significantly more than the year before. This time he's not coaching but running the whole show and putting every piece in place.

Im sure you will dismiss this, but most fans of the team are looking forward to this transition under this person with a great rate of success and a great history of simply getting more from players who were already established.


Phil is actually one of the rare coaches who has made a statistically large difference on his teams. I've posted data on the impact of coaches before and Phil is one of the very few who actually added more wins than expected to his teams' records. You might be better off not assuming you know my view since you're usually wrong when you do. Coaching has very little to do with GMing though.
Knixkik
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8/12/2014  10:26 AM
Silverfuel wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Silverfuel wrote:One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.

they are not only wrong but they are waaaaaay wrong. But good job on the Raptors, Knicks, Cha, Dallas, Portland, Suns...

They are ok at predicting the predictable. The elite teams and the bottom dwellers. These teams that could go either way they totally whiffed on.

Its good. It will give the folks around here who hate the team something to feel warm and fuzzy about for the next few months. Im happy for them.


There are no dominant teams in the east after Cleveland and maybe Chicago is Rose is around. We can make the 5th seed if Melo, Amare + JR are healthy all season. Would love to see the haters at ESPN eat crow.

I still think we can win the atlantic. No one is really good in the atlantic. Toronto is the clear-cut favorite, and nothing special about them.

fishmike
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8/12/2014  10:55 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/12/2014  10:56 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:Both the comments below the prediction are silly. On the critical side, you can't assume replacing one of coaches with the best winning % in our organization with a rookie will have a positive impact. Coaching changes rarely matter anyway.
On the optimistic side, although I'm critical of Melo he's way better than Rudy Gay.
3 times Phil has coached in the NBA.

Bulls:
Collins 47 wins
Phil: 55 wins

Lakers:
Dell Harris: 50 wins (adjusted)
Phil: 67 wins

Lakers 2nd time:
Rudy T: 34 wins
Phil: 45 wins

Im going to guess the sampling size is too small for your taste but every time Phil has taken over as a coach the team has won significantly more than the year before. This time he's not coaching but running the whole show and putting every piece in place.

Im sure you will dismiss this, but most fans of the team are looking forward to this transition under this person with a great rate of success and a great history of simply getting more from players who were already established.


Phil is actually one of the rare coaches who has made a statistically large difference on his teams. I've posted data on the impact of coaches before and Phil is one of the very few who actually added more wins than expected to his teams' records. You might be better off not assuming you know my view since you're usually wrong when you do. Coaching has very little to do with GMing though.
I assume you have no view at all as you never really say anything. You sorta kinda agree with some stuff and refute lots of other stuff but rarely to never actually say anything that comes directly from you. I have to bludgeon you into offering any prediction of your own and I noticed you drop your latest win total prediction down a few to be in line with the ESPN predictions.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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8/12/2014  10:57 AM
Knixkik wrote:
Silverfuel wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Silverfuel wrote:One good thing is that they were totally wrong last year.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9559931/2013-summer-forecast-east-standings

Last year they had us winning 48 games. I'm hoping this year they are wrong and we win more games.

they are not only wrong but they are waaaaaay wrong. But good job on the Raptors, Knicks, Cha, Dallas, Portland, Suns...

They are ok at predicting the predictable. The elite teams and the bottom dwellers. These teams that could go either way they totally whiffed on.

Its good. It will give the folks around here who hate the team something to feel warm and fuzzy about for the next few months. Im happy for them.


There are no dominant teams in the east after Cleveland and maybe Chicago is Rose is around. We can make the 5th seed if Melo, Amare + JR are healthy all season. Would love to see the haters at ESPN eat crow.

I still think we can win the atlantic. No one is really good in the atlantic. Toronto is the clear-cut favorite, and nothing special about them.

they are short on high impact guys (stars) but are deep, balanced, skilled, well coached and fit well together. Yea.. they could take a step back and those weaknesses showed agains the Nets (still shoulda won that series) but they deserve to be the Atl favs
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
gunsnewing
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8/12/2014  11:27 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/12/2014  11:29 AM
1)Cavs
2)Bulls
3)Wiz
4)Heat
5)Knicks 45-37
6)Hornets
7)Hawks
8)Raptors

Knicks-Heat 1st rd what else is new!

Hopefully better in 2015/16

ESPN picks Knicks to finish 37-45 and #10 in the east

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