Bonn1997 wrote:A discount? He's still the highest paid player on the planet!
This has nothing to do with Melo hate (or at least it shouldn't). Phil and Dolan are the ones who gave him the contract.

So we should start hating Phil now? I'm sure the consensus is everyone already hates Dolan. [Even though we all realize the way consensus works here on the UK]

jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Hate? No. It's way too early for that. We can be disappointed with him for outbidding everyone by so much and throwing in a no-trade clause though.

It's all dollars and cents for you, isn't it?

What was the value of playing with DRose and today's godman Noah? What was the value of playing in a real BIG three with Harden and DHow? Finishing a career with Kobe? Or coming home to play with ...Jose Calderone?

Do you really think our resident IdiotZenBoy was just bidding against dollars?

And what irks you most about the no-trade? So Melo's a self-centered loser for talking up free agency before hand, and now Melo's a self-centered loser and Phil is a dissapointing moron because he gave Melo a no-trade clause? Got it.

Direction. Nevermind.

jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Hate? No. It's way too early for that. We can be disappointed with him for outbidding everyone by so much and throwing in a no-trade clause though.

It's all dollars and cents for you, isn't it?

What was the value of playing with DRose and today's godman Noah? What was the value of playing in a real BIG three with Harden and DHow? Finishing a career with Kobe? Or coming home to play with ...Jose Calderone?

Do you really think our resident IdiotZenBoy was just bidding against dollars?

And what irks you most about the no-trade? So Melo's a self-centered loser for talking up free agency before hand, and now Melo's a self-centered loser and Phil is a dissapointing moron because he gave Melo a no-trade clause? Got it.

Direction. Nevermind.

None of your hateful criticism relates to my thinking. All that matters to me is how much cap room we have to build around Melo and whether we have any flexibility to move him if it doesn't work out.

But you said Phil outbid everyone for him, but you don't address what IdiotPhil was bidding against? How does that not relate to your hateful thinking, I mean your deep, thoughtful analysis?

So in your happiest of all worlds, Melo signs for either pre-prime or post-prime money, and hopes to get traded to Milwaukee, Charlotte or Utah for great draft picks and valuable younger players two or three years from now?

It's okay, you don't have to respond. Fish has notified me that my posting contribution for today has been exceeded.

Bonn, seriously, I've always respected your fierce statistical analyis. I'm only trying to hopefully partially get you into the Centrist fold for the upcoming season.

Confused as to why his example pigeon holes us to only offering Max and then $4.5mil if paycut was larger

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

knickscity wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:OMG! I just wrote that it's more likely Phil will look to acquire some Near Max guys rather than blow it all on one max guy and then not have any cap for much else. WTF?

nixluva wrote:It seems to me that there could be more value in finding a way to get the help we need outside of adding a Max FA. Phil is going to have to really come up with a plan that builds this team with near max players rather than splurge for that one max guy and have very little else. I'm pretty sure that Phil and his staff have crunched the numbers and laid out multiple scenarios for what they can do with the cap next summer. I'm sure that they quickly came to realize that this was not going to be easy to figure out. This is why the move to add youth was so important. You have to find a way to secure cheap talent. The best way is with young players. That young talent is the lifeline for a GM. Think of how much different our team would look if Phil had not made the trade?

WTF??? Why so tense?

So the beginning of supporting for this approach started with Phil making the Dallas trade?

Shouldn't this always be a front office's MO

Did you support the Bargnani trade giving up 2 picks and a 1st which could have equated to adding more youthful talent going for our rebuild future

Are you a forward thinking fan or an in the moment kind

For the record stop giving Phil lay on thick kudos because if I recall correctly we rejected several Chandler trades over the past yr or so

Our team could look very much the same had Grunwald or Mills pulled the trigger on deals

Phil hasn't done anything out of the ordinary had we hired an ordinary GM

He hasn't even scratched the surface of his $60mil paycheck

Phil made a good deal imo, and I wont knock him because the previous GM's didnt do it. Phil has recognized that the backcourt is too crowded, so I'd like to see how he will address that.

Imo, this upcoming season should be all about establishing the culture he wants, if the teams can win games in the process that would be a plus initself.

Phil gets no grade by me til i see what he does in 2015, whether that means making good signings to the roster and keeping flexibility for 2016 as well.

Right after Melo was signed Phil was interviewed during the Knicks sl game against Charlotte. Phil said he is hoping to bring in two really good players with the cap space that the Knicks have available in 2015.

Crush i'm convinced that most of the guys complaining and doubting have no idea what Phil has been saying. This is why they're talking such nonsense. They really haven't dug deep into what's going on and the possibilities that are being created for this franchise since Phil came on board. No one is saying he's perfect or anything, but he's done a good job so far with very limited resources. Did anyone expect a sexy move so early considering what Phil had to work with? I do know that he didn't lose in the trade with Dallas. He got a better PG which we needed and young assets to boot. That's a win in my book.

you nailed it. Most thought this was a sit and wait offseason, no picks, no MLE, no cap space, players nobody wanted to trade for, etc etc.. we heard it all. Phil gets us younger, jettisons guys who a problem last year, has a good draft, adds a couple prospects, fixes PG and sets us up to have a good season, but guys would rather spin their wheels about MElo's no trade or Calderon's $7mm year. Its going to be a good year. Keep posting and stay thirsty

The previous GM received full support for the moves he was making with a means to an end goal.

The only difference, the end goal keeps changing

The previous GM made moves that supposedly fit Melo and the style of play

He made moves that suggested we were in win now mode, none of them really worked

Probably some doubted they ever would

We've built twice around a player in his prime and now are doing it as he's coming out, stakes could never be higher

Okay so now we've hired Phil, we have some direction

The top heavy part of the plan is older and the outside competition is getting younger-better

The top heavy part of the plan also took too much of the pie, to make it easier to execute the plan

I think Phil has a good sense of what it takes to win, he simply doesn't have the resources to accomplish peak results

We're probably better than we were 10yrs ago or so, but not too hard improving on a low benchmark

We need long sustaining success starting with and going beyond Phil and Melo's contractual tenure

I don't see it, I see another flash in the pan plan.