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Shame Tread: 3/12 7:30pm @ Celtics: Beantown Throwdown
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mreinman
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3/13/2014  2:09 PM
so its just a question about how high the pick will be and if it goes to denver or orlando.

It's really not relevant to the knicks. We just would rather be less embarrassed about what it turns out to be.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
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dk7th
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3/13/2014  2:16 PM
mreinman wrote:so its just a question about how high the pick will be and if it goes to denver or orlando.

It's really not relevant to the knicks. We just would rather be less embarrassed about what it turns out to be.

yes you are right. it is and will be embarrassing regardless, a painful reminder of what could have been.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
jrodmc
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3/13/2014  3:32 PM
Of course, because now it would seem O-town is the new latest franchise of franchises built for the long term!

Now we will get to spend the following 4 years being updated on how the tremendous Orlando Magic are the franchise of the future, thanks to short-sighted, greedy uni-dimensional Melo!
Hmmm, he scored 34 against the C's and we won a meaningless game by 20+. Seems like his attitude has darkened.

And for his next trick, MeloCancer is going to try and drive out a President of Basketball Ops right before your very eyes!

dk7th
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3/13/2014  4:20 PM
jrodmc wrote:Of course, because now it would seem O-town is the new latest franchise of franchises built for the long term!

Now we will get to spend the following 4 years being updated on how the tremendous Orlando Magic are the franchise of the future, thanks to short-sighted, greedy uni-dimensional Melo!
Hmmm, he scored 34 against the C's and we won a meaningless game by 20+. Seems like his attitude has darkened.

And for his next trick, MeloCancer is going to try and drive out a President of Basketball Ops right before your very eyes!

the knicks could have used those picks. good try at misdirection.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
smackeddog
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3/13/2014  4:45 PM
dk7th wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Great to get another win- loved Aldrich's game, and I liked Earl Clark too. Tyler was pretty bad tonight- seemed quite bumbling throughout.

DK- what do you mean we only beat the Celtics without Rondo? I thought you said injuries are an excuse?! Without Tyson, Amar'e, K-Mart and Bargs, we really aren't much better than the Cetics anyways aside from Melo.

JR has been strangely low key and dare I say it (jinx!) consistent for the past month or two- what the heck is going on?!

i repeat: who cares about a win or a loss at this point. if they miss the playoffs denver gets a pick and if they make the playoffs they get destroyed in round one just like most of melo teams.

the players know that so they are auditioning at this point.

please don't tell me i must not be a fan for seeing the situation this way.


I want us to make the playoffs and I don't want to watch us hand over a top pick the nuggets- why the heck would any knick fan want to see that?! I wish you'd post more on non-melo subjects- I know how you feel about Melo, everyone does at this point- time to shake up your game plan DK!

dk7th
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3/13/2014  4:57 PM
smackeddog wrote:
dk7th wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Great to get another win- loved Aldrich's game, and I liked Earl Clark too. Tyler was pretty bad tonight- seemed quite bumbling throughout.

DK- what do you mean we only beat the Celtics without Rondo? I thought you said injuries are an excuse?! Without Tyson, Amar'e, K-Mart and Bargs, we really aren't much better than the Cetics anyways aside from Melo.

JR has been strangely low key and dare I say it (jinx!) consistent for the past month or two- what the heck is going on?!

i repeat: who cares about a win or a loss at this point. if they miss the playoffs denver gets a pick and if they make the playoffs they get destroyed in round one just like most of melo teams.

the players know that so they are auditioning at this point.

please don't tell me i must not be a fan for seeing the situation this way.


I want us to make the playoffs and I don't want to watch us hand over a top pick the nuggets- why the heck would any knick fan want to see that?! I wish you'd post more on non-melo subjects- I know how you feel about Melo, everyone does at this point- time to shake up your game plan DK!

hey i participated in the game thread so that's a start. i spoke about other players than melo but with 35.5% usage rate last night he was the focus more than a third of the time!

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
CrushAlot
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3/13/2014  5:24 PM
dk7th wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
dk7th wrote:
smackeddog wrote:Great to get another win- loved Aldrich's game, and I liked Earl Clark too. Tyler was pretty bad tonight- seemed quite bumbling throughout.

DK- what do you mean we only beat the Celtics without Rondo? I thought you said injuries are an excuse?! Without Tyson, Amar'e, K-Mart and Bargs, we really aren't much better than the Cetics anyways aside from Melo.

JR has been strangely low key and dare I say it (jinx!) consistent for the past month or two- what the heck is going on?!

i repeat: who cares about a win or a loss at this point. if they miss the playoffs denver gets a pick and if they make the playoffs they get destroyed in round one just like most of melo teams.

the players know that so they are auditioning at this point.

please don't tell me i must not be a fan for seeing the situation this way.


I want us to make the playoffs and I don't want to watch us hand over a top pick the nuggets- why the heck would any knick fan want to see that?! I wish you'd post more on non-melo subjects- I know how you feel about Melo, everyone does at this point- time to shake up your game plan DK!

hey i participated in the game thread so that's a start. i spoke about other players than melo but with 35.5% usage rate last night he was the focus more than a third of the time!

you seemed to be focused in on pointing out a particular players number of bad shots. Maybe spread the love to the rest of the guys a bit more and it won't seem as if you have a target that you are looking to take shots at.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
mreinman
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3/13/2014  5:39 PM
DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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3/13/2014  5:50 PM
mreinman wrote:DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

TS% last night was great, no question. but as i said later his usage was high and his assist rate low, ending up way over an acceptable ratio. that will never translate to winning in the playoffs. NEVER

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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3/13/2014  5:54 PM
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

TS% last night was great, no question. but as i said later his usage was high and his assist rate low, ending up way over an acceptable ratio. that will never translate to winning in the playoffs. NEVER

No argument here. Nobody wants him to pass more than me. Even when the double comes, he just turns the other way and chucks. Does he realized that there is now an open man?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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3/13/2014  6:08 PM
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

TS% last night was great, no question. but as i said later his usage was high and his assist rate low, ending up way over an acceptable ratio. that will never translate to winning in the playoffs. NEVER

No argument here. Nobody wants him to pass more than me. Even when the double comes, he just turns the other way and chucks. Does he realized that there is now an open man?

i just want to give props to bonn1997 because he has pointed out that the TS% stat is really an individual stat and does not correlate seamlessly with winning. the key is: are you ALSO being a good teammate and for melo last night the answer is "NO." this is where usage and assist rate come to bear.

for me everything i see is informed by the ultimate goal of a title or at least a conference finals appearance. history has shown that melo's game does not translate effectively to warrant holding him in such high esteem like many still do.

you need individual efficiency and at the same time you need to properly share the ball.
you need to defend the position.

it's the only way!

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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3/13/2014  6:41 PM
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

TS% last night was great, no question. but as i said later his usage was high and his assist rate low, ending up way over an acceptable ratio. that will never translate to winning in the playoffs. NEVER

No argument here. Nobody wants him to pass more than me. Even when the double comes, he just turns the other way and chucks. Does he realized that there is now an open man?

i just want to give props to bonn1997 because he has pointed out that the TS% stat is really an individual stat and does not correlate seamlessly with winning. the key is: are you ALSO being a good teammate and for melo last night the answer is "NO." this is where usage and assist rate come to bear.

for me everything i see is informed by the ultimate goal of a title or at least a conference finals appearance. history has shown that melo's game does not translate effectively to warrant holding him in such high esteem like many still do.

you need individual efficiency and at the same time you need to properly share the ball.
you need to defend the position.

it's the only way!

His Win Shares in NY have been superb!

The main issue is that streaky force shooting may work against weaker teams and defenders but he still does the same crap against the top defenders. That's why his shooting pct against them is terrible.

Phil needs to get him to buy into the team concept.

Nobody can argue against the fact that he is a top 5 talent playing down to top 15.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
dk7th
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3/13/2014  9:10 PM
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:DK talked about THJ and Cole as well but his agenda going in was to point out Melo's bad shots and unfortunately, there were many of those.

He had a TS% of 59 which is excellent. However, if can tweak his game to not take those shots and to share more with his teammates, the sky is the limit for him.

If only someone could make him see/believe that. Hhhhhmmmm, I think I may just know a guy who can convince him.

TS% last night was great, no question. but as i said later his usage was high and his assist rate low, ending up way over an acceptable ratio. that will never translate to winning in the playoffs. NEVER

No argument here. Nobody wants him to pass more than me. Even when the double comes, he just turns the other way and chucks. Does he realized that there is now an open man?

i just want to give props to bonn1997 because he has pointed out that the TS% stat is really an individual stat and does not correlate seamlessly with winning. the key is: are you ALSO being a good teammate and for melo last night the answer is "NO." this is where usage and assist rate come to bear.

for me everything i see is informed by the ultimate goal of a title or at least a conference finals appearance. history has shown that melo's game does not translate effectively to warrant holding him in such high esteem like many still do.

you need individual efficiency and at the same time you need to properly share the ball.
you need to defend the position.

it's the only way!

His Win Shares in NY have been superb!

The main issue is that streaky force shooting may work against weaker teams and defenders but he still does the same crap against the top defenders. That's why his shooting pct against them is terrible.

Phil needs to get him to buy into the team concept.

Nobody can argue against the fact that he is a top 5 talent playing down to top 15.


i don't look at win shares to be frank, even though i know you are being ironic.

carmelo anthony is a regular-season player and his talent and skills simply don't translate to winning in the playoffs. a lot of it has to do with his severe limitations as a defender, let alone the facilitating aspect on offense. he is way below par in these areas.

he lacks craft, guile, will, poise. and as you have duly pointed out, for example, where are the head and ball fakes?

i will say this: i laugh at people who say "he is paid to be a scorer." what utter horse****! you pay a player to WIN

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
mreinman
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3/13/2014  9:20 PM
I don't think his defense is as bad as you say. His rebound is solid. His talents and skills are off the chart. His IQ is very high.

His decision making is very suspect and that specifically is the root of why he is top 15 and not top 5. He has top 5 talent IMHO.

He believes that every shot he takes is going in. I don't like the heat checks either and don't know why he does not pump fake more.

Where we differ is that you don't belief he has the talent, IQ and overall makeup to be a true winner and believe that PhilJ can't fix him.

I believe that he is extremely fixable if he can be convinced by the right person. I believe Phil is the right person and will stand up to him.

Can I be wrong? Maybe, but this is what I truly believe. I don't dislike him, I am not angry at him for anything, don't think he is a bad guy, he is just flawed and narcissistic. Phil's Zen sh1t is perfect for this.

Jackson completely overhauled Jordan's selfish game. Jordan was a freak but he did not understand the game before phil. Jackson could not fix Kobe and surrounded him with so much talent and high IQ/team players that he got away with it.

Time will tell.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Shame Tread: 3/12 7:30pm @ Celtics: Beantown Throwdown

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