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Marbury and Penny weigh in on Jason Collin's flagrant foul....
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rojasmas
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4/18/2004  11:45 PM
These two geniuses said in the papers today, which you can read straight from this website that the Collin's foul was a "good, hard clean foul." I'd love to see what they would say if it happened to them. But then since Stephon didn't go hard to the basket at all the entire game and neither did Penny, it's hard to get upended like that 30 feet from the basket.
And Collins said he was going for the ball but ended up on Timmy's bicep because he didn't get up as high as Thomas. Hmmm... this from a 7 footer. I know Timmy has hops but this is ridiculous. Kerry Kittles and Doogie Howser Lawrence Frank said that this is just playoff basketball. So how about it Knicks, can we give the Nets a little of their own medicine and make Tuesday night "knock a Net on their ass night?"
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martin
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4/18/2004  11:52 PM
I have one question. Did you see the play?
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martin
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4/19/2004  12:07 AM
Posted by rojasmas:

But then since Stephon didn't go hard to the basket at all the entire game and neither did Penny, it's hard to get upended like that 30 feet from the basket.

I have another question. Why do you think it was that Marb and whoever didn't have too many opportunities to get to the rim?
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MX25
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4/19/2004  2:16 AM
Hard Clean Foul. Next time should Collins just let Thomas dunk it on him?

Marbury couldn't get to rim. Due to Nets very good but still underrated Defense.
martin
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4/19/2004  8:47 AM
Posted by MX25:

Hard Clean Foul. Next time should Collins just let Thomas dunk it on him?

Marbury couldn't get to rim. Due to Nets very good but still underrated Defense.

Yes and Yes. And more specifically, because they were double teaming Marb and collapsing the defense cause Knicks have zero outside shooters. Can't drive to the basket without SG's who can hit baskets or player who demand double teams in the post.
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TRU
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4/19/2004  3:37 PM
Lot of animosity in your posts, oh great moderator.

Until the Knicks win a playoff game, I'm going to be pretty pissy myself.

There goes 2005, I guess.
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simrud
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4/19/2004  6:39 PM
I saw the damn play Martin, saw it live at the fuc**ing game!

And if you are gonna tell that was the right play to make at that point in the game, you are crazy.

And no, I don't have a problem with that play. I have a problem with our response. We should be doing the same thing. We should be killin people when they try to dunk on us. That's all I want. Somebody head on the platter game 2 regardless of the outcome. I want a Net to be taken out on the strechers staright to the hospitcal and not show his face on the court again. I want soembody to knock out Martin or Jefferson. Yes that would be the same as the Nets did, but the did the RIHGT THING FOR THE PLAYOFFS.
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MaTT4281
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4/19/2004  8:06 PM
The foul didn't look intentional at all. Either way, I think we'd all like to see some payback.
rojasmas
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4/19/2004  8:57 PM
Martin, of course I saw the play. Duh!!!!! He went after his arm and got nowhere near the ball. You can tell me it's because he can't jump but I am not that gullible. What does it have to be to be considered dirty, a forearm to the face? A Jack Tatum knockout hit? Come on, I don't believe Collins thought about the consequences before he did it, granted, but that doesn't make it less dirty or less of an intentionally FLAGRANT foul that denied the dunk at any cost. Debate that. Obviously the referee thought it was intentional and flagrant.
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martin
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4/19/2004  9:29 PM
Hey, I'm all about instigating some better level of discussion.

If Oak or Mase or Ewing or Charlie Ward or Chris Childs or Doc Rivers or Derek Harper or LJ or Starks did the same thing to any of the Miami players and got a flagrant all of you would be saying that the refs had it out for NY and that it was a clean, hard foul. It was. If it wasn't the league would have let everyone know that it was excessive and suspended Collins.

Let me be clear. I expected someone from NY who was on the court to step up. No one did. That's pathetic. We all know that Isiah noticed. At the same time it would not have behooved any of the Knick players to go out and aggressively attack someone without any regard and get suspended for a game, we need the players.

And lastly, Collins didn't mean to take down TT, but it was the right play from NJ's standpoint. If you can't see that then you are blinded by blue and orange and bad insight.
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Mac
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4/19/2004  9:44 PM
Posted by martin:

Hey, I'm all about instigating some better level of discussion.

If Oak or Mase or Ewing or Charlie Ward or Chris Childs or Doc Rivers or Derek Harper or LJ or Starks did the same thing to any of the Miami players and got a flagrant all of you would be saying that the refs had it out for NY and that it was a clean, hard foul. It was. If it wasn't the league would have let everyone know that it was excessive and suspended Collins.

Let me be clear. I expected someone from NY who was on the court to step up. No one did. That's pathetic. We all know that Isiah noticed. At the same time it would not have behooved any of the Knick players to go out and aggressively attack someone without any regard and get suspended for a game, we need the players.

And lastly, Collins didn't mean to take down TT, but it was the right play from NJ's standpoint. If you can't see that then you are blinded by blue and orange and bad insight.

I agree. The travesty wasn't the foul, but the reaction.
rojasmas
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4/20/2004  7:49 PM
Check out today's New York Post and Peter Vecsey's take on the foul. I quote, "How can David Stern, Stu Jackson and anybody else in the league office involved in its discipline decision making, not punish Jason Collins for flagrantly fouling an airborne Tim Thomas? If you have a genuine feel for the game and its players- it's obvious the Nets center, whose reputation as a nasty cheap-shot artist is gaining momentum, wasn't going for the ball (though he might've hit it accidentally when he stiff-armed Thomas). It was the nefarious Kevin McHale-Kurt Rambis play all over again. Thomas wound up in the hospital with various injuries and won't play in game 2. Meanwhile, Collins wasn't so much as fined; had Thomas broken some bones or neck, well, maybe then."
If it was a flagrant foul and our player cannot play tonight, why should we be at a disadvantage due to the action and lack of restraint and judgment on Jason Collin's part? At the very least, suspend Collins until Thomas is able to play again. Furthermore, Collins has a history of flagrant fouls this year. This incident was his fifth flagrant foul on the year. If he was not going for the block or the ball, and was not holding his defensive postion, what exactly was he doing? He was no doubt coached to deny any and all dunks at all costs. We now have even less chance of winning this series and the Nets are rewarded for their behavior.
We could be the Dallas Mavs of the East.
Marbury and Penny weigh in on Jason Collin's flagrant foul....

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