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Worrying trend defense + points allowed
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BRIGGS
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12/18/2012  10:29 PM
When we started the season--we really seemed to lock down teams. In the first month of the season--we held 8 opponents to less than 90 points--this month=0. If you remember how we played it seemed like we almost played a pseudo zone for the first 10 seconds of the clock and then went to double team the ball with shot clock under 10. We have barely held on to beat some poor teams and got hosed by Houston which had won 2 games on the road all year. I think if you're an elite team--you dont get blown out at home -23 going into 4 Q.
RIP Crushalot😞
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gunsnewing
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12/18/2012  10:31 PM
Seems the Knicks have taken their feet of the gas and that falls on the coach to right the problem. Too ****y
JesseDark
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12/18/2012  10:42 PM
Seems like there is an over reliance on the wing players to have Chandler cover for them. Chandler knows he can't give up his fouls too early, especially if guards are letting their man get by them.
Bring back dee-fense
yellowboy90
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12/18/2012  10:45 PM
I agree. Some things need to change but some things want change like Kidd's foot speed or Novak's ability along with other player having lapses. I would like to see the DPOY actually play defense but hey he is getting buckets. Maybe he is passing himself or maybe its the guards making him look bad.
ChuckBuck
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12/19/2012  8:59 AM
18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.
toad
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12/19/2012  9:11 AM
Don't worry, Amar'e is coming back this week. .. oh, wait. ..

Ray's gotta do a better job of controlling the pace. He needs to calm down. And if we're taking bad shots, quick shots, we're giving more opportunities for transition baskets before our defense can really set up. Also, we do not do well against penetrating guards.

Nalod
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12/19/2012  9:47 AM
ChuckBuck wrote:18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.

We might have peaked early. Vet team came together fast and we have to count on injury to be a part of the equation with a geriatric roster such as ours.

My hope is we did not, but teams are figuring us out and thats not anyones fault or blame to accept, its just how things can go in the NBA.

Are we built to win the whole season or just to c.ockblock the Nets early from gathering too much marketing buzz? I am suspicious of this team and Dolans directives.

18-6 is great but sustainability is going to be an issue.

We can argue it all day or just wait to see how the season goes.

ChuckBuck
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12/19/2012  10:00 AM
Nalod wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.

We might have peaked early. Vet team came together fast and we have to count on injury to be a part of the equation with a geriatric roster such as ours.

My hope is we did not, but teams are figuring us out and thats not anyones fault or blame to accept, its just how things can go in the NBA.

Are we built to win the whole season or just to c.ockblock the Nets early from gathering too much marketing buzz? I am suspicious of this team and Dolans directives.

18-6 is great but sustainability is going to be an issue.

We can argue it all day or just wait to see how the season goes.

Please don't mention the Nets and that's not being Nyetphobic like you always say.

This team constructed has nothing to do with stealing their thunder or marketing or anything else your favorite black and white team does.

In fact, most analysts and pundits had BK ahead of the Knicks on virtually every poll, every preseason breakdown, every power ranking.

18-6 is a continuation of last season. As long as we get our guys healthy, we'll be just fine.

SupremeCommander
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12/19/2012  10:09 AM
the team needs to defend better, absolutely... each team played is giving the Knicks their best though. That's part of it. Not to mention guys have to give more on both ends than was the original plan because of injuries. That's another part of it
DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
Nalod
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12/19/2012  10:42 AM
ChuckBuck wrote:
Nalod wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.

We might have peaked early. Vet team came together fast and we have to count on injury to be a part of the equation with a geriatric roster such as ours.

My hope is we did not, but teams are figuring us out and thats not anyones fault or blame to accept, its just how things can go in the NBA.

Are we built to win the whole season or just to c.ockblock the Nets early from gathering too much marketing buzz? I am suspicious of this team and Dolans directives.

18-6 is great but sustainability is going to be an issue.

We can argue it all day or just wait to see how the season goes.

Please don't mention the Nets and that's not being Nyetphobic like you always say.

This team constructed has nothing to do with stealing their thunder or marketing or anything else your favorite black and white team does.

In fact, most analysts and pundits had BK ahead of the Knicks on virtually every poll, every preseason breakdown, every power ranking.

18-6 is a continuation of last season. As long as we get our guys healthy, we'll be just fine.

Season is not over. I am ecstatic over the 18-6 start and as you alluded to it exceeds most everyones expectations!

Its a long season and there is nothing wrong with discussion regarding the sustainability given our roster construction. Its not done with hate. Its the same concern we had pre-season and the major criticism those very experts had. Knicks don't play to prove writers and haters wrong its to win. Management, well that might be a different story.

Regarding Dolan and his motives its historically his track record that leaves a lot to be desired.

Is there a scenario of players wearing down and injuries happening? Of course. Am I saying it to make myself happy and predict doom and gloom? Nope. BUt I am not extrapolating our early success into "its our championship to lose".

Been starphucked way too many times by the MSG Dolan machine. I won't be fooled again.

Nalod is damaged and got a weary eye on this franchise. I don't trust it.

My dysfunction began when Sonny Werblin starphuched us with Spencer Haywood and they never stopped since. Its a business first.

ChuckBuck
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12/19/2012  12:02 PM
Nalod wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Nalod wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.

We might have peaked early. Vet team came together fast and we have to count on injury to be a part of the equation with a geriatric roster such as ours.

My hope is we did not, but teams are figuring us out and thats not anyones fault or blame to accept, its just how things can go in the NBA.

Are we built to win the whole season or just to c.ockblock the Nets early from gathering too much marketing buzz? I am suspicious of this team and Dolans directives.

18-6 is great but sustainability is going to be an issue.

We can argue it all day or just wait to see how the season goes.

Please don't mention the Nets and that's not being Nyetphobic like you always say.

This team constructed has nothing to do with stealing their thunder or marketing or anything else your favorite black and white team does.

In fact, most analysts and pundits had BK ahead of the Knicks on virtually every poll, every preseason breakdown, every power ranking.

18-6 is a continuation of last season. As long as we get our guys healthy, we'll be just fine.

Season is not over. I am ecstatic over the 18-6 start and as you alluded to it exceeds most everyones expectations!

Its a long season and there is nothing wrong with discussion regarding the sustainability given our roster construction. Its not done with hate. Its the same concern we had pre-season and the major criticism those very experts had. Knicks don't play to prove writers and haters wrong its to win. Management, well that might be a different story.

Regarding Dolan and his motives its historically his track record that leaves a lot to be desired.

Is there a scenario of players wearing down and injuries happening? Of course. Am I saying it to make myself happy and predict doom and gloom? Nope. BUt I am not extrapolating our early success into "its our championship to lose".

Been starphucked way too many times by the MSG Dolan machine. I won't be fooled again.

Nalod is damaged and got a weary eye on this franchise. I don't trust it.

My dysfunction began when Sonny Werblin starphuched us with Spencer Haywood and they never stopped since. Its a business first.

Understandable considering the Knicks history this past decade and change.

No matter what our record is at the end of the season, it's still Miami's championship to lose, not ours, not San Antonio's, not OKC's, not Memphis etc. We have to go through them, and probably meet in the playoffs.

All that said, I'm not giving Dolan credit for this start, but at the same time, I'm giving him credit for not being as hands on as he has in the past. It seems there's now a happy medium between upper management, with Grunwald, with Wooody, and everyone's on the same page. This is reflected in the current record.

Dolan of the past used to treat the Knicks like an erector set or Lego blocks, interchanging coaches, forcing players or pieces that don't fit etc.

In the last 2 to 3 years, you can see a change of atmosphere. A more "laissez faire" attitude regarding his teams, and as a result the Knicks and the Rangers have been thriving.

There's still the wierd media gags and injury updates ala Bellichek, but as far as, day to day operations and roster management and moves, you can see a big difference.

Damaged is ok, as a fan. 13-14 years without winning a playoff series will do that to you. All I'm saying this ain't the same ole Knicks, and we're chipping away at the stigma with each and every win.

tkf
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12/19/2012  12:04 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/19/2012  12:04 PM
Nalod wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:18-6 minus key players. Stormed out to a fast start, now levelling off. We have yet to play our best ball this season in my opinion. I'll take it.

We might have peaked early. Vet team came together fast and we have to count on injury to be a part of the equation with a geriatric roster such as ours.

My hope is we did not, but teams are figuring us out and thats not anyones fault or blame to accept, its just how things can go in the NBA.

Are we built to win the whole season or just to c.ockblock the Nets early from gathering too much marketing buzz? I am suspicious of this team and Dolans directives.

18-6 is great but sustainability is going to be an issue.

We can argue it all day or just wait to see how the season goes.

I say lets fight and argue... who the hell wants to wait!!!!! Mount up!!!!


now you know I am just kidding right nalod?

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
NYKBocker
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12/19/2012  12:19 PM
Teams have figured out the Knicks weakness. Run the PnR on half court sets. Run at every make or miss. Knick guards have to get back on transition and our bigs need to rebound. PnR defense? They need to watch some tape of Fishlips on how to defend the PnR.
IrishKnickFan
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12/19/2012  1:15 PM
i read a stat lately that said we were number 1 on defense from november 1-21 but since then we are 24th. Thats very alarming
VCoug
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12/19/2012  1:42 PM
IrishKnickFan wrote:i read a stat lately that said we were number 1 on defense from november 1-21 but since then we are 24th. Thats very alarming

That sounds about right. Our defense hasn't been the same since we were 6-0.

Now the joy of my world is in Zion How beautiful if nothing more Than to wait at Zion's door I've never been in love like this before Now let me pray to keep you from The perils that will surely come
mrKnickShot
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12/19/2012  2:56 PM
VCoug wrote:
IrishKnickFan wrote:i read a stat lately that said we were number 1 on defense from november 1-21 but since then we are 24th. Thats very alarming

That sounds about right. Our defense hasn't been the same since we were 6-0.

Brewers defense has really gone south

And Chandler too

Felton and Kidd have allowed way too much guard penetration of late

franco12
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12/19/2012  4:22 PM
maybe this team was playing play off level intensity to start the year, and they've let up. Just like teams give up big runs with prevent style defense - felling they have it in the bag.

But I've thought all along we couldn't be that good - partly because we've been so bad for so long.

misterearl
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12/19/2012  4:29 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/19/2012  4:35 PM
Dominoes

Each player is important to the fabric. When one goes down it affects everyone else in some form. The next two weeks will test the resolve of coaches and able-bodied players

Raymond Felton - two bruised hands, stubbornly playing in pain.
Jason Kidd - 78 years old, tough as nails, his minutes cannot be extended
Ronnie Brewer - ambulatory
Chris Copeland - the 28 year old rookie needs better defensive recognition
Tyson Chandler - barely surviving on foul trouble island with no backup with size, that is a huge void

Carmelo - missed terribly, especially on defense... please do not let it be the knee, anything but the knee
Amar'e - no rush to meet any artificial dealine, next writer who moans about him fitting in gets slapped
JR Smith - has taken some nasty falls in last 3 games, playing in pain
Steve Novak - questionable tonight, another puzzle piece lost
Rasheed Wallace - desperately missed, plantar hurts like hell

Marcus Camby - see Tyson Chandler
Pablo Prigioni - the 35 year old rookie could see more minutes, his play is adjusting to the states
James White - will be auditioned
Kurt Thomas - in case of emergency, break glass

Reality Check: Can We Survive December?

once a knick always a knick
JamesLin
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12/19/2012  6:46 PM
Also, playing defense is VERY physically intense. Don't forget we're the oldest team on earth at the moment. Fatigue kicks in after 20-30 games and so injuries happen, and old grouch kicks in. I won't be surprised if we never get back to the defense we had at the beginning of the season.
Get busy living or get busy dying. ---- Andy Dufresne
misterearl
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12/19/2012  7:49 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/19/2012  7:51 PM
Survive December

JamesLin wrote:Also, playing defense is VERY physically intense. Don't forget we're the oldest team on earth at the moment. Fatigue kicks in after 20-30 games and so injuries happen, and old grouch kicks in. I won't be surprised if we never get back to the defense we had at the beginning of the season.

Bring back quality (healthy) depth and individual minutes will decrease.

If Amar'e, Sheed and Camby stay out, all bets are off.

Survive December.

once a knick always a knick
Worrying trend defense + points allowed

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