The spider webs have been cleared (some of you may know what this means), the team plays better offensively than any offensive minded philosophy can implement. They pass, shoot, and DEFEND aggressively.

Love him or hate him, this team needs Carmelo. They're a middle of the pack team without his offense, rebounding, and leadership (yes, I said leadership). He is the finishing touch on a team that has true centers and a true point guard in Jason Kidd. There's no better way to complement a suffocating defense than to have a player who can score at will in any given type of setup. This team can't beat Miami without him. Thinking so is just delusional. If they're a 50+ team, he will be talked about in the MVP race all season.

We're doing big things this year, and we don't even have Shump back yet.

Feels good to talk about Knicks basketball again.

I do wanna reserve the MVP talk after 3 games tho.

knickscity wrote:They are lotto without him.

I do wanna reserve the MVP talk after 3 games tho.

I think this is finally the year Melo's solidifies himself as a top NBA player. Yes we are a lotto team without him no doubt.

I don't get you guys the melo worship is the reason it is almost impossible to have a logical discussion... I am willing to be that we would be 3-0 without him, and if this team wins over 50 games,it won't be because of him, but because as a team, we have overachieved...You guys are over exaggerating his impact, looking around the league no one should be talking about carmelo in any MVP race at this point, considering some of the surprise starts we see around this league.. way to early, way to premature....

I just don't see how you guys wax on poetically about the knicks, yet call them a lottery team without carmelo...

3G4G wrote:

tkf wrote:I don't get you guys who say we are a lottery team without him and then feel this team can compete for a title.. the biggest excuse you guys used was that his team in denver wasn't that good.. well if that is the case how can he take this "lotto" team and beat the likes of Boston and miami, heck even the bulls? I keep hearing how this team is full of "grown ass men", how they are playing so much like a team, how much the defense has improved, how "grunny and woody have turned water into wine".. I mean if that is the case how in the heck is this a lottery team without carmelo unless you feel he is responsible for jason kidd playing like he is 30, for felton playing solid ball, for JR smith playing well, or prigs playing well, for the defense being very good...

I don't get you guys the melo worship is the reason it is almost impossible to have a logical discussion... I am willing to be that we would be 3-0 without him, and if this team wins over 50 games,it won't be because of him, but because as a team, we have overachieved...You guys are over exaggerating his impact, looking around the league no one should be talking about carmelo in any MVP race at this point, considering some of the surprise starts we see around this league.. way to early, way to premature....

I just don't see how you guys wax on poetically about the knicks, yet call them a lottery team without carmelo...

No Kidding and you left out ALMIGHTY Brewer.....The Skies The Limit.

Hey you forgot Sheed!

Lets visit this in February.

MVP is usually reserved for a top seed for the regular season. The best player from the best team in 82 games.

3G4G wrote:

tkf wrote:I don't get you guys who say we are a lottery team without him and then feel this team can compete for a title.. the biggest excuse you guys used was that his team in denver wasn't that good.. well if that is the case how can he take this "lotto" team and beat the likes of Boston and miami, heck even the bulls? I keep hearing how this team is full of "grown ass men", how they are playing so much like a team, how much the defense has improved, how "grunny and woody have turned water into wine".. I mean if that is the case how in the heck is this a lottery team without carmelo unless you feel he is responsible for jason kidd playing like he is 30, for felton playing solid ball, for JR smith playing well, or prigs playing well, for the defense being very good...

I don't get you guys the melo worship is the reason it is almost impossible to have a logical discussion... I am willing to be that we would be 3-0 without him, and if this team wins over 50 games,it won't be because of him, but because as a team, we have overachieved...You guys are over exaggerating his impact, looking around the league no one should be talking about carmelo in any MVP race at this point, considering some of the surprise starts we see around this league.. way to early, way to premature....

I just don't see how you guys wax on poetically about the knicks, yet call them a lottery team without carmelo...

No Kidding and you left out ALMIGHTY Brewer.....The Skies The Limit.

CAN'T forget mr "poised and smooth" brewer...LOL

tkf wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

MSG3 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knickscity wrote:They are lotto without him.

I do wanna reserve the MVP talk after 3 games tho.

I think this is finally the year Melo's solidifies himself as a top NBA player. Yes we are a lotto team without him no doubt.

It depends on who he's being replaced with. If you mean the team just lost him, then yes. If you replaced him with another solid starter at the SF position, we'd still be 3-0 though. The success has more to do with the crazy scoring efficiency we're getting from several players.

Slightly disagree Bonn. I think the attention Melo has been getting frome defenses is leading to the offensive efficiency we're enjoying. Not many other players would command that kind of attention. Not sure if we'd be 3-0 or having the same success on offense (or defense for that matter) if you replace Melo with a healthy STAT, for example.

Yeah if you watched the games and see the attention he demands, you realize it is the main factor for the hot shooting. Just looking at offensive efficiency alone, i agree, this team would still be 3-0 if you take him off the team and replace him with another forward. But watching the games and understanding what you're seeing makes it very obvious the shooting is a result of a couple of things that have to do with Melo. We just wouldn't be shooting the ball this well if we didn't have a player on the floor who demands so much attention.

that is not true.. it is absolutely not true.. the knicks are not going to shoot this well, just not.. they are also making a lot of threes , not necessarily great shots.. ronnie brewer is horrible 3 point shooter and he nailed two threes with someone on him, that had nothing to do with carmelo... carmelo came out and shot 10-28 the first game.. no team is paying that much attention to him.. the sixers guarded him straight up with thadeus young for most of the game..

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

tkf wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

MSG3 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knickscity wrote:They are lotto without him.

I do wanna reserve the MVP talk after 3 games tho.

I think this is finally the year Melo's solidifies himself as a top NBA player. Yes we are a lotto team without him no doubt.

It depends on who he's being replaced with. If you mean the team just lost him, then yes. If you replaced him with another solid starter at the SF position, we'd still be 3-0 though. The success has more to do with the crazy scoring efficiency we're getting from several players.

Slightly disagree Bonn. I think the attention Melo has been getting frome defenses is leading to the offensive efficiency we're enjoying. Not many other players would command that kind of attention. Not sure if we'd be 3-0 or having the same success on offense (or defense for that matter) if you replace Melo with a healthy STAT, for example.

Yeah if you watched the games and see the attention he demands, you realize it is the main factor for the hot shooting. Just looking at offensive efficiency alone, i agree, this team would still be 3-0 if you take him off the team and replace him with another forward. But watching the games and understanding what you're seeing makes it very obvious the shooting is a result of a couple of things that have to do with Melo. We just wouldn't be shooting the ball this well if we didn't have a player on the floor who demands so much attention.

that is not true.. it is absolutely not true.. the knicks are not going to shoot this well, just not.. they are also making a lot of threes , not necessarily great shots.. ronnie brewer is horrible 3 point shooter and he nailed two threes with someone on him, that had nothing to do with carmelo... carmelo came out and shot 10-28 the first game.. no team is paying that much attention to him.. the sixers guarded him straight up with thadeus young for most of the game..

These are guys who have been efficient their whole careers (Novak, Brewer, Chandler, Kidd, Camby when he returns). It's not Melo - it's the outstanding job Grunwald did. Obviously they're not going to stay this efficient but we will still have a very good offense.

Marcus Camby efficient? HA!

for his career he is a 46% shooter, not that good for a big man if you ask me... even for a big slasher and finisher like camby you want to see closer to 50% or higher..

Bonn1997 wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

tkf wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

MSG3 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

knickscity wrote:They are lotto without him.

I do wanna reserve the MVP talk after 3 games tho.

I think this is finally the year Melo's solidifies himself as a top NBA player. Yes we are a lotto team without him no doubt.

It depends on who he's being replaced with. If you mean the team just lost him, then yes. If you replaced him with another solid starter at the SF position, we'd still be 3-0 though. The success has more to do with the crazy scoring efficiency we're getting from several players.

Slightly disagree Bonn. I think the attention Melo has been getting frome defenses is leading to the offensive efficiency we're enjoying. Not many other players would command that kind of attention. Not sure if we'd be 3-0 or having the same success on offense (or defense for that matter) if you replace Melo with a healthy STAT, for example.

Yeah if you watched the games and see the attention he demands, you realize it is the main factor for the hot shooting. Just looking at offensive efficiency alone, i agree, this team would still be 3-0 if you take him off the team and replace him with another forward. But watching the games and understanding what you're seeing makes it very obvious the shooting is a result of a couple of things that have to do with Melo. We just wouldn't be shooting the ball this well if we didn't have a player on the floor who demands so much attention.

that is not true.. it is absolutely not true.. the knicks are not going to shoot this well, just not.. they are also making a lot of threes , not necessarily great shots.. ronnie brewer is horrible 3 point shooter and he nailed two threes with someone on him, that had nothing to do with carmelo... carmelo came out and shot 10-28 the first game.. no team is paying that much attention to him.. the sixers guarded him straight up with thadeus young for most of the game..

These are guys who have been efficient their whole careers (Novak, Brewer, Chandler, Kidd, Camby when he returns). It's not Melo - it's the outstanding job Grunwald did. Obviously they're not going to stay this efficient but we will still have a very good offense.

Marcus Camby efficient? HA!

Just looked closer at his #s. He has a great impact on the game because of his rebounding and shot-blocking but you are right that he is not efficient on offense. I thought his %s were better than they are.

Jason Kidd not to good either but his WS's for the past 3 games is .445!!!! haha