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Can We Sign Sheed?
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TheSage
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3/8/2004  8:06 PM
I don't know the rules but can we offer him mid level exception with maximum increases for say 10 years with a player opt out when the bird rights kick in?
AUTOADVERT
martin
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3/8/2004  8:37 PM
Yes.
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playa2
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3/8/2004  10:41 PM
Sheed will be a piston 4life! Detroit is a chocolate city + he will feel the love and resign and get paid in full.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
daddynel
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3/8/2004  11:05 PM
Posted by playa2:

Sheed will be a piston 4life! Detroit is a chocolate city + he will feel the love and resign and get paid in full.
think so, hope not.
EnYKnickFan
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3/8/2004  11:35 PM
Its all for the money. If sheed comes here hes a idiot with teams offering big money and championship calibur. Coming to the knicks would be a bad business move on his part.
Nalod
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3/8/2004  11:50 PM
Posted by TheSage:

I don't know the rules but can we offer him mid level exception with maximum increases for say 10 years with a player opt out when the bird rights kick in?

Sheed at 41 yrs old. Gonna look like George Clinton by then. Yeah, sign him up.
Can watch that natty spot on his head grow. I think he gonna sprout a new head soon. I think Leon in there. Leon forget to get off the train? Is Leon still on the LIRR? Somebody gotta go wake his ass up. Ok, he the big 6'11 dude with a steelhead jersey on, and face painted green. Look like he gonna puke, but he just having fun. Sumptin bout' Columbus discovering America got all under his skin. He all right, just don't buy him a canolli.
CTKnicksfan
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3/9/2004  12:33 AM
There are several ways it could go with Rasheed and the Pistons this summer. It has been speculated that one of the reasons they got Sheed was to get far enough under the cap when Sheeds contract expires to resign Memo Okur. As it stands the Pistons may or may not be able to keep both Okur and Sheed. The only way the Pistons can actually get under the cap would be to renounce Sheed's rights meaning they can't go over the cap to resign him. Until they either renounce or resign him, his previous cap number (17M) acts as a "hold" against Detroit's cap space. That said, here are some possible scenarios:

1) Pistons sign Okur for the MLE and sign Sheed using his bird rights. This is Detroit's Best case scenario. It seems unlikely though because Memo figures to get several offers in excess of the MLE. With so many temas in rebuilding mode and having cap room (Denver, Utah, Atl, etc) Okur could command a deal starting at 7-8M per. He would be taking a pay cut to stay in Detroit.
2) Pistons renounce Rasheeds bird rights and sign both Sheed and OKur to deals aboe the MLE. Probblem with this scenario is that Detroit even after renouncing sheed will only have about 8-10 mil in cap space, It's possible they could get down to about 14mil under the cap by trading some players and losing a player or two in the expansion draft. They could then offer both Sheed and Okur deals starting at about 7M each. This is more likely than the first scenario, but also unlikely. Offering only 7M to sheed in this situation maybe he could turn that down and sign for the MLE? I'm not suggesting that if Detroit used their bird rights and gave Sheed 13-14M per that he'd turn that down just to play in NYC. But if he's looking at a 7M offer from detroit and a 5.5M (mle) offer from the knicks, who knows? Ar that point, big money offers from other teams like Denver and Phoenix come into play as well.

The most likely scenario IMO is that the numbers won;t work and either Sheed or Okur will be gone from the Pistons this summer. Also, they do have #2 pick Darko waiting in the wings and keeping them both would seriously hinder his progress. I think alot will depend on how they fare in the playoffs. If they go to the ECF or NBA finals and Sheed is a big part of that, they may be inclined to keep him. If they get knocked out early, they may elect to renounce sheed, keep Okur, and go with youth on the frontline with Okur and Darko. It will be an interesting summer.
Mac
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3/9/2004  2:07 AM
Posted by CTKnicksfan:

There are several ways it could go with Rasheed and the Pistons this summer. It has been speculated that one of the reasons they got Sheed was to get far enough under the cap when Sheeds contract expires to resign Memo Okur. As it stands the Pistons may or may not be able to keep both Okur and Sheed. The only way the Pistons can actually get under the cap would be to renounce Sheed's rights meaning they can't go over the cap to resign him. Until they either renounce or resign him, his previous cap number (17M) acts as a "hold" against Detroit's cap space. That said, here are some possible scenarios:

1) Pistons sign Okur for the MLE and sign Sheed using his bird rights. This is Detroit's Best case scenario. It seems unlikely though because Memo figures to get several offers in excess of the MLE. With so many temas in rebuilding mode and having cap room (Denver, Utah, Atl, etc) Okur could command a deal starting at 7-8M per. He would be taking a pay cut to stay in Detroit.
2) Pistons renounce Rasheeds bird rights and sign both Sheed and OKur to deals aboe the MLE. Probblem with this scenario is that Detroit even after renouncing sheed will only have about 8-10 mil in cap space, It's possible they could get down to about 14mil under the cap by trading some players and losing a player or two in the expansion draft. They could then offer both Sheed and Okur deals starting at about 7M each. This is more likely than the first scenario, but also unlikely. Offering only 7M to sheed in this situation maybe he could turn that down and sign for the MLE? I'm not suggesting that if Detroit used their bird rights and gave Sheed 13-14M per that he'd turn that down just to play in NYC. But if he's looking at a 7M offer from detroit and a 5.5M (mle) offer from the knicks, who knows? Ar that point, big money offers from other teams like Denver and Phoenix come into play as well.

The most likely scenario IMO is that the numbers won;t work and either Sheed or Okur will be gone from the Pistons this summer. Also, they do have #2 pick Darko waiting in the wings and keeping them both would seriously hinder his progress. I think alot will depend on how they fare in the playoffs. If they go to the ECF or NBA finals and Sheed is a big part of that, they may be inclined to keep him. If they get knocked out early, they may elect to renounce sheed, keep Okur, and go with youth on the frontline with Okur and Darko. It will be an interesting summer.

Nice thorough post.
RonRon
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3/9/2004  2:28 AM
what i dont get is, we were over the cap when we made houston the 20million dollar man.....so wuts the difference for sheed in detriots case?
RonRon
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3/9/2004  2:36 AM
n/m i just remembered okur is a 2nd rounder
simrud
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3/9/2004  3:48 AM
One thing that everyone seems to be overlooking is that Darko is supposed to develop into a superstar at some point. If you sign Wallace to multiyear deal, and that is the only way he will sign, Darko's development will be essentially given up upon, thus making Dumars basically concede that he messed up with the pick.

I really dout that Dumars will give up so soon on his decision, and flatout out admit faliure to pick an impact player with a #2 overall pick in one of the best drafts in history of the NBA. Therefore I really can't see Detroit holding on to Sheed unless they win the title, or at least go to the finals and have a good showing, aka, not gettin swept or loosing 1-4 w/out ever threatening.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
raven
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3/9/2004  5:21 AM
Posted by simrud:

One thing that everyone seems to be overlooking is that Darko is supposed to develop into a superstar at some point. If you sign Wallace to multiyear deal, and that is the only way he will sign, Darko's development will be essentially given up upon, thus making Dumars basically concede that he messed up with the pick.

I really dout that Dumars will give up so soon on his decision, and flatout out admit faliure to pick an impact player with a #2 overall pick in one of the best drafts in history of the NBA. Therefore I really can't see Detroit holding on to Sheed unless they win the title, or at least go to the finals and have a good showing, aka, not gettin swept or loosing 1-4 w/out ever threatening.

I'm with you on the 2 points. They trust darko will developp one day, and getting sheed do not fit really with all the other parts of the team which is still a work in progress.

If they get badly beaten in the playoffs, they'll be able to get rid of him. Do not underestimate dumars, he got rid of carlisle though he had very good results.
CTKnicksfan
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3/9/2004  7:04 AM
Posted by RonRon:

what i dont get is, we were over the cap when we made houston the 20million dollar man.....so wuts the difference for sheed in detriots case?

There is no difference regarding sheed.They coould give him big money if that's what they want to do. However, they do not have bird rights to Okur, who was a 2nd round pick and has only played 2 seasons. (Bird rights kick in after 3rd season) Its the same scenario faced by Golden State with Arenas last year. The Spurs are in the same boat this summer with Manu Ginobili.
playa2
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3/9/2004  7:42 AM
IF the pistons weren't roughing teams up you could have a lil optimism about sheed coming to NY. But this team with sheed is a force as is ,so he will be a piston for life. Darko will always be a freakin project compared to his high draft position. Wallace has the fans on his side and the players backing him. The guy is a great teammate. We got Marbury, the Pistons got Wallace= and neither team's gonna give up on either one of those guys. Okur and FW ain't no threat now.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
TheSage
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3/9/2004  8:26 AM
Posted by Nalod:
Posted by TheSage:

I don't know the rules but can we offer him mid level exception with maximum increases for say 10 years with a player opt out when the bird rights kick in?

Sheed at 41 yrs old. Gonna look like George Clinton by then. Yeah, sign him up.
Can watch that natty spot on his head grow. I think he gonna sprout a new head soon. I think Leon in there. Leon forget to get off the train? Is Leon still on the LIRR? Somebody gotta go wake his ass up. Ok, he the big 6'11 dude with a steelhead jersey on, and face painted green. Look like he gonna puke, but he just having fun. Sumptin bout' Columbus discovering America got all under his skin. He all right, just don't buy him a canolli.

The point being that we offer him x # of years beyond his playing life which effectively increase his average annual compensation while playing. Its not much different in effect than deferred monies. If he is still att the top of his games at the time of opt out he can waive the balance of the contract and resign at max $'s for ashorter period thereby accelerating the deferred portion.

[Edited by - TheSage on 03/09/2004 08:26:38]
Nalod
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3/9/2004  8:51 AM
Posted by playa2:

IF the pistons weren't roughing teams up you could have a lil optimism about sheed coming to NY. But this team with sheed is a force as is ,so he will be a piston for life. Darko will always be a freakin project compared to his high draft position. Wallace has the fans on his side and the players backing him. The guy is a great teammate. We got Marbury, the Pistons got Wallace= and neither team's gonna give up on either one of those guys. Okur and FW ain't no threat now.

The guy is a great player, he is a selfish team mate. His an arse hole, but can ball.

Larry brown loves teaching young players, a front court of Okur and Darko for the next 10-15 years is doable. With Prince, thats a core of three high potential players. Problem is they can win now. In the long run, the pistons did the right thing with darko.

Detroit had done a great job that is winning now and has a great future.
Can We Sign Sheed?

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