[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Toney Douglas’ Demise In New York (Good Read)
Author Thread
KnicksFE
Posts: 20634
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/13/2011
Member: #3561

2/6/2012  4:00 PM
From BSKBALL.com

http://www.hoopsworld.com/toney-douglas%e2%80%99-demise-unpredictable-and-ultimately-destructive


Toney Douglas’ Demise In New York

It all started out innocently enough… The Knicks were looking to address their most pressing offseason need: Improving their defense by adding a quality starting center. When interim GM Glen Grunwald and the Knicks front office became aware that they had a shot at free agent Tyson Chandler, arguably the best big man on the market, Grunwald and company quickly realized they would need to think outside the box in order to reel in the big fish. In order to carve out the requisite cap space necessary to make Chandler a competitive offer, the Knicks would need to get creative. The solution the devised involved sacrificing their starting point guard, proven and accomplished veteran Chauncey Billups, via the newly instituted “amnesty clause,” which would clear nearly $14 million in cap space.
Although an admittedly risky gamble, the thinking seemed sound at the time: New York would surrender the only pure PG on their roster in order to plug the gaping hole in the middle. Was it a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul? Possibly, but the Knicks were desperate to land Chandler, an intimidating center who had helped transform the Dallas Mavericks into NBA champions just a few months earlier.
Chandler was the type of player New York had been yearning for; an intense, defensive-minded big man eager to protect the paint. And since arriving in New York, Chandler has been everything the Knicks could have asked for, and more. Averaging 11.3 ppg (converting a ridiculous NBA-best 70.7% of his FG attempts and 77% of his free-throws), 10 rebounds, 1.1 steals, and 1.3 blocks –Chandler has exceeded even wildly extreme expectations.
The other side of the wager has not faired nearly as well. When the Knicks waved goodbye to Billups, the short-term plan was to install Toney Douglas as the interim starter until a permanent replacement was found. Grunwald would soon sign Baron Davis (an amnesty clause causality himself); but with the full understanding B-Diddy wouldn’t be ready for action until February. Veteran Mike Bibby, on his last legs, was also signed off the scrap heap in hopes he might possibly find a way to contribute a few minutes a night.
But Head Coach Mike D’Antoni had reason to be cautiously optimistic that Douglas would be able to adequately perform the duties expected of a starting NBA point guard. Toney was drafted out of Florida State as a combo guard better know for his defense (he was named ACC Defensive Player of the Year in his final season at FSU) than his offensive exploits, but he was coming off his best season as a pro, as his promising play over the second half of the 2010-2011 campaign had turned some heads.
Over the final 28 games of the 2010-2011 season, Douglas averaged 13.4 ppg, 4.5 apg, and 3.2 rebounds; while shooting 43.4% from the floor and 82.9% from the free-throw stripe. TD also shot a scorching 40.5% from behind the arc. In a win over the Grizzlies in mid-March, Douglas poured in 29 points, including nine three-pointers, which tied a franchise record. He followed that up with a 20-point, 11-assist gem the next night against the Pistons.
In fact, Douglas led the entire league in three-pointers made over the second half of the 2010-2011 season.
Douglas did all this despite battling a painful shoulder injury. Last May, shortly after Boston bounced New York from the playoffs, the Knicks announced Douglas would undergo surgery to repair a torn labrum in his right (shooting) shoulder, which would sideline him for four months.
With plenty of tine to recuperate, and two NBA seasons under his belt, the hope was Douglas’ career trajectory would continue on course. The expectations weren’t outlandish.
However, the results have been far worse than any fan, analyst, GM, or coach could have imagined.
Douglas hasn’t just regressed, he’s rocketed backwards.
The particulars are NOT pretty. Compared to last season’s totals, Toney’s scoring, assist, steals, and rebounding averages are all down. Yet, his turnovers have doubled. Still, the most alarming numbers are related to his accuracy, or lack thereof. Douglas is shooting an abominable 31.9% from the floor, more than 12 points below his career percentage coming into this season. Of the 436 players that have attempted a shot in a game this season, Toney ranks 390th in FG%. 31.9% is by far the lowest percentage for any player in the NBA who is playing over 17 minutes a night and has appeared in at least 20 games.
A career 38% shooter from three-point range over his first two years in the NBA, TD is connecting on just 25% of his three-point attempts this season (24 of 96). Of the 35 NBA players that have attempted over 85 three-pointers this season, Douglas possesses the lowest accuracy rate, as no other player is shooting below even 28%.
According to ESPN’s PER Ranking, Douglas currently ranks 61st out of the 62 point guards that qualify – any PG averaging at least 6 minutes a night. Among all players, Douglas checks in at 317th overall (335 total players qualified), right behind Memphis’ Jeremy Pargo.
The Knicks backcourt currently ranks dead last in NBA in scoring (31.3 ppg), last in FG% (38.2%), and second to last in Defensive Efficiency (-11.4).
His confidence shattered and production sagging, Douglas was yanked from the starting lineup in early January. The hope was that returning to his former role as a reserve coming off the bench might snap TD out of his funk; yet things only got worse. He’s been unable to find his stroke and has often become a liability for the Knicks when he’s been on the floor.
Friday night in Boston, Douglas hit rock bottom. D’Antoni benched him the entire first half, opting to insert D-Leaguer Jeremy Lin instead. D’Antoni did end up giving Douglas some PT in the second half, but Douglas missed all three shots he attempted. Despite playing just eight minutes, Toney managed to post a team low (-9) plus-minus.
New York now finds themselves an unimaginable seven games under .500, at just 8-15 on the season.
Many pundits had always accentuated the importance of a solid PG in D’Antoni’s offensive attack. This season, it appears that concept has been proven accurate. The Knicks offense far too often grinds to a halt on important possessions, with Carmelo Anthony forced to create a shot for himself with the shot clock winding down. Amar’e Stoudemire has also been unable to find a rhythm, as no Knicks PG has been able to effectively run the pick-and-roll, a staple of D’Antoni’s offense since his days in Phoenix.
These disastrous results may end up costing D’Antoni his job…
Can the Knicks season be saved? Baron Davis, currently rehabbing his injured back and purportedly making some steady, if slow, progress, has inherited the role of “savior.” There have also been reports that Grunwald and the Knicks have explored trade options that would net them a reliable starting PG. In addition, New York will be able secure a solid free agent PG next summer via the mid-level exception (possible candidates include: Steve Nash, Raymond Felton, Jason Kidd, Kirk Hinrich, Ramon Sessions, Goran Dragic, etc.)
As for the rest of this season, the Knicks can certainly still sneak into the playoffs, but they undoubtedly need improved point guard play in order to consistently string wins together. And therein lies the problem…

AUTOADVERT
Nalod
Posts: 71160
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/6/2012  4:39 PM
Wait, I thought TD just "sucked"!

So MDA haters think that by firing MDA we can change the system to one less oriented on a PG and that cures it all?

Then next year when we get a PG, we do what?

The real question is can the dude return to form?

or does he just "Sucks"?

Anji
Posts: 25523
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 4/14/2006
Member: #1122
USA
2/6/2012  5:39 PM
Definitely would like to see a real system with all our players. TD, Shump, Chandler, Fields, Balks, JJ2, Jorts..... how aren't we a team that pulls it's shorts up, gets our hands on ball on D and extend about 3/4 court with pure activity???

I hate this coach, because all he knows is his "basketball". I think a real coach gets way more out of a team than offensive tempo and scoring.

"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
mrKnickShot
Posts: 28157
Alba Posts: 16
Joined: 5/3/2011
Member: #3553

2/6/2012  5:53 PM
Nalod wrote:Wait, I thought TD just "sucked"!

So MDA haters think that by firing MDA we can change the system to one less oriented on a PG and that cures it all?

Then next year when we get a PG, we do what?

The real question is can the dude return to form?

or does he just "Sucks"?

Nalod, you are always talking about the MDA haters like "haha you losers - you know nothing about basketball" - "this guy has more experience than you"

I don't think he is a bad coach or if someone will do better but can't you admit that he can be a stubbors ass sometimes?

His "System", which is a good system if he has a good PG in place, cannot change if he doesn't? Should TD lead the Knicks in 3 attempts while shooting 20ish pct and MDA allows him to phuck and chuck away because that is the system. If your opened you shoot! That is how this flows. Well it doesn't flow when you don't have the pieces but should MDA perhaps give him the red light ala Rondo?

I feel like he is trying to prove a point that "look you gave me a sh1tty PG and now I can't win". I don't know - it does not make any sense. It's indefensible.

You can hear MDA on the sidelines - and I've been to many games. "Just shoot, if your open, shoot ..." c'mon - tweak the damn philosophy (which can be a good one under the right circumstances) if your PG can't freakin throw the ball in the ocean!!!!!!!

And if you say that TD is doing this on his own (which I don't believe) then he certainly needs to go if he idiot TD is tuning him out.

Nalod
Posts: 71160
Alba Posts: 155
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
2/6/2012  8:55 PM

Your right, but its more like "you emotional tampon sucking starphuchs get all worked up and are not patient!"

DJMUSIC
Posts: 22906
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/30/2007
Member: #1283

2/7/2012  3:25 AM
KnicksFE wrote:From BSKBALL.com

http://www.hoopsworld.com/toney-douglas%e2%80%99-demise-unpredictable-and-ultimately-destructive


Toney Douglas’ Demise In New York

It all started out innocently enough… The Knicks were looking to address their most pressing offseason need: Improving their defense by adding a quality starting center. When interim GM Glen Grunwald and the Knicks front office became aware that they had a shot at free agent Tyson Chandler, arguably the best big man on the market, Grunwald and company quickly realized they would need to think outside the box in order to reel in the big fish. In order to carve out the requisite cap space necessary to make Chandler a competitive offer, the Knicks would need to get creative. The solution the devised involved sacrificing their starting point guard, proven and accomplished veteran Chauncey Billups, via the newly instituted “amnesty clause,” which would clear nearly $14 million in cap space.
Although an admittedly risky gamble, the thinking seemed sound at the time: New York would surrender the only pure PG on their roster in order to plug the gaping hole in the middle. Was it a case of robbing Peter to pay Paul? Possibly, but the Knicks were desperate to land Chandler, an intimidating center who had helped transform the Dallas Mavericks into NBA champions just a few months earlier.
Chandler was the type of player New York had been yearning for; an intense, defensive-minded big man eager to protect the paint. And since arriving in New York, Chandler has been everything the Knicks could have asked for, and more. Averaging 11.3 ppg (converting a ridiculous NBA-best 70.7% of his FG attempts and 77% of his free-throws), 10 rebounds, 1.1 steals, and 1.3 blocks –Chandler has exceeded even wildly extreme expectations.
The other side of the wager has not faired nearly as well. When the Knicks waved goodbye to Billups, the short-term plan was to install Toney Douglas as the interim starter until a permanent replacement was found. Grunwald would soon sign Baron Davis (an amnesty clause causality himself); but with the full understanding B-Diddy wouldn’t be ready for action until February. Veteran Mike Bibby, on his last legs, was also signed off the scrap heap in hopes he might possibly find a way to contribute a few minutes a night.
But Head Coach Mike D’Antoni had reason to be cautiously optimistic that Douglas would be able to adequately perform the duties expected of a starting NBA point guard. Toney was drafted out of Florida State as a combo guard better know for his defense (he was named ACC Defensive Player of the Year in his final season at FSU) than his offensive exploits, but he was coming off his best season as a pro, as his promising play over the second half of the 2010-2011 campaign had turned some heads.
Over the final 28 games of the 2010-2011 season, Douglas averaged 13.4 ppg, 4.5 apg, and 3.2 rebounds; while shooting 43.4% from the floor and 82.9% from the free-throw stripe. TD also shot a scorching 40.5% from behind the arc. In a win over the Grizzlies in mid-March, Douglas poured in 29 points, including nine three-pointers, which tied a franchise record. He followed that up with a 20-point, 11-assist gem the next night against the Pistons.
In fact, Douglas led the entire league in three-pointers made over the second half of the 2010-2011 season.
Douglas did all this despite battling a painful shoulder injury. Last May, shortly after Boston bounced New York from the playoffs, the Knicks announced Douglas would undergo surgery to repair a torn labrum in his right (shooting) shoulder, which would sideline him for four months.
With plenty of tine to recuperate, and two NBA seasons under his belt, the hope was Douglas’ career trajectory would continue on course. The expectations weren’t outlandish.
However, the results have been far worse than any fan, analyst, GM, or coach could have imagined.
Douglas hasn’t just regressed, he’s rocketed backwards.
The particulars are NOT pretty. Compared to last season’s totals, Toney’s scoring, assist, steals, and rebounding averages are all down. Yet, his turnovers have doubled. Still, the most alarming numbers are related to his accuracy, or lack thereof. Douglas is shooting an abominable 31.9% from the floor, more than 12 points below his career percentage coming into this season. Of the 436 players that have attempted a shot in a game this season, Toney ranks 390th in FG%. 31.9% is by far the lowest percentage for any player in the NBA who is playing over 17 minutes a night and has appeared in at least 20 games.
A career 38% shooter from three-point range over his first two years in the NBA, TD is connecting on just 25% of his three-point attempts this season (24 of 96). Of the 35 NBA players that have attempted over 85 three-pointers this season, Douglas possesses the lowest accuracy rate, as no other player is shooting below even 28%.
According to ESPN’s PER Ranking, Douglas currently ranks 61st out of the 62 point guards that qualify – any PG averaging at least 6 minutes a night. Among all players, Douglas checks in at 317th overall (335 total players qualified), right behind Memphis’ Jeremy Pargo.
The Knicks backcourt currently ranks dead last in NBA in scoring (31.3 ppg), last in FG% (38.2%), and second to last in Defensive Efficiency (-11.4).
His confidence shattered and production sagging, Douglas was yanked from the starting lineup in early January. The hope was that returning to his former role as a reserve coming off the bench might snap TD out of his funk; yet things only got worse. He’s been unable to find his stroke and has often become a liability for the Knicks when he’s been on the floor.
Friday night in Boston, Douglas hit rock bottom. D’Antoni benched him the entire first half, opting to insert D-Leaguer Jeremy Lin instead. D’Antoni did end up giving Douglas some PT in the second half, but Douglas missed all three shots he attempted. Despite playing just eight minutes, Toney managed to post a team low (-9) plus-minus.
New York now finds themselves an unimaginable seven games under .500, at just 8-15 on the season.
Many pundits had always accentuated the importance of a solid PG in D’Antoni’s offensive attack. This season, it appears that concept has been proven accurate. The Knicks offense far too often grinds to a halt on important possessions, with Carmelo Anthony forced to create a shot for himself with the shot clock winding down. Amar’e Stoudemire has also been unable to find a rhythm, as no Knicks PG has been able to effectively run the pick-and-roll, a staple of D’Antoni’s offense since his days in Phoenix.
These disastrous results may end up costing D’Antoni his job…
Can the Knicks season be saved? Baron Davis, currently rehabbing his injured back and purportedly making some steady, if slow, progress, has inherited the role of “savior.” There have also been reports that Grunwald and the Knicks have explored trade options that would net them a reliable starting PG. In addition, New York will be able secure a solid free agent PG next summer via the mid-level exception (possible candidates include: Steve Nash, Raymond Felton, Jason Kidd, Kirk Hinrich, Ramon Sessions, Goran Dragic, etc.)
As for the rest of this season, the Knicks can certainly still sneak into the playoffs, but they undoubtedly need improved point guard play in order to consistently string wins together. And therein lies the problem…

The dude Toney Douglas was liked and had each season showed some progress. Too bad about his injury/operation all nba players go
through it.


However fact is Douglas isnt a PG Will NEVER Ever learn that. His mentallity is too shoot and gamble on D..hence all he is results as
a scorer bench player with capability to hit 3's.

This yr Toney done none of that ! he been horrid and his head tells him when he cant score he dont care to do little things in game
his attention to improving passing or running a team, even rebounding over shorter guards isnt there.

He needs some D'League serious re-training. If it were not the Knicks and Douglass few 1st seasons he'd been cut!
He still has skills but I think best thing for Toney is to be in D'League to work out his issues and improve his health.
He isnt the smartest for his position at guard.

Lots of Guards dont have the mental skills make up for it with Athleticism, energy play or hustle, passing or going to boards
and just general basics basketball 101.

NONE of this Toney Douglas possess. As so goes Toney's jumper rest of his game picks up. When he cant score he's a weak
son-of-a-bitch mentally and Knicks don't need them type of players right now. You gotta be tougher I'm surprised cause DJ thought
Toney was originally tough.

Not so far this year!

Turntable Musiclover & Mix-Master-ologist
Toney Douglas’ Demise In New York (Good Read)

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy