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The big things so far this season.
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MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  8:37 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2012  8:47 AM
1. Hiring Coach Woodson has undermined Coach D'Antoni

2. Amar'e has been pushed out of his comfort zone by Melo

3. Knicks lack point guard to organize the offense on the hardwoods

Look no further. All problems stem from these three big things.

If (1.) doesn't happen, do (2.) and (3.) still mess the machine up?

If (3.) is corrected, how big is the problem of (2.) and (1.)?

If (2.) doesn't happen (Melo is not here), is the team better than 6-8 despite (1.) and (3.)?

Some questions for your consideration.

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MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  8:39 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2012  8:40 AM
To answer the first question, if the hiring of Coach Woodson doesn't happen, Amar'e's comfort zone is still forked and the point guard situation still sucks, but I think the team brings more Ill-Nasty-Heat to the table and they compete with more intensity.

Hiring Coach Woodson, to my mind, is the straw that is snapping the back of the camel.

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Knixkik
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1/19/2012  8:44 AM
I don't believe Melo has pushed Stoudemire out of his comfort zone. I believe the lack of a PG has. Same with Fields. The Melo-effect is less than most people think. It is directly connected to the PG situation. You add a PG like Nash and Stoudemire becomes back in his comfort zone, so Melo has really no impact over that. In addition, Stoudemire isn't knocking down mid range shots like he was last season when he looked like one of the best shooting PFs in the game. That aspect of his game will eventually return as he regains confidence.
MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  8:49 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2012  8:49 AM
Knixkik wrote:I don't believe Melo has pushed Stoudemire out of his comfort zone. I believe the lack of a PG has. Same with Fields. The Melo-effect is less than most people think. It is directly connected to the PG situation. You add a PG like Nash and Stoudemire becomes back in his comfort zone, so Melo has really no impact over that. In addition, Stoudemire isn't knocking down mid range shots like he was last season when he looked like one of the best shooting PFs in the game. That aspect of his game will eventually return as he regains confidence.

Strong points.

I'm looking at game logs from last year, after the trade, and Amar'e still dropped ill-nasty numbers.

Trade was February 21:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3607/gamelog;_ylt=Aq1GHo6F3OvGhTOb0Iw5AZGxPKB4?year=2010

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MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  8:50 AM
So what do you think of the Woodson-effect?
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franco12
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1/19/2012  8:50 AM
I think it might be Woodson.

Look, MDA was right to have Melo be the Point Forward, and run the offense through him.

That effort started strong, but the focus and execution has dropped.

That has nothing to do with the lack of PG, as Melo is the Point Forward.

Hurt yes, but still able to listen to his coach? Its wrist & ankle injuries, not deafness and dumbness?

Knixkik
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1/19/2012  8:51 AM
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:
Knixkik wrote:I don't believe Melo has pushed Stoudemire out of his comfort zone. I believe the lack of a PG has. Same with Fields. The Melo-effect is less than most people think. It is directly connected to the PG situation. You add a PG like Nash and Stoudemire becomes back in his comfort zone, so Melo has really no impact over that. In addition, Stoudemire isn't knocking down mid range shots like he was last season when he looked like one of the best shooting PFs in the game. That aspect of his game will eventually return as he regains confidence.

You bring strong points.

I'm looking at game logs from last year, after the trade, and Amar'e still dropped ill-nasty numbers.

Consider that in the trade we lost our closest thing to a true PG and shooting. Amare and Melo need spacing. If we are able to add the right PG and some shooting to stretch the defense then they will be able to get easy shots and it will make things so much simpler for each of them.

MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  9:02 AM
Okay, so I would amend (2.) to something like: "The combination of Melo's presence and the lack of point guard has resulted in Amar'e being squeezed out; the lack of either one of those two factors would return Amar'e to some comfort."

So if Melo did not exist and we lacked a point, Amar'e would still be able to operate with some comfort, I think.

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Knixkik
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1/19/2012  9:05 AM
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:Okay, so I would amend (2.) to something like: "The combination of Melo's presence and the lack of point guard has resulted in Amar'e being squeezed out; the lack of either one of those two factors would return Amar'e to some comfort."

So if Melo did not exist and we lacked a point, Amar'e would still be able to operate with some comfort, I think.

It would still be just as hard for him to create shots for himself without the spacing. Only difference is without Melo the offense would go thru Stoudemire every minute he is on the court. Because of this he would score his 25 per game, but still have the same difficulties.

NYKBocker
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1/19/2012  10:17 AM
PG play is the main reason for this horrible start.
nykshaknbake
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1/19/2012  10:26 AM
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:1. Hiring Coach Woodson has undermined Coach D'Antoni

2. Amar'e has been pushed out of his comfort zone by Melo

3. Knicks lack point guard to organize the offense on the hardwoods

Look no further. All problems stem from these three big things.

If (1.) doesn't happen, do (2.) and (3.) still mess the machine up?

If (3.) is corrected, how big is the problem of (2.) and (1.)?

If (2.) doesn't happen (Melo is not here), is the team better than 6-8 despite (1.) and (3.)?

Some questions for your consideration.

Ridiculous. Coach Woodson was brought in for D and all you guys are saying the D is good. (I think it's ok not great). what evidence do you have that Woodson is being disruptive?

jrodmc
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1/19/2012  10:29 AM
Woodson's presence is absolutely a direct one to one correlation to the deplorably low FG% of our two starphucques <--Nalod, that's French.
AnubisADL
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1/19/2012  10:39 AM
Atlanta's offense might not have been the prettiest but they certainly got it done scoring wise.

The offense needs to be heavily tweaked. The run and gun style isnt going to work. We need SET plays.

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MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  10:42 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/19/2012  10:43 AM
nykshaknbake wrote:
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:1. Hiring Coach Woodson has undermined Coach D'Antoni

2. Amar'e has been pushed out of his comfort zone by Melo

3. Knicks lack point guard to organize the offense on the hardwoods

Look no further. All problems stem from these three big things.

If (1.) doesn't happen, do (2.) and (3.) still mess the machine up?

If (3.) is corrected, how big is the problem of (2.) and (1.)?

If (2.) doesn't happen (Melo is not here), is the team better than 6-8 despite (1.) and (3.)?

Some questions for your consideration.

Ridiculous. Coach Woodson was brought in for D and all you guys are saying the D is good. (I think it's ok not great). what evidence do you have that Woodson is being disruptive?

Evidence? Since when should I cite academic studies when I talk sports? And for what? I never said he was disruptive.

But his presence is disruptive.

The whole deal does not compute in my brain. Woodson is an established head coach, so now he takes an assistant job? Smells like fish to me, man. And now the players, they think "our head coach is not coach enough, so they have hired another coach".

The message the player gets is that their head coach is really half a coach. How can you give your allegiance to a half-coach? And then for the other half, they don't hire a career assistant, but another head coach.

It smells like fish, man. Then you don't extend your current coach?

What message are the players getting? That D'Antoni is a lame duck and Woodson is taking over.

It's a split allegiance and the result is what you see last night against Phoenix.

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colombian0725
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1/19/2012  10:45 AM
Woodson isn't much of an upgrade
MarburyAnd1Crossover
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1/19/2012  10:45 AM
colombian0725 wrote:Woodson isn't much of an upgrade

To Dolan's mind, probably he is.

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jrodmc
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1/19/2012  10:53 AM
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:Woodson isn't much of an upgrade

To Dolan's mind, probably he is.

"...cause my Isaiah told me so...and you wouldn't lie to me Isaiah, would you daddy?"

Nalod
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1/19/2012  10:57 AM
AnubisADL wrote:Atlanta's offense might not have been the prettiest but they certainly got it done scoring wise.

The offense needs to be heavily tweaked. The run and gun style isnt going to work. We need SET plays.

Seems out problems of late are closing down the games. Our half court offense has been in need.

SET player they are.

If we don't hit our shots, the plays don't matter.

NYK3
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1/19/2012  11:02 AM
where would this team be right now if we kept Billups and maybe signed someone like Dalembert on the cheap??
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colombian0725
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1/19/2012  11:07 AM
jrodmc wrote:
MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:
colombian0725 wrote:Woodson isn't much of an upgrade

To Dolan's mind, probably he is.

"...cause my Isaiah told me so...and you wouldn't lie to me Isaiah, would you daddy?"

+1

Can we bring in the New York Rangers GM[sarcasm] . Seems like Dolan is happy with that guy. He at least build his team through the draft lol.

The big things so far this season.

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