colombian0725 wrote:He is an upgrade over bibby.

Upgrade over TD

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

The penetration for Dallas came from mainly 3 players

Barea
Terry
Dirk

and

a little of Marion at times

The post players came from Dirk and at times Marion.
Dirk is very skilled, he is has a very good handle, first step, and all around game.
As a 7 footer, he has the ability to hit 3 pointers and is very hard to defend.
He can hit the 3 pointer, making his ability to penetrate, pullup, finish, and with his speed/length/handle even tougher to guard.
He is a decent facilitator but he is much more skilled vs Amare, having a much better all around game.
Defensively, his speed, length, and quickness works very well with Tyson Chandler.
It also helps that he has a great basketball IQ.

Iman and Melo are our only players that can penetrate. However, our opponents all know this, making it harder for us and easier for our opponents defenses.
Our opponents defenses just apply a little pressure with Iman and Melo when they have the ball.
They apply even less with the rest of our players because they know they aren't comfortable in penetrating the lanes, limiting our moves.
It also doesn't help that when Iman and Melo penetrate, we do not have good spacing and movement off the basketball.
We need players to constantly move and space themselves. But not so the help defenses can cheat and beat Iman and Melo to the spot.
Its hard for our players, especially when its Melo because, NO ONE know's if Melo will pull up or take it in the paint.
For the spacing, its simple, don't stand in a area, that you aren't comfortable receiving the ball there to be a threat.
If you are standing there, you should be comfortable enough to score or make a move from there.
We got use to standing there, without moving, from the ISO's for Melo and sometimes Amare.
Sometimes our own players aren't even expecting Melo and Iman to pass because they are so use to them scoring.

I think we need to have a PG and SG that is capable of penetration with speed, quickness, and right now we don't have any players that can do that.
We should take a look at this kid as he showed he had great speed in penetration, but that was vs mainly TD's horrible defense.

I am not sure why we have such poor spacing and ball movement?
Is it because we are missing the players that can space the floor and penetrate?
I just know all the defenses we have played expect our players to have trouble penetrating.
Once Amare gets the ball, they will attack his weak handle and he is willing to dribble right in to 2-3 people regardless.
Same for Fields, they exposed this, with his inability to create and make good passes/decisions.

CrushAlot wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

I think the team looks the best when Bibby is on the floor. I am not sure why he isn't getting more minutes. Is it related to an injury or fatigue?

I notice when TD and Bibby are on the floor together, we have a high chance to not get good looks and can barely get a good looking shot.
We turn the ball over a lot and have trouble scoring. The defenses are all ready to push and score in transition even more than regularly with these 2.
With TD and Bibby together, they both can't penetrate, and that is makes the defense so much more easy to defend us.
Their defense together is also horrible, they both are not only small, but they can't seem to stay in front of their guys, breaking down our defenses too without effort.
It has been so apparent I don't understand why Dantoni still puts them on the floor together.
Why not give Jeremy Lin a chance to see if he can do something positive?

Do you guys see the same thing?

FoeDiddy wrote:

RonRon wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

I think the team looks the best when Bibby is on the floor. I am not sure why he isn't getting more minutes. Is it related to an injury or fatigue?

I notice when TD and Bibby are on the floor together, we have a high chance to not get good looks and can barely get a good looking shot.
We turn the ball over a lot and have trouble scoring. The defenses are all ready to push and score in transition even more than regularly with these 2.
With TD and Bibby together, they both can't penetrate, and that is makes the defense so much more easy to defend us.
Their defense together is also horrible, they both are not only small, but they can't seem to stay in front of their guys, breaking down our defenses too without effort.
It has been so apparent I don't understand why Dantoni still puts them on the floor together.
Why not give Jeremy Lin a chance to see if he can do something positive?

Do you guys see the same thing?

i agree... bibby looks best with shump besides him.

If you are suggesting Shumpert should play point and Bibby the 2, then I don't agree. Bunny isn't a great shooter though he had a couple of good games. Bobby needs to be running the point and setting up Amar'e and Tyson so our offense doesn't have to settle for 3 pointers all the time.

FoeDiddy wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

RonRon wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

I think the team looks the best when Bibby is on the floor. I am not sure why he isn't getting more minutes. Is it related to an injury or fatigue?

I notice when TD and Bibby are on the floor together, we have a high chance to not get good looks and can barely get a good looking shot.
We turn the ball over a lot and have trouble scoring. The defenses are all ready to push and score in transition even more than regularly with these 2.
With TD and Bibby together, they both can't penetrate, and that is makes the defense so much more easy to defend us.
Their defense together is also horrible, they both are not only small, but they can't seem to stay in front of their guys, breaking down our defenses too without effort.
It has been so apparent I don't understand why Dantoni still puts them on the floor together.
Why not give Jeremy Lin a chance to see if he can do something positive?

Do you guys see the same thing?

i agree... bibby looks best with shump besides him.

If you are suggesting Shumpert should play point and Bibby the 2, then I don't agree. Bunny isn't a great shooter though he had a couple of good games. Bobby needs to be running the point and setting up Amar'e and Tyson so our offense doesn't have to settle for 3 pointers all the time.

No wasn't suggesting that was just stating who he looks best with when playing. It's like picking between **** and crap really. None of these combos are good.

LOL

if thats the way you want to put it. He did hit 4 3pointers each game we won with limited shooting.
As a PG, you must have the ability to penetrate, he just doesn't have that ability to penetrate or defend any guards with speed/quickness at his age.
While he probably is still one of the better passers we have, I wouldn't call him a facilitator anymore.
I guess its kind of like the off guard, between Billups, Kidd, and TD.
But he doesn't have the size and defense, Billups/Kidd can play at times.

He should be playing limited minutes to begin with and we need 2 players capable of penetration when Bibby plays.
Currently that would mean Iman and Melo only...

loweyecue wrote:

RonRon wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

RonRon wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

I think the team looks the best when Bibby is on the floor. I am not sure why he isn't getting more minutes. Is it related to an injury or fatigue?

I notice when TD and Bibby are on the floor together, we have a high chance to not get good looks and can barely get a good looking shot.
We turn the ball over a lot and have trouble scoring. The defenses are all ready to push and score in transition even more than regularly with these 2.
With TD and Bibby together, they both can't penetrate, and that is makes the defense so much more easy to defend us.
Their defense together is also horrible, they both are not only small, but they can't seem to stay in front of their guys, breaking down our defenses too without effort.
It has been so apparent I don't understand why Dantoni still puts them on the floor together.
Why not give Jeremy Lin a chance to see if he can do something positive?

Do you guys see the same thing?

i agree... bibby looks best with shump besides him.

If you are suggesting Shumpert should play point and Bibby the 2, then I don't agree. Bunny isn't a great shooter though he had a couple of good games. Bobby needs to be running the point and setting up Amar'e and Tyson so our offense doesn't have to settle for 3 pointers all the time.

No wasn't suggesting that was just stating who he looks best with when playing. It's like picking between **** and crap really. None of these combos are good.

LOL

if thats the way you want to put it. He did hit 4 3pointers each game we won with limited shooting.
As a PG, you must have the ability to penetrate, he just doesn't have that ability to penetrate or defend any guards with speed/quickness at his age.
While he probably is still one of the better passers we have, I wouldn't call him a facilitator anymore.
I guess its kind of like the off guard, between Billups, Kidd, and TD.
But he doesn't have the size and defense, Billups/Kidd can play at times.

He should be playing limited minutes to begin with and we need 2 players capable of penetration when Bibby plays.
Currently that would mean Iman and Melo only...

I don't see Iman penetrating any more than Bibby does. The point is Bibby looks to set people up like a traditional point guard, Iman basically is ashhot first type player unless he proves otherwise, and he started out well in couple of games then took 5 steps back yesterday.

Bibby is still better than Iman offensively given his passing, ability to run plays and more consistent shot. Iman however is much better defensively, so it's a wash depending on matchups and what the team needs at the moment. Certainly if Iman is hot, then he needs to be in the game. Neither really penetrates, however. Lin is still the best penetrator of the group by far, but we might never get to see it. Might as well play or cut Lin so that he can go somewhere where he is valued.

RonRon wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

RonRon wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

FoeDiddy wrote:

RonRon wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Lin not playing at the end of a blowout was a bit of a surprise. I agree if he is not going to be used cut him and move on. Smith looked like a world beater against the Knicks.

With TD playing PG everybody and their mother looks like world beaters against the Knicks. But yeah he would probably be better than Bibby and a bag of chips is better than TD.

I think the team looks the best when Bibby is on the floor. I am not sure why he isn't getting more minutes. Is it related to an injury or fatigue?

I notice when TD and Bibby are on the floor together, we have a high chance to not get good looks and can barely get a good looking shot.
We turn the ball over a lot and have trouble scoring. The defenses are all ready to push and score in transition even more than regularly with these 2.
With TD and Bibby together, they both can't penetrate, and that is makes the defense so much more easy to defend us.
Their defense together is also horrible, they both are not only small, but they can't seem to stay in front of their guys, breaking down our defenses too without effort.
It has been so apparent I don't understand why Dantoni still puts them on the floor together.
Why not give Jeremy Lin a chance to see if he can do something positive?

Do you guys see the same thing?

i agree... bibby looks best with shump besides him.

If you are suggesting Shumpert should play point and Bibby the 2, then I don't agree. Bunny isn't a great shooter though he had a couple of good games. Bobby needs to be running the point and setting up Amar'e and Tyson so our offense doesn't have to settle for 3 pointers all the time.

No wasn't suggesting that was just stating who he looks best with when playing. It's like picking between **** and crap really. None of these combos are good.

LOL

if thats the way you want to put it. He did hit 4 3pointers each game we won with limited shooting.
As a PG, you must have the ability to penetrate, he just doesn't have that ability to penetrate or defend any guards with speed/quickness at his age.
While he probably is still one of the better passers we have, I wouldn't call him a facilitator anymore.
I guess its kind of like the off guard, between Billups, Kidd, and TD.
But he doesn't have the size and defense, Billups/Kidd can play at times.

He should be playing limited minutes to begin with and we need 2 players capable of penetration when Bibby plays.
Currently that would mean Iman and Melo only...

I don't see Iman penetrating any more than Bibby does. The point is Bibby looks to set people up like a traditional point guard, Iman basically is ashhot first type player unless he proves otherwise, and he started out well in couple of games then took 5 steps back yesterday.

It doesn't help that no one is moving, we literally have guys standing in the same spots that can't penetrate as well.
We only use the initial pick for Iman, usually its Tyson Chandler, and sometimes it is Amare.
We need people to move without the ball as well is what I mean, to make cuts, to set back screens for each other.
They got use to standing around when Melo calls for the ISOs.

When Iman did give up the ball, the offense didn't look any better, as no one else has the ability to penetrate or create.
Also Memphis played great defense and Rudy Gay was on fire with his shot.
Tony Allen, Conley, and Rudy Gay were harrassing Iman and Melo, they combined for many steals and scored the ball a lot, scoring in transition.
Iman stole the ball back a couple of times the same exact way.
But Memphis is quite quick, fast, and athletic, to go with a solid center in Gasol.
Last night, we also just missed a lot of shots that nearly went in and bounced out.
Once Melo went out, we were doomed, still without ball movement and barely any good shots and looks..

Watching TD and Bibby together, really hurt my eyes, Dantoni could have at least gave Jeremy Lin a chance to see what he can do...
He put a lineup out there hoping to hit 3pointers and come back, which wasn't happening without anyone able to penetrate, then kick out...

+1 To get a good 3-point shot, you have to have penetration or a dominant post presence from a good post passer. The percentages on contested 3-point shots is dramatically lower and just leads to good things for the defensive team. I do think Lin is the best penetrator by far (Melo can do it from the forward position as well), but Knicks fans really have had no chance to see it.