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Why Phoenix trade was brilliant for them
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playa2
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2/7/2004  8:58 PM
How can you say phoenix was stupid? They knew with marbury ,marion and amare they weren't gonna supplant the favorites in the west. What they are really doing is dropping some salary at sg(penny) and getting a team together who will be in their prime when Kings and Dallas will have to break up because of salary cap and free agent contracts and the Shaqs and Duncans either get older or have no more supporting cast that can handle playoff pressure. I see that as being "BRILLIANT MOVE". Getting the Suns ready to make a run as soon as the favorites lose a their edge. When milos learns to play in the NBA game along with Lampe Phoenix will be better they have 2pg's Milos and Barbosa to grow with. Joe Johnson is a STUD and so is Stoudemire along with Marion and all will still be young. You have to be blind not to see their future is BRIGHT!


[Edited by - playa2 on 02/07/2004 21:39:43]
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s3231
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2/7/2004  9:08 PM
No doubt the trade was a good one for Phoneix, they got two young players in Milos and Lampe who both have potential to become very good players in the league and they got 2 first round draft picks. The trade was also good for the Knicks though because it helps us win now. With Marbury, we are one star away from becoming a contender for the title. Plus, Penny gives us a nice spark off the bench that is very beneficial to us. Without Penny we might not have beaten Indiana. Overall, the trade was good for both teams.
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
playa2
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2/7/2004  9:38 PM
One team made the trade for the future and the other for the here and now. But who will have a better chance at winning it all(NBA TITLE). Phoenix in my opinion.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
s3231
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2/7/2004  9:50 PM
Well Phoneix does have a very bright future and they are now players in the free-agent market. But, I wouldn't say that there is a better shot that Phoneix will win the title instead of New York. Marbury is one of the best players in the NBA and he is still very young. As I said before, we are one star away from being contenders, then with a little luck who knows? Lampe has potential to be a very good player, but we don't know for sure yet. Joe Johnson has been doing very well since the Marbury trade, but I'am still not convinced that he will be one of the elite shooting guards in the NBA. You have to remember that he is scoring all of those points on a mediocre team right now. Milos can be a good PG in the league, but again he might not. Marion is a great player and he will contine to be. Amare has shown that he can be a great player, but he is not yet. Bottom line, the Suns might become a championship team or they might stuggle to make the playoffs, its too early to tell.

[Edited by - s3231 on 02/07/2004 21:52:00]
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
fishmike
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2/7/2004  10:04 PM
its a terrible trade for Pho and a total panic move. They traded away one of the most difficult pieces to find just entering his prime. They save money... yippee. They can save some more when Amare is tired of playing on a losing team. When Milos bombs, people realize why LAmpe was a 2nd rounder and the two Knick draft picks produce the next Bostjan Nachbar or Reece Gaines.

Pho is hyping the move because they have tickets to sell just like every other team. Wake up
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
bigblitz2001
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2/7/2004  10:26 PM
Posted by fishmike:

its a terrible trade for Pho and a total panic move. They traded away one of the most difficult pieces to find just entering his prime. They save money... yippee. They can save some more when Amare is tired of playing on a losing team. When Milos bombs, people realize why LAmpe was a 2nd rounder and the two Knick draft picks produce the next Bostjan Nachbar or Reece Gaines.

Pho is hyping the move because they have tickets to sell just like every other team. Wake up

I'll agree with most of this statement although I wont call Lampe and Milos busts just yet cause no one has seen them play much.

This was definately a panic move. Last yr they made the playoffs with a very young team. This yr when Amare got hurt and they struggled they traded away one of the best young players in the league. It makes no sense to me. In three yrs starbury would be in his prime and Amare will have developed with This team they could have been very scary. Getting cap space and draft picks is no gaurantee for success in the NBA (see The Bulls) I would stick with the sure thing.

Unless of course the owners were just CHEAP and didnt wanna pay the salaries and is using all of this as an excuse to save $$$.
Caseloads
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2/7/2004  10:30 PM
Posted by fishmike:

its a terrible trade for Pho and a total panic move. They traded away one of the most difficult pieces to find just entering his prime. They save money... yippee. They can save some more when Amare is tired of playing on a losing team. When Milos bombs, people realize why LAmpe was a 2nd rounder and the two Knick draft picks produce the next Bostjan Nachbar or Reece Gaines.

Pho is hyping the move because they have tickets to sell just like every other team. Wake up
I'm not from Houston, but call me lil' flip, 'cause I flip a little when I see some nonsense like what you just said fish... fo' shizzle

"when people realize why Lampe was a 2nd rounder and the two Knick draft picks produce Bostjan Nachbar or Reece Gaines" - come on fish, I love giving you the proper respect, but you just cant say something like that... two wrong things in a row, just not like you.

First of all, GMs make mistakes about players and good ballers slide to the 2nd round... example, peep C-Booz. he's tearing the league up, and wasnt anything SUPER special in his first year. the only reason he got burn was because he was playing for cleveland with Mihm (the Secret of) ahead of him, and other nonsense like Diop (who was/is a center that was often injured). Lampe was the first pick of the 2nd round, in a deep draft...

Secondly, if we traded those picks away to nonsense teams like Orlando(ugh), they'd pick reece gaines or someone like steven hunter, or ryan humphrey. But PHX does well with their draft picks, especially if they are lotto picks. At 17, they got Zarko Carbakapa, who can and does throw it down.
Caseloads
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2/7/2004  10:38 PM
Posted by bigblitz2001:
Posted by fishmike:

its a terrible trade for Pho and a total panic move. They traded away one of the most difficult pieces to find just entering his prime. They save money... yippee. They can save some more when Amare is tired of playing on a losing team. When Milos bombs, people realize why LAmpe was a 2nd rounder and the two Knick draft picks produce the next Bostjan Nachbar or Reece Gaines.

Pho is hyping the move because they have tickets to sell just like every other team. Wake up

I'll agree with most of this statement although I wont call Lampe and Milos busts just yet cause no one has seen them play much.

This was definately a panic move. Last yr they made the playoffs with a very young team. This yr when Amare got hurt and they struggled they traded away one of the best young players in the league. It makes no sense to me. In three yrs starbury would be in his prime and Amare will have developed with This team they could have been very scary. Getting cap space and draft picks is no gaurantee for success in the NBA (see The Bulls) I would stick with the sure thing.

Unless of course the owners were just CHEAP and didnt wanna pay the salaries and is using all of this as an excuse to save $$$.
marbury basically wore out his welcome there. clearly marbury needs to be on a vet team, because every team where the players were young, it was good for a bit and then it went sour. they also wanted to save $$. they realized that the team is not going to be winning anything in the tough west for a few years, so they wanted their money back, and got some young players. PHX knew they had no solid center, which you need to get over the top in the NBA... (post Jordan-era).

I'm surprised that there hasnt been another out of this world unstoppable, able to will his team to victory every night SG since Jordan. I would have thought that Kobe could have been the next Jordan, but I think coming out of HS tainted that. If kobe had won a college championship, had some legacy behind him before pro-ball, that would have helped him. But now, or even before his incident, he just comes off as a ****y insolent child... he's not the leader and tactician Jordan was.
bigblitz2001
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2/7/2004  10:40 PM
Why do you think He wore out his welcome, they just signed him to a max long term deal?
Caseloads
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2/7/2004  10:45 PM
Posted by bigblitz2001:

Why do you think He wore out his welcome, they just signed him to a max long term deal?
i remember seeing articles about him refusing to practice because of his ankles, and amare and matrix were upset with him because of that.

plus he was supposedly becoming malignant during games, and not following coaches' orders there.
martin
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2/7/2004  10:52 PM
Posted by Caseloads:
Posted by bigblitz2001:

Why do you think He wore out his welcome, they just signed him to a max long term deal?
i remember seeing articles about him refusing to practice because of his ankles, and amare and matrix were upset with him because of that.

plus he was supposedly becoming malignant during games, and not following coaches' orders there.

You know, I can see that happening. I haven't watched Pho very much, but look at the make up of the team. They have a SF who is lights out athletic but doesn't use that athletisim until a fast break happens and shoots more outsite shoots than he should. You have a 19 year old who can muscle and jump but is years away from playing real basketball. Joe Johson hasn't showed up until recently, Penny was is rehab for ever and there was no way Pho was getting past Shap, Duncan, Dallas for years. Seems like reasonable frustration.
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s3231
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2/7/2004  10:52 PM
I think the trade was good in that it gave both teams what they wanted. The Suns saved money while getting a couple of good prospects while the Knicks got their franchise player in Stephon. I really don't think the Suns would have gotten that far with Marbury, and I think this trade gives them a better shot to win in the future. If I had to choose, I would say that the Knicks got the better end of the deal but I don't see how the Suns made a "terrible trade" by getting rid of Stephon because they now have a very bright future and actually have a shot at a title in the future. Case said it perfectly, they realized that they were not going to win a title with Stephon so they got their money back and now they have some nice prospects plus they will have a decent lottery pick in the draft along with another first rounder from us.
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
martin
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2/7/2004  10:54 PM
Posted by playa2:

One team made the trade for the future and the other for the here and now. But who will have a better chance at winning it all(NBA TITLE). Phoenix in my opinion.

WOW.
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tkf
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2/7/2004  11:07 PM
this is typical playa BS, his pure psycho babble crap. Anyone can see that pheonix was trying to dump salary and is in serious spin control, when will that team start blaming marion, and amare and the other scrub role players for not being good enough to contribute when will colangelo take responsibility for not surrounding Kidd and Marbury with the right mix of talent? This trade was great for the knicks a great young star Pg not yet in his prime even for a bunch of maybe pieces, playa does not realize that the chance of milos and lampe becomming bust are greater than than them becomming very good, that is how this league goes, not every euro player is going to be good, this league has been fooled and that is why detroit has milicic instead of Anthony, and yes they will spin it just like playa did, in his own stupid way...

Only a pheonix homer or a fool (like playa) would hype up such a trade and create a thread about it!!
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
playa2
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2/7/2004  11:13 PM
My 1st post pretty much sums it up.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
s3231
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2/7/2004  11:15 PM
Everyone is acting like Lampe has no game at all. The kid can play, he averageed 17 points and 7 rebounds in the summer league. I don't think he will become as good as Dirk Nowitzki, but he has enough talent to become a very good NBA player. Milos on the other hand, I'm not sure of, but from what I have seen of him, he is not bad at all. I think that the Knicks got the better end, but Phoneix didn't get a bad deal either.
"This is a very cautious situation that we're in. You have to be conservative in terms of using your assets and using them wisely. We're building for the future." - Zeke (I guess not protecting a first round pick is being conservative)
playa2
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2/7/2004  11:25 PM
They already have a low post threat(AMARE) and have 3 pg to choose from young Milos+Barbosa and Eisely as a back up who had a good game again 14 pts and 7 assist2 stl and 2 reb. AMARE had 10 blks tonight
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Caseloads
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2/7/2004  11:52 PM
Posted by s3231:

Everyone is acting like Lampe has no game at all. The kid can play, he averageed 17 points and 7 rebounds in the summer league. I don't think he will become as good as Dirk Nowitzki, but he has enough talent to become a very good NBA player. Milos on the other hand, I'm not sure of, but from what I have seen of him, he is not bad at all. I think that the Knicks got the better end, but Phoneix didn't get a bad deal either.
if lampe gave up the trey, and lived on the low blocks, he'd be a good center. the kid is all of 18. he really is a kid, but mind numbing to see an 18 year old have skills like him. lampe is never going to be a dirk, just doesnt have the speed. he'd be better off being a arvydas sabonis (spelling?)
tkf
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2/8/2004  1:00 AM
Listen: lampe is not a bum, the kid is 19 with some nice skills but to say that this was brilliant for the suns who gave up a young PG Stud in marbury and got back two potentially good euro players and a mid round draft pick was brilliant is way over the top, way over, that is why people are getting sick and tired of this, we get a great player, give up a bunch of maybeys and all of a sudden it was brilliant for the suns..LOL.. and lets be real, I like a lampe a lot but the guy is slow, and unathletic, unlike his counterparts, dirk, pedja and to some extend Radmanovic, these guys are pretty good athletes very mobile, and quick, lampe has the make up of a post player but the desire to play outside, that I think is his problem....

Milos is just a scared chump, I lost respect for that clown..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Rich
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2/8/2004  5:54 AM
Posted by playa2:

How can you say phoenix was stupid? They knew with marbury ,marion and amare they weren't gonna supplant the favorites in the west. What they are really doing is dropping some salary at sg(penny) and getting a team together who will be in their prime when Kings and Dallas will have to break up because of salary cap and free agent contracts and the Shaqs and Duncans either get older or have no more supporting cast that can handle playoff pressure. I see that as being "BRILLIANT MOVE". Getting the Suns ready to make a run as soon as the favorites lose a their edge. When milos learns to play in the NBA game along with Lampe Phoenix will be better they have 2pg's Milos and Barbosa to grow with. Joe Johnson is a STUD and so is Stoudemire along with Marion and all will still be young. You have to be blind not to see their future is BRIGHT!
[Edited by - playa2 on 02/07/2004 21:39:43]

You think it was a "BRILLIANT MOVE" because you're are making unwarranted assumptions:

1) That they will use their draft choices well.

2) That Duncan will show signs of age any time soon, which considering he is only 27 years old, is unlikely.

3) That Amare, with his potential emotional problems, won't implode.

4) That the Nuggets and the Clippers, with abundant talent, won't replace Dallas and the Kings, if in fact they eventually face cap problems.

5) That a gutless player like Vujanic, who was too scared to play in NY, will ever be anything more than a marginal talent.

6) That slow footed, unathletic Lampe, with a questionable work ethic, will ever be a good player.

A "BRILLIANT MOVE" would have been to make it work with Amare, Marion, Johnson and Steph, and then add to that core with a player acquired with the MLE, or through a trade.

You continue to show your bias with every new post.

[Edited by - Rich on 02/08/2004 05:55:36]
Why Phoenix trade was brilliant for them

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