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Why Norris gets time over FW
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simrud
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2/2/2004  4:40 PM
I think there is a good explanation to this after all.
The thing is Norris is very well suited to play about 6-8 minutes a game, just recall his games. He has a very good strech for the first 6-8 minutes he is out there, making a shot or two and runnnig pushing the ball. You can't keep him in longer cause he starts to mess up, but that is why he is a backup.
FW is much better sutied to starting, he needs the minutes, similar to Anderson. Once he gets 20+ he is very good. But in 8 minutes FW is not effective at all. Once again recall his 8- minutes games. He was not able to do much there was he.
The idea here is that while FW is a much better player he can't be an 8 minute backup, while Norris is made for such a role. It is just a bad brake for FW that Seph needs to play 40 min a night.
The only solution here is to tradr FW for both his good and our benefit since he has some trade value right now for a team in need of a PG. We on the other hand need an athletic bigman. Try to swing a deal for Wilcox or something of that nature.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
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letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  4:53 PM
WRONG AGAIN! the reason that Frank isn't gettin minutes is because Thomas doesn't want any player from the Layden era getting any glory on his watch. He wants to put his stamp on the team and prove that his built team was better. Don't you get it? First Vranes(he was wak) then fatspoon then dyess... wants to move shandon and layden drafted frank williams. i think even a fool like yourself should realize this. Lenny is most likely going along with what Isiah is telling him(not saying for sure)
Frank Williams could do wonders with the minutes that moochie gets. are you blind? Moochie is a turnover waiting to happen, and look at Frank's plus/minus ratio along with his turnover ratio.
Are you telling me that moochie is better than Frank given 10mins? Are you kidding me. Open your eyes!
MaTT4281
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2/2/2004  5:43 PM
Franky just needs to show wat hes worth to lenny. when he finally showed chaney, marbury came. Now lenny's here and frank has to show him that he should b playing ahead of moochie. Once he does that, we wont be seeing moochie closing out games like he did vs. phoenix
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  5:51 PM
like shandon said. there videos made for any game a player plays, any practice a player has. isn't lenny smart enough or experienced enough to know this? i definately think he is. Shouldn't he atleast know how frank plays and how much he helps the team while on the floor. there's a majority against lenny concerning frank, including the experts. Why do you think there are articles being written about him concerning this situation? If he didn't deserve it, would we even care? no, not exactly.
playa2
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2/2/2004  5:58 PM
Sometime knicks fans are blinded by the facts right in front of them. Moochie Norris is a bum and won't get any better with playing time. On the other hand Frank Williams was compared to Clyde Frazier by Zeke himself. I can give thomas credit for bringing back the buzz, but if there isn't any honey left in the cone I'm not buying it.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
Mac
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2/2/2004  6:01 PM
letitbeheard- you seem awefully ****y for just retyping what someone else speculated. Everyone's heard of that, and frankly, it's garbage. Isiah is too smart to not keep a potential ace on "his team" just because someone else picked him up. He's going to do the best he can with what he has. You should really open your mouth smaller next time. Maybe you won't put your foot in it.
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  6:03 PM
Posted by Mac:

letitbeheard- you seem awefully ****y for just retyping what someone else speculated. Everyone's heard of that, and frankly, it's garbage. Isiah is too smart to not keep a potential ace on "his team" just because someone else picked him up. He's going to do the best he can with what he has. You should really open your mouth smaller next time. Maybe you won't put your foot in it.
what is your point? what are you suggesting?
Mac
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2/2/2004  6:04 PM
*coughs* coaches decide playing time.
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  6:14 PM
Posted by Mac:

*coughs* coaches decide playing time.
do you really think so? do you think lenny is blind enough for this? do you think isiah hasn't said anything to lenny concerning him? first shandon, then frank? why is shandon now the starter instead of his well know player, hardaway? did he finally realize? was it shandon's threats of sort? he can't be traded but he could sure becaome a bit of a problem throughout the season. he's not frank, a second year player. he's a vet.
do you want Frank traded? i never said i never wanted that! i only told my opinions. i want him to get traded now, he is a good trade value, nothing if he sits on the bench for us for a guy like moochie.
btw, i could careless if somebody stated already what i said. i don't care for it. i stated my opinions about the situation in this thread concerning Frank William! DO YOU GET ME NOW?
Silverfuel
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2/2/2004  6:17 PM
The Knicks are winning! They are in 7th place! There is plenty of positives fellas. Frank will play more after the trading deadline, i'm sure of it!
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  6:25 PM
Posted by Silverfuel:

The Knicks are winning! They are in 7th place! There is plenty of positives fellas. Frank will play more after the trading deadline, i'm sure of it!
That's the only thing that we have. Winning is the key. i care about Frank's situation but as long as we are winning, i am very happy. What happens when in those 10mins, moochie ruins it enough that even marb can't come in and rescue, for some string of games? Shouldn't lenny be smart enough to realize that it's better for frank(clearly a better point) to be fit in now, while it's still a bit of games left in the season? then the playoffs. it don't get it! there's too much that has gone on for me to not be concerned.
but again, as long as we are winning, it's all good with me.
Mac
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2/2/2004  6:28 PM
I said you were "overly confident" in a foolish idea that is not revolutionary ... I don't believe that conspiracy theory cr*p that Isiah suggests to coaches who to play. There's no proof, and there are too many variables behind the scenes to know for sure.
gunsnewing
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2/2/2004  7:03 PM
hopefully if Frank is still here after the allstar break he gets in the rotation and Moochie gets off so he can be the insurance player he is and was in Houston, the 3rd string point guard.
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  7:03 PM
Posted by Mac:

I said you were "overly confident" in a foolish idea that is not revolutionary ... I don't believe that conspiracy theory cr*p that Isiah suggests to coaches who to play. There's no proof, and there are too many variables behind the scenes to know for sure.
it's a belief! as foolish as you might think it is. everybody has their own idea or opinions whether people said it before or not. and you mention that there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes between these peopople. chaney starting eisly because of laydummy. did you believe that? who care, its an idea that might the right or wrong. i didn't mean to be that emphatic but that's the way it comes out sometimes when your trying to tell your opinions. You had no right to insult me because you had different beliefs or opinions!
Mac
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2/2/2004  7:06 PM
Then I apologize. I did it in the first place because you called teh other guy a fool.
MaseInYourFace
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2/2/2004  7:12 PM
you and your silly conspiracy theories. open your eyes--isiah is moving layden players because THEYRE THE ONLY ONES HERE. OPEN YOUR MIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol lol lol
maybe he could move some of his own players if HE DIDNT JUST TAKE OVER THE JOB-get a clue.

do any of you think that maybe moochie gets more playing time because he isnt working harder in practice or has a better idea of where the ball should go according to Lenny?

your conspiracy theories are pretty funny and are pure guess work.
Posted by letitbeheard:

WRONG AGAIN! the reason that Frank isn't gettin minutes is because Thomas doesn't want any player from the Layden era getting any glory on his watch. He wants to put his stamp on the team and prove that his built team was better. Don't you get it? First Vranes(he was wak) then fatspoon then dyess... wants to move shandon and layden drafted frank williams. i think even a fool like yourself should realize this. Lenny is most likely going along with what Isiah is telling him(not saying for sure)
Frank Williams could do wonders with the minutes that moochie gets. are you blind? Moochie is a turnover waiting to happen, and look at Frank's plus/minus ratio along with his turnover ratio.
Are you telling me that moochie is better than Frank given 10mins? Are you kidding me. Open your eyes!
Yes! - Marv Albert
letitbeheard
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2/2/2004  7:26 PM
you and your silly conspiracy theories. open your eyes--isiah is moving layden players because THEYRE THE ONLY ONES HERE. OPEN YOUR MIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol lol lol
maybe he could move some of his own players if HE DIDNT JUST TAKE OVER THE JOB-get a clue.
do any of you think that maybe moochie gets more playing time because he isnt working harder in practice or has a better idea of where the ball should go according to Lenny?

your conspiracy theories are pretty funny and are pure guess work.
Dude, did you even read the title of the thread? The opinions of the starter of the thread? isn't that a threory? get a clue... i can write my opinions and thinking on the topic, can't I? my opinions on frank are clearly stated? moochie deserves the job? have you really openned you eyes while frank in playing in the game. you sound clue-less as to what kind of a game he has! He makes the team better . stop the sentimental crap about him deserving it in practice and playing hard there. you should damn well know that having more turnovers than assists when it really counts doesn't really deserve playing time. Maybe you could argue the same for eisley then?
MaseInYourFace
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2/2/2004  7:34 PM

you and i have no idea if frank is doing anything wrong in the running of the offense. i don't like moochie's game very much at all, but doesn't mean frank didnt do anything wrong to go in the dog house.
Posted by letitbeheard:
you and your silly conspiracy theories. open your eyes--isiah is moving layden players because THEYRE THE ONLY ONES HERE. OPEN YOUR MIND!!!!!!!!!!!!!! lol lol lol
maybe he could move some of his own players if HE DIDNT JUST TAKE OVER THE JOB-get a clue.
do any of you think that maybe moochie gets more playing time because he isnt working harder in practice or has a better idea of where the ball should go according to Lenny?

your conspiracy theories are pretty funny and are pure guess work.
Dude, did you even read the title of the thread? The opinions of the starter of the thread? isn't that a threory? get a clue... i can write my opinions and thinking on the topic, can't I? my opinions on frank are clearly stated? moochie deserves the job? have you really openned you eyes while frank in playing in the game. you sound clue-less as to what kind of a game he has! He makes the team better . stop the sentimental crap about him deserving it in practice and playing hard there. you should damn well know that having more turnovers than assists when it really counts doesn't really deserve playing time. Maybe you could argue the same for eisley then?
Yes! - Marv Albert
simrud
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2/2/2004  8:01 PM
Look your conspiracy theory is complete bs. Just like all other conspiracy theories out there. There is either a good reason behidn not playing FW or there is none and like somebody said before he will play over Norris eventually. And in order to do that he must show that he can do good things in limited time. That's all I'm saying. At least what I am saying is based on actualy facts, not some wacko idea that you got in your head because you read in a newspaper one day and have toyed with it for so long you think its yours and original.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
Andrew
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2/2/2004  8:05 PM
letitbeheard...simrud had a valid take on the situation...you may not agree but posting stuff like 'WRONG AGAIN' is not what this forum is about. You didn't caounter any of his points with a valid arguement of any kind.

Take a look at Moochie's and Frank's assist to turnover ratio while playing for the Knicks. Although very close...Moochies is suprisingly better.

The players that Isiah has gottem rid of have been from the Layden era...and every one of them had been underperforming or not performing at all. Can't argue with that.
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Why Norris gets time over FW

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