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If Berman says its true it must be... Walsh wont overpay for Melo
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fishmike
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1/13/2011  7:52 AM
Walsh not willing to give up too much to snag Anthony
By MARC BERMAN

Last Updated: 5:20 AM, January 13, 2011

Posted: 2:59 AM, January 13, 2011

SALT LAKE CITY -- Of the concerns team president Donnie Walsh has in breaking up the Knicks for Carmelo Anthony, one of them is having to use Anthony Randolph in a deal with the Timberwolves for a first-round pick, The Post has learned.

With a new report suggesting Anthony may not sign an extension with the Nets, with that three-team deal on hold and Amar'e Stoudemire texting Anthony to tell him to spurn Jersey, the Knicks have some new life, though they still appear long shots.

The best-case scenario for the 22-16 Knicks, who lost 131-125 to the Jazz last night, is for the Nuggets to get desperate if Anthony officially shuns the Nets and demands a New York trade. The Rockets reportedly will swoop in, too, and could be willing to offer more than Walsh.

The Knicks feel Anthony holds all the cards, and Walsh plans to play the cards he has carefully, not desperately. He is unwilling to give up too much for Anthony, team sources said yesterday.

Walsh is waffling on whether he even wants to part with Randolph to gain a first-round pick from the Timberwolves, a selection he possibly would have to ship with two of three prospects -- Danilo Gallinari, rookie sensation Landry Fields or restricted free agent Wilson Chandler.

Walsh will not give up three of those four players, knowing the Knicks' biggest need is a legit starting center. Sources said restricted free agents Marc Gasol and Clippers 7-footer DeAndre Jordan are squarely on the radar this summer, and that's a big priority.

For now, the Knicks wait patiently on the periphery, realizing Anthony's advisors are eager to drag them into the race to give the Nets competition. The Knicks' chances, sources say, have been helped slightly because the prospects who could be available to Denver have played well.

Having Stoudemire's support on a Anthony trade is also a factor, league sources believe.

On Monday, the Nuggets reportedly made a threat to Nets management about trading him to the Knicks if leaks on their trade talks don't stop.

Even by gaining a first-round pick to trade, it still may not be enough to satisfy Denver, which would get two first-rounders from the Nets.

Walsh has hoped Anthony's desire to play for the Knicks would prompt him to go to free agency this summer when the Knicks have cap room.

With the Knicks winning, developing a great chemistry and having players at Anthony's position, but not at center, Walsh is more likely to give a modest proposal unsuitable to the Nuggets.

Walsh believes the club has a lot of solid small-forward types such as Anthony but what they need is a "beast" of a center to get them to the next level.

The Knicks have for months been long shots for Anthony because they don't have two suitable first-round picks to offer in a deal like the Nets do. Nevertheless, the Knicks, according to a league source, have a contingent deal in place with Minnesota to trade Randolph for a Timberwolves 2011 first-round pick. The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season because they league rules prohibit them from going two straight years without one.

Though the 6-foot-11 Randolph is out of the rotation and seemingly off coach Mike D'Antoni's radar, Walsh is unsure he wants to give up on him because he is just 21 years old, and size and athleticism is a rare commodity. D'Antoni, however, does not like Randolph's in-game demeanor and he doesn't carry a high-enough motor.

D'Antoni has talked about developing 7-foot-1 center Timofey Mozgov for later this season, making a comparison to Toney Douglas' rookie season. Douglas took over the starting point guard role in the final month when D'Antoni felt he was ready for it.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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Bonn1997
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1/13/2011  7:55 AM
Yeah but you're overpaying him if you give him a max contract extension
crzymdups
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1/13/2011  7:57 AM
Sources said restricted free agents Marc Gasol and Clippers 7-footer DeAndre Jordan are squarely on the radar this summer, and that's a big priority.

who are the sources on this? ultimateknicks.com?

¿ △ ?
FrenchKnicks
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1/13/2011  8:08 AM
"The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season because they league rules prohibit them from going two straight years without one."

How can the league force you to acquire a 1st round pick ? I understand that they can forbid you to trade a 1st round pick if you didn't have one the year before, but I'm sure they can't force you to trade for one !

Is that another Berman nonsense idea ?

orangeblobman
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Nauru
1/13/2011  8:11 AM
crzymdups wrote:
Sources said restricted free agents Marc Gasol and Clippers 7-footer DeAndre Jordan are squarely on the radar this summer, and that's a big priority.

who are the sources on this? ultimateknicks.com?

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
orangeblobman
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1/13/2011  8:13 AM
FrenchKnicks wrote:"The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season because they league rules prohibit them from going two straight years without one."

How can the league force you to acquire a 1st round pick ? I understand that they can forbid you to trade a 1st round pick if you didn't have one the year before, but I'm sure they can't force you to trade for one !

Is that another Berman nonsense idea ?

I don't understand that either. I know you can't trade away a first-round pick two years in a row.

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
GustavBahler
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1/13/2011  8:17 AM
That's why I'm glad Walsh hasn't panicked. Melo' knows that the Knicks will have a more competitive roster if he waits until the summer to sign. Is it just about playing at the Garden? Is he just as interested in contending from day one? Unless Walsh gets an offer he can't refuse its up to Melo to make the right call. I believe Walsh knows that.
Nalod
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1/13/2011  8:40 AM
Knicks are no fools.

melo won't get a max deal here cuz we already have one and CBA will chop it down anyway. He'll get Lebron-Wade-Bosh money. Thats the going rate to be in a "boy band".

Then you use Chandler or Gallo as a centerpiece in a sign and trade for one of the young bigs mentioned by Briggs and made public by The Burr Man. Turiafs ending contract and play level is also a good trading chip.

Keep developing MOZ and AR for bench duty. See not what they are but what they can be. AR will have a very busy summer. Its been said by others that his ankle might not have healed enough and his play suffered. He should be right about now but maybe his mind has not healed.

Then you have a proper balanced team.

Not sure who starts or not but its doable.

Im not the one to lead the vision but Donnie showed us what we did not see before and can take the whole thing up a notch. Melo can join somthing special or have his own team. His choice.

I think he takes the money and is holding out for knicks to bone up an offer.

If he leaves money on the table and "Joins" us I will hold him in very high regard. That kind of buy in and commitment will go a long way with his team mates.

FrenchKnicks
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1/13/2011  9:48 AM
Nalod wrote:Knicks are no fools.

melo won't get a max deal here cuz we already have one and CBA will chop it down anyway. He'll get Lebron-Wade-Bosh money. Thats the going rate to be in a "boy band".

Then you use Chandler or Gallo as a centerpiece in a sign and trade for one of the young bigs mentioned by Briggs and made public by The Burr Man. Turiafs ending contract and play level is also a good trading chip.

Keep developing MOZ and AR for bench duty. See not what they are but what they can be. AR will have a very busy summer. Its been said by others that his ankle might not have healed enough and his play suffered. He should be right about now but maybe his mind has not healed.

Then you have a proper balanced team.

Not sure who starts or not but its doable.

Im not the one to lead the vision but Donnie showed us what we did not see before and can take the whole thing up a notch. Melo can join somthing special or have his own team. His choice.

I think he takes the money and is holding out for knicks to bone up an offer.

If he leaves money on the table and "Joins" us I will hold him in very high regard. That kind of buy in and commitment will go a long way with his team mates.

I agree 100% on that. Best path to building a dynasty in two years (we're in Year 1).

fishmike
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1/13/2011  10:09 AM
there are a lot of problems with Melo scenarios that people around here simply refuse to look at.

Melo is not a ball mover, and this team thrives on ball movement
Melo is not commited to defense, and this team plays best when guys are defending
Melo is going to cost a fortune
Melo plays the same position as our best 3 young players. Fields/Gallo/Chandler are all versatile 3s than can slide into different positions
Melo is not a superstar. He's an all star.

I just hope when and if we get him the cost is reasonable and he buys into what we are doing here, because we are doing pretty good without him

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
BRIGGS
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1/13/2011  10:14 AM
How much more wing production can 1 team have? We need to up the ante at the starting 5 and the back up 1 +4. Randolph looks like he wants to be in Louisiana--Eddy Curry has been good on the bench--I have noticed he has been honestly been cheering for the team consistently--Randolph could care less--he needs to be out.
RIP Crushalot😞
jrodmc
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1/13/2011  10:18 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/13/2011  10:18 AM
BRIGGS wrote:--Eddy Curry has been good on the bench--I have noticed he has been honestly been cheering for the team consistently--

Yeah, and he makes sure the bus is warmed up early after morning shoot arounds. It's not easy sitting on every seat on the bus before everyone else starts leaving practice...very valuable asset to the team.

grillco
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1/13/2011  10:27 AM
Nalod wrote:Knicks are no fools.

melo won't get a max deal here cuz we already have one and CBA will chop it down anyway. He'll get Lebron-Wade-Bosh money. Thats the going rate to be in a "boy band".

Then you use Chandler or Gallo as a centerpiece in a sign and trade for one of the young bigs mentioned by Briggs and made public by The Burr Man. Turiafs ending contract and play level is also a good trading chip.

Keep developing MOZ and AR for bench duty. See not what they are but what they can be. AR will have a very busy summer. Its been said by others that his ankle might not have healed enough and his play suffered. He should be right about now but maybe his mind has not healed.

Then you have a proper balanced team.

Not sure who starts or not but its doable.

Im not the one to lead the vision but Donnie showed us what we did not see before and can take the whole thing up a notch. Melo can join somthing special or have his own team. His choice.

I think he takes the money and is holding out for knicks to bone up an offer.

If he leaves money on the table and "Joins" us I will hold him in very high regard. That kind of buy in and commitment will go a long way with his team mates.

This is the understood and agreed upon ideal on UK, except for Briggs...right? No one would reject Melo as a Knick, we'd all just prefer he comes to NY as a FA. I know the "money" he would passing up, but he'd make up for it easily in bigger and more endorsements. The nets have their fans and there will be an increased NY fanship once they move to Brooklyn, but the Knicks ARE New York basketball, the way the Lakers ARE Los Angeles basketball. There are more Knick fans and therefore more money to be made as a Knick in the long run.

Get ready for a rant:

I talk to folks all the time about how the global aspect of modern life makes playing in big markets unnecessary. From the aspect of recognition/fame that's true, but NY (and LA) takes things to another level. You have an instant pool of potentially millions more fans than other markets can provide. And winning a championship in NY as NY's REAL team...you become a legend. Hakim isn't necessarily talked about on the same level as Walt because Walt won his rings as a Knick...37 years ago! And even if he is his two rings 15 year ago in Houston don't carry anymore cache than NY's two nearly 40-year old rings. Messier's most famous and recognized ring came as a Ranger. Reggie's fame is as a Yankee. New York is the city of champions and with good reason. All this smack folks are talking about Melo disappears if he wins some rings in NY. And if he can do it while stopping LeBron from doing the same, he becomes one of the greatest of all time. It's what happened to Barkley, Malone, Ewing, etc., etc., and so forth. We know they were great, but Jordan and Pippen, with a small window for Hakim, define their era. If Melo wants a piece of that, wants to have his best chance at that...he comes to NY as a FA next summer.

grillco
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1/13/2011  10:40 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/13/2011  11:11 AM
fishmike wrote:there are a lot of problems with Melo scenarios that people around here simply refuse to look at.

Melo is not a ball mover, and this team thrives on ball movement
Melo is not commited to defense, and this team plays best when guys are defending
Melo is going to cost a fortune
Melo plays the same position as our best 3 young players. Fields/Gallo/Chandler are all versatile 3s than can slide into different positions
Melo is not a superstar. He's an all star.

I just hope when and if we get him the cost is reasonable and he buys into what we are doing here, because we are doing pretty good without him

Melo hasn't played in or been asked ot play in this type of system, I'm guessing he can adapt.

The Knicks defense is far from stellar though and Melo would work fine within it. Lupica pointed out the other day that D'Antoni views his defense as good as long as his team scores more than the other team when the buzzer sounds. So if that means winning 127 to 125, that's "better" defense.

Great players cost a lot of money, it's a basic principle of professional sports. And the fortune decreases significantly if he's acquired via free agency.

Melo generally puts up offensive stats that are equal to two of those guys combined. What's more any of them can be moved to play the two and/or be the backups for the 2-3, 2-4, or 3-4 positions if Melo is acquired as a free agent. If he's acquired via trade, two of those guys are likely gone anyway, so that won't matter.

On the last point I'll have to respectfully disagree. There are Stars, All-Stars, and even Super-Stars of varying levels. He may not be the biggest or best Super-Star, but he's more/better than the majority of All-Stars.

Paladin55
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1/13/2011  10:40 AM
orangeblobman wrote:
FrenchKnicks wrote:"The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season because they league rules prohibit them from going two straight years without one."

How can the league force you to acquire a 1st round pick ? I understand that they can forbid you to trade a 1st round pick if you didn't have one the year before, but I'm sure they can't force you to trade for one !

Is that another Berman nonsense idea ?

I don't understand that either. I know you can't trade away a first-round pick two years in a row.

Hell- you don't have to trade for a #1, but if Denver wants #1s and we want Melo, you have to pick up the other #1 somewhere.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
iSergio
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1/13/2011  10:45 AM
fishmike wrote:there are a lot of problems with Melo scenarios that people around here simply refuse to look at.

Melo is not a ball mover, and this team thrives on ball movement
Melo is not commited to defense, and this team plays best when guys are defending
Melo is going to cost a fortune
Melo plays the same position as our best 3 young players. Fields/Gallo/Chandler are all versatile 3s than can slide into different positions
Melo is not a superstar. He's an all star.

I just hope when and if we get him the cost is reasonable and he buys into what we are doing here, because we are doing pretty good without him

Do you consider Paul Pierce a SuperStar?

Paladin55
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1/13/2011  11:21 AM
Aren't you also able to make a pick, and then trade the rights to the pick to another team AFTER you make that pick, thereby bypassing the league rule on not being able to give away consecutive picks?
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
Paladin55
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1/13/2011  11:25 AM
grillco wrote:Melo hasn't played in or been asked ot play in this type of system, I'm guessing he can adapt.

Actually, he has-in the Olympics- and MDA was his offensive coach.

Does anyone have candid comments, or rumors, about what MDA thought of Melo's play?

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
martin
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1/13/2011  12:11 PM
FrenchKnicks wrote:"The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season because they league rules prohibit them from going two straight years without one."

How can the league force you to acquire a 1st round pick ? I understand that they can forbid you to trade a 1st round pick if you didn't have one the year before, but I'm sure they can't force you to trade for one !

Is that another Berman nonsense idea ?

you are reading the sentence incorrectly. The league isn't forcing the Knicks to acquire a first round pick, they already have one this year, it's their own pick (and thus the words "The Knicks have to own a first-round pick this season") or it's the Houston pick in case of a swap.

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joec32033
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1/13/2011  12:46 PM
iSergio wrote:
fishmike wrote:there are a lot of problems with Melo scenarios that people around here simply refuse to look at.

Melo is not a ball mover, and this team thrives on ball movement
Melo is not commited to defense, and this team plays best when guys are defending
Melo is going to cost a fortune
Melo plays the same position as our best 3 young players. Fields/Gallo/Chandler are all versatile 3s than can slide into different positions
Melo is not a superstar. He's an all star.

I just hope when and if we get him the cost is reasonable and he buys into what we are doing here, because we are doing pretty good without him

Do you consider Paul Pierce a SuperStar?

Fish, most of those same questions were asked about Amare before we signed him.

~You can't run from who you are.~
If Berman says its true it must be... Walsh wont overpay for Melo

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