[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Zeke is to blame
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
1/28/2004  7:04 AM
Everbody talking about Leny doesn't know the players enough well Zeke should have kept one of CHaney's assistants to run the team(brendan malone) then that wouldn't be an excuse. Just proves the signing of Marbury and Wilkens was about tickets sales , but in all reality it's about to blow up in Zekes face. Another thing is this Wilkens says he saw something with Frank Williams in practice that moved him ahead of moochie right. Well Zeke doesn't want frank to play too much at the pg position because it's gonna show that we didn't need to trade for marbury because we already had one in frank Williams. Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

[Edited by - gogetit on 01/28/2004 07:11:52]
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
AUTOADVERT
Andrew
Posts: 26600
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #1
USA
1/28/2004  8:21 AM
Honestly the whole "Zeke brought Steph to NY to increase ticket sales" has gotten its fill of forum time. I mean how many threads can you post it in? Sure he sells more tickets, but Isiah is trying to win, and bringing Steph here gets us closer to that.

Care to elaborate on the following:

Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

How are rotations and playoffs vs a Championship related? I missed the point.
PURE KNICKS LOVE
jhferry
Posts: 20089
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/24/2003
Member: #447
1/28/2004  8:24 AM
Frank Williams is not even close to marburys level. What isnt based on ticket sales. If you win, you wont sell tickets. The Knicks like anyone else need a star to draw, now they have one. Besides, the first athletic player that comes along and franks gonna be gone.
TheSage
Posts: 21039
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 2/20/2003
Member: #386
1/28/2004  9:34 AM
Only a fool would say that the knx are not a better team today than they were a month ago. They lost to a team with a man considered by most experts to be th ebest player in the league on a night when he was on and a night on which Houston was hurt, KVH was hurt and Marbury was hurt yet they were not blown out.
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
1/28/2004  9:41 AM
Posted by Andrew:

Honestly the whole "Zeke brought Steph to NY to increase ticket sales" has gotten its fill of forum time. I mean how many threads can you post it in? Sure he sells more tickets, but Isiah is trying to win, and bringing Steph here gets us closer to that.

Care to elaborate on the following:

Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

How are rotations and playoffs vs a Championship related? I missed the point.

Do ya homework Andrew, remember in Toronto when Brendan Malone was head coach. Malone wanted to win games and Zeke wanted to evaluate talent and play younger guys, well Malone was fired for wanting to win games. Zeke is like a mad scientist he likes to tinker as much as possible and if he wins it's a bonus. He isn't playing frank for a good reason...it's gonna show we already and a good enough pg in Frank Williams. GET THE PICTURE! He doesn't want to look stupid knowing we need a low post presence(should have been 1st priority)
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
martin
Posts: 68995
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/28/2004  9:50 AM
Posted by gogetit:
Posted by Andrew:

Honestly the whole "Zeke brought Steph to NY to increase ticket sales" has gotten its fill of forum time. I mean how many threads can you post it in? Sure he sells more tickets, but Isiah is trying to win, and bringing Steph here gets us closer to that.

Care to elaborate on the following:

Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

How are rotations and playoffs vs a Championship related? I missed the point.

Do ya homework Andrew, remember in Toronto when Brendan Malone was head coach. Malone wanted to win games and Zeke wanted to evaluate talent and play younger guys, well Malone was fired for wanting to win games. Zeke is like a mad scientist he likes to tinker as much as possible and if he wins it's a bonus. He isn't playing frank for a good reason...it's gonna show we already and a good enough pg in Frank Williams. GET THE PICTURE! He doesn't want to look stupid knowing we need a low post presence(should have been 1st priority)

dude, if you are going to call someone on a point do make sure that your facts are straight. And make sure the other person is actually trying to call you out. Andrew was asking a question not making a point. And Isiah was trying to develop young and inexperienced players on a new Toronto team; Malone was trying to win just a few games more. Toronto of yesteryear was a totally different situation than the Knicks are in now.

I think everyone is GETTING THE PICTURE.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
1/28/2004  10:00 AM
Posted by martin:
Posted by gogetit:
Posted by Andrew:

Honestly the whole "Zeke brought Steph to NY to increase ticket sales" has gotten its fill of forum time. I mean how many threads can you post it in? Sure he sells more tickets, but Isiah is trying to win, and bringing Steph here gets us closer to that.

Care to elaborate on the following:

Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

How are rotations and playoffs vs a Championship related? I missed the point.

Do ya homework Andrew, remember in Toronto when Brendan Malone was head coach. Malone wanted to win games and Zeke wanted to evaluate talent and play younger guys, well Malone was fired for wanting to win games. Zeke is like a mad scientist he likes to tinker as much as possible and if he wins it's a bonus. He isn't playing frank for a good reason...it's gonna show we already and a good enough pg in Frank Williams. GET THE PICTURE! He doesn't want to look stupid knowing we need a low post presence(should have been 1st priority)

dude, if you are going to call someone on a point do make sure that your facts are straight. And make sure the other person is actually trying to call you out. Andrew was asking a question not making a point. And Isiah was trying to develop young and inexperienced players on a new Toronto team; Malone was trying to win just a few games more. Toronto of yesteryear was a totally different situation than the Knicks are in now.

I think everyone is GETTING THE PICTURE.

Of course he called me out by bringing up that ticket sales comment in his first sentence. The bottom line is Zeke is a madd scientist. He isn't thinking long term for the knicks , he threw a badaid on a bigger problem. Ever since Ewing left we should have been trying to get a big low post presence. At least Layden took a gamble on Dice (LOW POST PRESENCE) , Zeke went to marbury a pg. HMMMM
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
1/28/2004  10:03 AM
Posted by TheSage:

Only a fool would say that the knx are not a better team today than they were a month ago. They lost to a team with a man considered by most experts to be th ebest player in the league on a night when he was on and a night on which Houston was hurt, KVH was hurt and Marbury was hurt yet they were not blown out.

THEY WERE HURT WHEN CHANEY COACHED TOO. MY point is Wilkens is a dud of a coach, he is just a stop gap , but zeke has fooled the masses that he is gonna re-invent the wheel.
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
martin
Posts: 68995
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/28/2004  10:10 AM
Posted by gogetit:
Posted by martin:
Posted by gogetit:
Posted by Andrew:

Honestly the whole "Zeke brought Steph to NY to increase ticket sales" has gotten its fill of forum time. I mean how many threads can you post it in? Sure he sells more tickets, but Isiah is trying to win, and bringing Steph here gets us closer to that.

Care to elaborate on the following:

Thomas doesn't care about playoffs remember he wants to win a championship , this is why we are playing funny rotations.

How are rotations and playoffs vs a Championship related? I missed the point.

Do ya homework Andrew, remember in Toronto when Brendan Malone was head coach. Malone wanted to win games and Zeke wanted to evaluate talent and play younger guys, well Malone was fired for wanting to win games. Zeke is like a mad scientist he likes to tinker as much as possible and if he wins it's a bonus. He isn't playing frank for a good reason...it's gonna show we already and a good enough pg in Frank Williams. GET THE PICTURE! He doesn't want to look stupid knowing we need a low post presence(should have been 1st priority)

dude, if you are going to call someone on a point do make sure that your facts are straight. And make sure the other person is actually trying to call you out. Andrew was asking a question not making a point. And Isiah was trying to develop young and inexperienced players on a new Toronto team; Malone was trying to win just a few games more. Toronto of yesteryear was a totally different situation than the Knicks are in now.

I think everyone is GETTING THE PICTURE.

Of course he called me out by bringing up that ticket sales comment in his first sentence. The bottom line is Zeke is a madd scientist. He isn't thinking long term for the knicks , he threw a badaid on a bigger problem. Ever since Ewing left we should have been trying to get a big low post presence. At least Layden took a gamble on Dice (LOW POST PRESENCE) , Zeke went to marbury a pg. HMMMM

No, Andrew (as a Mod) was pointing out that you are a broken record and that you keep posting the same 2 points almost every hour and without any point. Now I remember why I locked your account.

Also, a GMs responsibility is to make a team better in any way he can. You have already said that yourself. You don't pass up an opportunity like Marb, and that's why it was done (amongst other things).

Whither me this: What Low Post Presence is out there and available for the Knicks to get? And what would the other team accept in return? This is the part for which you have not - to my knowledge - ever answered.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
NYK8
Posts: 20372
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 9/10/2002
Member: #320
USA
1/28/2004  10:28 AM
Zeke to blame((Neva))..Look at the Pacers n where they at.
!!!Knicks!!!
martin
Posts: 68995
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/28/2004  10:42 AM
Posted by NYK8:

Zeke to blame((Neva))..Look at the Pacers n where they at.

Zeke the coach or Zeke the GM? I have 2 differing opinions (so far) of him in the different roles.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
tkf
Posts: 36487
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 8/13/2001
Member: #87
1/28/2004  10:51 AM
I agree Andrew: this topic is becomming ridiculous. Now people are blaming Zeke, saying he gave up too much and that Frank williams could of done the Job and blah, blah blah.....

As a NY knick fan it sickens me at times to listen to other NY fans and their irrational logic. We add a top 10 player in the league to our team and when a few things go wrong, we are looking for scapegoats. Typical NY BS!! If anyone thinks this team was fine before the trade does not know basketball at all. The knicks were a dying team and a struggling franchise, zeke made the knicks matter again... We were not going anywhere hopind lampe developed at all, and hoping for milos scared azz to come and compete for a job, and we are not better with Frank williams than we would be with Steph.. Period.. Put all of this garbage to rest..

I bet if we got shaq and lost 3 games in a row, people would be mad because shaq would be taking minutes away from Deke and doleac!! this is almost the type of logic being applied here by many...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Nalod
Posts: 68758
Alba Posts: 154
Joined: 12/24/2003
Member: #508
USA
1/28/2004  10:55 AM

The Pacers are whom they are is the work of Donnie Walsh.

Zeke says championship, and it won't happen this year.

Wilk did better when he let the team play under the old "chaney" style.

He is trying ot work in his scheme.

I do agree, any big change should have been done at seasons end in regard to coaching.

Thomas messed it up short term. This team needs to make the playoffs! No lotto for PHX!

Marbury is a great player now and the next 6 years. There are some whom think Frank, our NO.1 pick, with Lampe might be better long term.

We'll never know.

Thomas has one trait, what he says and what he does are different.
His saying he wants to win a championship is what he is SUPPOSED TO SAY when being hired.

The seeds to bring in Marbury were planted under Laydog. Bringing in a star player reeks of Dolan.

And only time will tell the truth.

I am getting sick of all these ex-knick players and coach's winning in the garden.

I hope we don't have too many ghosts for too many years visiting us.

OUr former no 1 pick, Lampe, Milos, Van gundy, Charlie. But in all fairness, we get to cheer Fatspoon and Eisley. But Eisley and Fatspoon were never our problem. Playing them was, but they could have sat.

In Isiah we trust!
djsunyc
Posts: 44927
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
1/28/2004  11:09 AM
well, there is one thing isiah should have done. instead of signing bruno sundov, he should've brought in a shooter from the nbdl. there's a ton of lavar postell types there - he should bring one up. shandon should probably start for allan (since he averages 20 when he does) but he's in lenny's doghouse. penny is needed off the bench and he's not going to bring it every night so they might as well sign a HIGH energy guy to play the backup 2 even for 5 mins a game.

and if othella is going to give you 2 rebounds and a ton of turnovers, why not just give sweets those minutes. i mean seriously, if he was getting 5 mins a game since november, you don't think he would be contributing something positive now?

and PLEASE, trade kurt - he hurts us so much and he's going to want $8+ mil/year when he's SO not worth it.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 01/28/2004 11:10:31]
knickgeek
Posts: 20392
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/31/2001
Member: #46
USA
1/28/2004  12:25 PM
I think playa just likes to run counter to whatever the popular opinion of the moment is, and likes to incite argument, annoy, etc.

That's too bad because I think a measured discussion of the wisdom of Isiah's moves is a legitimate one. Will his moves - bringing Stephon (inarbuably one of the great point guards) but putting us even farther over the cap - will these moves make NY a championship contender? Obviously he'll need at least a couple of years to acheive that and it is way to early to start criticizing this new team.

It was no surprise that the Knicks lost to San Antonio. Considering that their two top scorers were out they did pretty well. But they should be able to beat teams like Miami. So I'm reserving judgment on the overall direction of the Knicks.

We should ask ourselves some questions:

  • If the Knicks don't make the playoffs this year, what did firing Chaney and bringing in Wilkens accomplish?

  • If the Knicks start next season without a true low post presence, will Isiah deserve some criticism?

  • How long should we expect to wait for the Knicks to be able to go deep into the playoffs?
playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407
1/28/2004  12:32 PM
Martin my friend, Shouldn't you be asking Zeke what low post guys were available then and up until the feb 19 deadline? Most smart gm's also realize that most owners are concerned and don't want to pay luxury tax and are waiting until things open up the last week of deadline . Now common sense tells ya if you pick up marbury that it makes your team better,I don't understand those who say i'm argiung that. What I am saying is this, Zeke pulled the trigger for a star player too soon, but didn't hold out for a "BETTER FIT" our immediate # 1 priority 4 or a 5 Wallace. Zeke has a owner that has unlimited pockets so he took on penny and marbury's contract and got rid of Eisley's . Portland would been the perfect team we should have holded out for, their gm nash is slowly but surely working his way(jeff mcginnis-bonzi wells) up to trade his big guy RASHEED WALLACE and the knicks already gave away the chips for that move . Now we are stuck with 2 point guards who both should be playing, a backup small sg-sf (penny)who's legs are shot and you can't depend on him Plus his salary is outrageous to boot. We will continually get pimped slapped down low because of a miscalculation on Zeke's part along with hiring a joke for head coach who nobody else wanted. Chaney was bad, but wilkens is no red auerbach either. I will watch this come to fruition but hope somebody else team is hurting finanically, that they will give us a pf who can play.

[Edited by - gogetit on 01/28/2004 12:34:30]
JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
martin
Posts: 68995
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/28/2004  12:48 PM
Posted by gogetit:

Martin my friend, Shouldn't you be asking Zeke what low post guys were available then and up until the feb 19 deadline? Most smart gm's also realize that most owners are concerned and don't want to pay luxury tax and are waiting until things open up the last week of deadline . Now common sense tells ya if you pick up marbury that it makes your team better,I don't understand those who say i'm argiung that. What I am saying is this, Zeke pulled the trigger for a star player too soon, but didn't hold out for a "BETTER FIT" our immediate # 1 priority 4 or a 5 Wallace. Zeke has a owner that has unlimited pockets so he took on penny and marbury's contract and got rid of Eisley's . Portland would been the perfect team we should have holded out for, their gm nash is slowly but surely working his way(jeff mcginnis-bonzi wells) up to trade his big guy RASHEED WALLACE and the knicks already gave away the chips for that move . Now we are stuck with 2 point guards who both should be playing, a backup small sg-sf (penny)who's legs are shot and you can't depend on him Plus his salary is outrageous to boot. We will continually get pimped slapped down low because of a miscalculation on Zeke's part along with hiring a joke for head coach who nobody else wanted. Chaney was bad, but wilkens is no red auerbach either. I will watch this come to fruition but hope somebody else team is hurting finanically, that they will give us a pf who can play.

[Edited by - gogetit on 01/28/2004 12:34:30]

I think if you polled the GMs and Coaches around the league and asked them if they would rather have Marbury or Wallace on their team they would choose Marbury. Marbury is a guy who you can build your team around. He is young. Deke, Othella, KVH, Penny all come off the
cap over the next 2 years. Marb will still be young in 2 years. KVH and Penny can be HUGE bargaining chips for a solid big man in their respective last years. Recently I have heard Marb say that he wants to Win A Championship. The only thing I have heard Weed say is that he needs to Cash His Checks. Big difference.

I have not been impressed with Wilkens but you do have to give him at least a month or 2 with the guys. Chaney had training camp and 2 months of the season to get the guys playing to their potential (not to mention last season to get to know the players). We'll see.
Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
1
Posts: 20195
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #575
Burkina Faso (Upper Volta)
1/28/2004  1:00 PM
Posted by gogetit:

Martin my friend, Shouldn't you be asking Zeke what low post guys were available then and up until the feb 19 deadline? Most smart gm's also realize that most owners are concerned and don't want to pay luxury tax and are waiting until things open up the last week of deadline . Now common sense tells ya if you pick up marbury that it makes your team better,I don't understand those who say i'm argiung that. What I am saying is this, Zeke pulled the trigger for a star player too soon, but didn't hold out for a "BETTER FIT" our immediate # 1 priority 4 or a 5 Wallace. Zeke has a owner that has unlimited pockets so he took on penny and marbury's contract and got rid of Eisley's . Portland would been the perfect team we should have holded out for, their gm nash is slowly but surely working his way(jeff mcginnis-bonzi wells) up to trade his big guy RASHEED WALLACE and the knicks already gave away the chips for that move . Now we are stuck with 2 point guards who both should be playing, a backup small sg-sf (penny)who's legs are shot and you can't depend on him Plus his salary is outrageous to boot. We will continually get pimped slapped down low because of a miscalculation on Zeke's part along with hiring a joke for head coach who nobody else wanted. Chaney was bad, but wilkens is no red auerbach either. I will watch this come to fruition but hope somebody else team is hurting finanically, that they will give us a pf who can play.

[Edited by - gogetit on 01/28/2004 12:34:30]

You continually fail to say what the Blazers would have taken that we had.
Elite
Posts: 26372
Alba Posts: 23
Joined: 12/30/2003
Member: #510
1/28/2004  1:43 PM
goget it you have like 4 different names on this board and u guys all post these crazy ideas based on your love affair with frank wililams... i like Frank too, he is a good player, but you really go to far and im getttin real sick of seein all your ridiculous posts after post that make little to no sense take it elsewhere buddy, all thse theories of yours belong on a conspiracy theory website.. next thing we know u guna be like ISIAH IS WORKING WITH THE GOVERNMENT.. STEPON IS REALLY AN ALIEN PLANNING TO TAKE US DOWN FROM THE INSIDE

please enuff is enuff
bernard
Posts: 20730
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/17/2003
Member: #475
1/28/2004  1:50 PM
With you, Martin. Can argue that we would have been better off going for a low post stud than Marbury. But it would have had to have been a stud. A real difference maker. Top 10 player. Not Sheed, for Christ's sake. You take a step down from top 10 and trade for a frequent all star, and you've got a team still lacking a superstar, and teams like that don't win championships. Sheed's not even the best low post player on his own team. When you think of the kind of low post guys who'd have more or equal value to Marbury (short list: Shaq, Duncan, Yao, Jermaine, Dirk), you can see how well Deke did getting Marbury. It's hard to imagine any of these guys being traded at all, much less for broken down cap relief.

So to me, getting Marbury was a stroke of genius. Now we have to figure out how to get some help up front, but it doesn't have to be a top 10 guy, just a significant upgrade, and we have to be willing to part w/ FWill to get it.
Page 1 of 2  1  2 Next ›
« Reply To Topic
Zeke is to blame
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2012 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy