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Amare needs a post up game
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Killa4luv
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12/29/2010  10:51 AM
Twice we have seen Miami stifle and slow him down, and they have done it with double teams and with this one guy who's name I can't even remember, guarding him well one on one.
His offensive game, is a little too loosy goosy, meaning he just tries to improvise and forces up bad shots when he can't get easy ones. If we had a more traditional back to the basket game, he'd be more effective.

He also has to make better passes out of the double team. Passes that hit the spot up shooter in the chest so they can shoot it in one fluid motion after catching it. Too often our spot up guys are bending over grabbing passes at their knees and not being able to recover quickly enough to shoot what would be a wide open jump shot.

Gallo needs one too. He's much bigger than most guys guarding him. We'd be able to take advantage of that. Imagine he had posted up Lebron.

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BlueSeats
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12/29/2010  11:07 AM
Amare is not an iso, go-to player. He's a guy you set up. He should be the second option. The guy you dish to after disrupting the D.
Killa4luv
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12/29/2010  11:10 AM
While I agree with you that he shouldn't be option #1, on our team he is our #1 option. He is our go to player. I don't recall seeing many pick and rolls last night. He was getting the ball in ISo on most of his touches. I agree its not the best way to use him, but this is the team we have. WHo else could possibly be our #1?
BlueSeats
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12/29/2010  11:20 AM
I don't know, but I don't think you can expect him to become something he's never been at this stage in his career.

D' has to figure out why the PnR broke down and crack that code. Maybe even trying the PnR with Gallo/Chandler, if nothing else than to impose and alternative threat to keep the D on Amare honest.

BRIGGS
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12/29/2010  11:21 AM
I think Amare has that spot up J but not really a back to the basket guy. It was obvious what we needed last night--a second big who can post up defend rebound and score. We got hit in the mouth last night and didnt respond fast enough. We spent the first 8 minutes watching BIG Z playing volleyball and it really was all over by then. You cant defend 7-3 and 6-11 with 6-9 and 6-8. Each guy is giving up huge length.
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martin
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12/29/2010  11:22 AM
BlueSeats wrote:I don't know, but I don't think you can expect him to become something he's never been at this stage in his career.

D' has to figure out why the PnR broke down and crack that code. Maybe even trying the PnR with Gallo/Chandler, if nothing else than to impose and alternative threat to keep the D on Amare honest.

in the 4th as well as during the past few games, MDA's offense has started with the Chandler PnR. Perhaps they have just started to integrate that. In fact, the last few possessions of the CHI game - during crunch-time no less - it was all Chandler and Felton.

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Killa4luv
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12/29/2010  11:24 AM
So no one thinks he should be developing a post up game? He's still young and wont be bouncing around the court like he is now, forever.
Nalod
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12/29/2010  11:29 AM

Miami did a great job on Defense last nite. We hardley had any fast breaks and they forced us into a slower pace. They got back on defense very well.

Questin is did we lose last nite or get beat?

I think we got beat by a better team. Somtimes we will get beat by a lessor team that will out play us.

and somtimes we will do the same.

Games are about giving and being able to execute what they give you. They gave us the 3's and dared us to beat them with it. A few shots here and there and better FT% its a closer game.

Big Z only played 14 minutes but he killed us. He is a big dude with skill.

Miami used their tools well and executed. WE did not execute our plan well.

Thats where you improve.

In my book Miami is a much better team than even 2 weeks ago and I thought we played better. WE came back even though it not seem "Close" at the end. Miami dropped their guard.

Amare's assets are quickness and I think he would get pushed out of place if he posted often. Its hell on the legs also.

He is a face to the basket player and perhaps the best at what he does. Why mess with it?

Gallo has one but won't use it yet. Its a drop step turn around jump shot. Seems he is still able to get to the basket with his handle or get fouled. If they can create a mismatch on a pick and roll I'd post him. He is not in that offense scheme yet.

Bonn1997
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12/29/2010  11:42 AM
Killa4luv wrote:So no one thinks he should be developing a post up game? He's still young and wont be bouncing around the court like he is now, forever.

Like Blueseats said, that's just not his game. I can't imagine that in his nine year career, coaches never tried to develop that ability with him. Players other than Lebron and Wade have weaknesses that you have to work around.
GodSaveTheKnicks
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12/29/2010  11:49 AM
At least you can be happy that if someone tells him that's what he needs to do..he'll do it.

He came into the league as a dunker. Now he has a NASTY midrange J. As he gets older I can see him adding to his game. Maybe a 3 pt shot. Maybe a post up game. Dude has shown he will put in the work to improve his game.

Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
JrZyHuStLa
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12/29/2010  11:57 AM
Posting up seems to be a dying art in the nba. Although stat hits that occasional turnaround with his back to the basket, his biggest strengths involve his speed and agility.
knicks1248
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12/29/2010  12:15 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/29/2010  12:16 PM
Nalod wrote:
Miami did a great job on Defense last nite. We hardley had any fast breaks and they forced us into a slower pace. They got back on defense very well.

Questin is did we lose last nite or get beat?

I think we got beat by a better team. Somtimes we will get beat by a lessor team that will out play us.

and somtimes we will do the same.

Games are about giving and being able to execute what they give you. They gave us the 3's and dared us to beat them with it. A few shots here and there and better FT% its a closer game.

Big Z only played 14 minutes but he killed us. He is a big dude with skill.

Miami used their tools well and executed. WE did not execute our plan well.

Thats where you improve.

In my book Miami is a much better team than even 2 weeks ago and I thought we played better. WE came back even though it not seem "Close" at the end. Miami dropped their guard.

Amare's assets are quickness and I think he would get pushed out of place if he posted often. Its hell on the legs also.

He is a face to the basket player and perhaps the best at what he does. Why mess with it?

Gallo has one but won't use it yet. Its a drop step turn around jump shot. Seems he is still able to get to the basket with his handle or get fouled. If they can create a mismatch on a pick and roll I'd post him. He is not in that offense scheme yet.

Were a 3 pt shooting team, were 17-1 when we shoot above 45% from DT..if we shoot like that, miami has to adjust, and Amare starts to go off. Were not a post up team, and like it's been said, that ain't his game.

The illeagal defense rule or the defensive 3 second rule, clearly took away the post up game.

The defense now is force to quickly double team a post up player, you can't fake it. Your decisions have to be a split seconds or you end up turning the ball over either by steal or offensive foul (ala eddy curry)

ES
BlueSeats
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12/29/2010  12:17 PM
JrZyHuStLa wrote:his biggest strengths involve his speed and agility.

That's why playing him at the 5 is so effective. He's much faster than other C's.

Of course this puts us at a disadvantage defensively. Point being I wouldn't expect that if we can just add a defensive C that our offense will stay the same while the D improves. A big C can work against our O. It's a trade off we'll have to take, but I think we'll always see Amare getting a lot of time at the 5 in this system. He's more productive at the 5, so long as he's our main option maximizing his productivity is important.

efw
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12/29/2010  12:21 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/29/2010  12:21 PM
I agree with you Killa...

Kobe developed a post-up game at 31 by studying with Hakeem over the summer. Why can't Amare do the same? He has plenty of room to grow and with a 100 million dollar contract, I'd expect him to.

knicks1248
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12/29/2010  12:25 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/29/2010  12:25 PM
He also gets abuse on the boards
ES
martin
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12/29/2010  12:34 PM
what's the advantage of having a post-up game if you are already getting the ball in the post but in a face-up manor?
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JrZyHuStLa
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12/29/2010  12:40 PM
martin wrote:what's the advantage of having a post-up game if you are already getting the ball in the post but in a face-up manor?

Because then he'd be a good post up AND face up player. A big man can never have too many offensive options.

BlueSeats
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12/29/2010  12:47 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/29/2010  12:48 PM
Face up generally implies a jumper, post implies being able to put the ball on the floor and maneuver your way in for a closer shot, or collapse the D and pass back out. Amare's explosive first step can allow him to blow by a guy even in face up, but it's usually when the D is caught in a trap, not when it's set.
Moonangie
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12/29/2010  1:26 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/29/2010  1:26 PM
We got beat by a better team last night. Amare is brilliant when he is set up in motion. He is sloppy when he tries to take his guy(s) to the hole. I agree that we need a bona fide #1 scoring option. I think it should work out like this next season:

#1 Melo
#2 Stat
#3 Gallo
#4 Felton

Everyone else can pick up the scraps (I am assuming here that Ill Wil has to go due to our signing Melo as a FA this summer, or via trade).

AnubisADL
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12/29/2010  1:35 PM
Amare wasnt a post player, great rebounder, or defender before he came to the Knicks.

The guy is 28 yrs old I think what we see is what we are going to get for the next 5 yrs.

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Amare needs a post up game

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