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A different perspective on the Melo situation. It's the Knicks or Bust.
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WindsorPl
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8/19/2010  12:29 AM
Here is a perspective from the Dallas Mavs about the Melo situation. The upshot is everyone knows Melo wants to be a Knick and he has the leverage to make it happen.
http://www.foxsportssouthwest.com/08/17/10/Fisher-Carmelos-Leverage-The-Two-Reasons/landing.html?blockID=292381&feedID=4519

Carmelo’s Leverage: The Two Reasons The Mavs (And Most Everybody Else) Aren’t In The ‘Melo Mix

By Mike Fisher and David Lord -- FOXSportsSouthwest.com

The Mavs are as fascinated by the Carmelo Anthony drama as anybody. And they are as enamored of the Carmelo Anthony talent as anybody, too. But sources tell FOXSportsSouthwest.com and DallasBasketball.com that there are two reasons the Mavericks are not in hot pursuit of the reportedly unhappy Nuggets superstar. And those same reasons – reasons in play due to an unusual form of leverage -- apply to pretty much everybody besides the New York Knicks.

Denver is in a trying situation, having put on the table an offer of a three-year extension worth $65 mil. That’s a max-money deal for a 26-year-old star who is the face of that franchise … but he’s so far leaving that offer sitting there on that table.

Between now and the mid-February trade deadline, there will be 30 teams – including the Nuggets -- wanting to employ Anthony. It that sense, for the Mavs, it would seem this situation mirrors the situation of New Orleans’ Chris Paul, who is very much on Dallas’ radar.

So why isn’t Carmelo Anthony showing up on that same radar at that same level?

Issue 1: Carmelo Anthony’s unusual Knicks-related leverage.
Any team that wishes to acquire Anthony will also ask him to sign an extension. NBA sources tell us they are so completely convinced that ‘Melo wants to land with the Knicks that he would be unwilling to sign such an extension with most any team, thus keeping his freedom for the summer of 2011.

So yes, a Mavs’ offer might be enough for Denver. (Dallas would give up a package like this: $3 million cash, two first-round draft picks, Roddy Beaubois, Caron Butler (one year at $10.8 mil and then expiring) and DeShawn Stevenson (one year at $4.1 mil and then expiring).

But if Anthony is focused on jumping teams again this summer, that’s a blockbuster package sacrificed for a one-year rent-a-player.

Dallas will not do that. Likely, no team will.

If Denver is to get top compensation (and if Dallas or any other team is going to chase a trade for him with strong value), the deal must include a ‘Melo extension, which means it's done with his cooperation. So if it's to happen, this has to become a Garnett-like deal. That means ‘Melo is in the middle of the negotiating, and he has to take a look at the ensuing landscape and decide that Dallas (or wherever) will be the place he wants to stay.

Without that, any of the millions of theoretical trade offers anyone can devise – as DB.com did earlier today in its “Mavs Amateur GM’’ piece – is meaningless.

It has to be noted that, if such a trade came together, the extension itself isn't merely a promise; it can formally be part of the trade. The NBA has a little-known provision in the rules that allows an Extend-and-Trade that works the very same way a Sign-and-Trade does. ‘Melo would sign an extension with Denver that is conditioned on his trade to some specified team within 48 hours.

If he picks (or approves) Dallas as an Extend-and-Trade destination? Then both teams have massive urgency to do a deal. Team X has an opportunity to get a star and Denver has the chance to get value.

And the key wouldn't be about the offer itself. It would be about where Carmelo is willing to stay. First and foremost, that's the primary hurdle in negotiating to get Carmelo Anthony in another uniform if the Nuggets are willing to make a deal.

Without the extension, the Mavs are not interested. Nor will most other teams be interested. Because that will simply set up his next team to get “LeBron’ed’’ in the way Denver is trying to avoid.

And there lies Anthony’s unusual leverage. … and why this is more “pipedreamy’’ than so many other superstar-getting concepts. He has no official “veto’’ power, but his position gives him that de facto muscle.

Says one source: “Carmelo wants the legacy. The fastest way for him to become a transcendent player is to get away from the Lakers (and the Western Conference). lead the Knicks to success, get that endorsement money, and be close to home (on the East Coast). He’s as concerned about his ‘image’ and his ‘profile’ as any player in the NBA. If he can pull this off, he’s right there with LeBron and Kobe.’’

One report says Orlando might be on ‘Melo’s list. DB.com has a source saying that the Bulls and Nets might be able to satisfy his desires. But the strongest opinion we collected today comes from one person who has a friendship with Anthony.

“’Melo wants it all,’’ he said, indicating that means New York.

Therefore, this really isn’t about the Nuggets and their wishes. This takes a high level of self-awareness on the part of the Nuggets – a self-awareness that Cleveland did not have with LeBron and that Toronto did not have with Chris Bosh. There is wisdom to trading him before the deadline and the best offers they will receive will come from teams ‘Melo will want to remain with long-term.

Issue 2: The ways in which this situation is not like Chris Paul’s.

On the surface, there would seem to be parallels. But we are told that in Dallas’ view, Paul’s availability in New Orleans was/is due to a perfect storm: Wobbly ownership, a now-fired GM not viewed favorably by the player, a franchise with no history of success.

Meanwhile, Anthony’s availability is not the result of any real problems in Denver. (As one source put it: “It’s not that he’s unhappy. It’s that going back East would make him happier.’’) This story is fueled completely by Carmelo Anthony’s primary desire to become a New York Knick … and that’s reason enough for the Mavs and rest of the NBA to serve as rubberneckers at a potential transaction that is being driven by a player who is not a free agent but is nevertheless crafting a way to orchestrate his freedom.

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BRIGGS
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8/19/2010  12:38 AM
Exact reason why we don't give them a penny

Did anyone trade for Chris Bosh?

Did anyone trade For Amare Stoudemire?

Did anyone trade for Lebron James?

Did anyone trade for J Johnson?

No No No No No

Were the players patient one year? YES

Can the Knicks be patient on year? YES

If you are going to get something for nothing if you wait--why would you rush it--it makes absolute No sense. Are we going to win a title with carmleo this year as constituted NO F WAY wont happen


CAN we win it if we KEEP our players----YES

So why would we want to break the bank for someone who wants to come here next year? Quite frankly its in our best interests to wait it out. Gallo could be a star AR could be a star--why give them away if you DO NOT HAVE to????

RIP Crushalot😞
TMS
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8/19/2010  12:42 AM
because DEN is not waiting on Melo to hear what his plans are the way Toronto, Cleveland, Phoenix & Atlanta did for their players... they already pretty much know Melo doesn't want to stay there... so they'll look to trade him now while they can still get something for him rather than lose him for nothing like CLE & TOR lost their guys... it's a different scenario entirely.
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loweyecue
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8/19/2010  12:48 AM
OK so we give them nothing and sign Melo at the end of this season. Then what? Who plays the three? If we are serious about getting this dude, Gallo is automatically expendable and so is AR. I hate to say that, and I am a huge Gallo fan. Not the biggest Melo fan but I would still do the trade unless Galo starts playing Center.
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
WindsorPl
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8/19/2010  12:53 AM
As much as i love Gallo and as much as I don't think Melo is a max player. You have to trade for Melo instead of waiting for the summer to sign him as a FA. Many things can happen between now and then.
WindsorPl
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8/19/2010  12:56 AM
BRIGGS wrote: Gallo could be a star AR could be a star--why give them away if you DO NOT HAVE to????

Difference is, Melo is already a star and wants to come to NY. If the deal is reasonable, you make it.

matt
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8/19/2010  1:01 AM
Say if Melo just signed here this summer, I think one of the two (AR/Gallo) have to go anyway, since that would present a logjam at the SF position.. Now it just depends on who you value more..
EnySpree
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8/19/2010  1:28 AM
matt wrote:Say if Melo just signed here this summer, I think one of the two (AR/Gallo) have to go anyway, since that would present a logjam at the SF position.. Now it just depends on who you value more..

Gallo can't play center...that's it in a nutshell. Anthony Randolph can play center, sf and pf. Amare doesn't want to play center exclusively. Melo is a waste at shooting guard and no way can you get away with Gallo at shooting guard.

It's risky to wait for Melo in the off-season. Denver could trde him to Chicago or some dumb **** and the dude could actually sign an extention if they have success. That would totally suck. Being held hostage is getting old.

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smackeddog
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8/19/2010  4:19 AM
loweyecue wrote:OK so we give them nothing and sign Melo at the end of this season. Then what? Who plays the three? If we are serious about getting this dude, Gallo is automatically expendable and so is AR. I hate to say that, and I am a huge Gallo fan. Not the biggest Melo fan but I would still do the trade unless Galo starts playing Center.

Then you can trade Gallo in the offseason for another piece or a good draft pick- by then he will hopefully have shown improvement and increased his value. In addition we'll have seen the team in action for a season and will have a better idea of what we need to add, so in addition to signing Carmello, you can then use Gallo to get something to improve an area where we are weak (maybe center or shooting guard, or maybe pair him with Felton and improve the PG spot).

Basically if we give up assets to get carmelo, then it makes it very difficult for us to add pieces or improve- we'll have traded all the players we can, we have no picks really and we'll be capped out and especially vulnerable to the new CBA, which will likely reduce the salary cap or maybe get rid off the mid player exemption- whatever it turns out to be it will make it harder to sign free agents.

If we get Carmelo but have to trade our assets to get him, we won't be a championship team, but if we can sign him without giving up our assets we can then use them to help build one

fishmike
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8/19/2010  8:01 AM
I'm not giving up one of my big chips right now. There is no reason to, not when he wants to be here. I think giving up Gallo/Ar is simply a bad choice, because there is no need need. We dont even know where these guys are going to play.

We have a lot of talent on this roster. We certainly have a lot of scoring, which is what Carmello brings. Its not clear we need him or that he makes us that much better.

The risk in waiting until next summer is the same risk in Gallo or AR blowing up and becoming studs.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
skeng
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8/19/2010  8:07 AM
I don't see why we should get rid of AR and Gallo just because they're expendable. They're not going to be superstars this season anyway, so why not keep and develop both? Amare wont last forever, so a frontcourt of Gallo and AR could be plausible in the future. Dunno how all this fits contract wise, so feel free to correct me
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Marv
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8/19/2010  8:16 AM
well here's the risk as i see it. denver has an untenable situation. they really can't go into this year with their #1 and most highly-compensated player saying i'm outta here as soon as my contract’s up at the end of the year. they could get a half-way decent offer now from a team that likes its chances of being able to sign him to an extension. that team could really sell itself to melo and he could sign with them. end result - we weren’t willing to trade gallo or ar for melo. not smart imo. get it done now. we can easily afford to give up 1 or the other of them for a player like melo.
Markji
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8/19/2010  8:25 AM
Marv wrote:well here's the risk as i see it. denver has an untenable situation. they really can't go into this year with their #1 and most highly-compensated player saying i'm outta here as soon as my contract’s up at the end of the year. they could get a half-way decent offer now from a team that likes its chances of being able to sign him to an extension. that team could really sell itself to melo and he could sign with them. end result - we weren’t willing to trade gallo or ar for melo. not smart imo. get it done now. we can easily afford to give up 1 or the other of them for a player like melo.
Agree with you Marv. Get it done now ....but again, at our price, not Denver's. It is in everyone's best interest to make the trade before the season starts so both teams are settled in their line-ups.

And you don't have to "Gut the team" just because Denver is asking for the moon. It's called bargaining! and I have more confidence in Donnie that he will get a good deal or just wait til the trade deadline or end of the season.

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Marv
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8/19/2010  8:26 AM
btw anyone else thinking how if denver had really wanted to re-sign him then why the hell did they offer him 3 years when all the other top fa's got 5 or 6? how is he supposed to feel about that?
GustavBahler
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8/19/2010  8:35 AM
It all depends on what Denver is willing to take in return. If Melo really wants to go to a Knicks team that can compete sooner rather than later then he should make it clear that unless he goes to the Knicks, he is a one year rental. I believe he wants to be a Knick but I don't believe he wants to be one that bad. I don't want to see them go into panic mode over him, nothing good will come of it.
Gymkata
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8/19/2010  8:52 AM
Good angle and one I forgot to consider. He does in fact hold leverage.

I too like Gallo and providing the asking price doesn't demand AR as well, I say you have to make a move for Melo. The guy's an elite scorer and let's be honest: with the South Beach Legion of Doom and an aging, but stacked Celtics team, you have to have two superstars in the fold to do damage. Potential for proven is a swap you should make.

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fishmike
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8/19/2010  9:23 AM
he's just too one dimensional for me. He's been to one more all star game than David Lee. He's got a pretty average shooting %. Thats offset some by the amount of FTs he takes but he's not a great playmaker or defender and he's only a good rebounder.

He could be a nice option in the offseason

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Marv
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8/19/2010  9:41 AM    LAST EDITED: 8/19/2010  9:42 AM
fishmike wrote:he's just too one dimensional for me. He's been to one more all star game than David Lee. He's got a pretty average shooting %. Thats offset some by the amount of FTs he takes but he's not a great playmaker or defender and he's only a good rebounder.

He could be a nice option in the offseason

he's been to 2 more all-star games than lee.

in last year's 6-game series against the jazz he averaged 30.7 points, 8.5 rebounds and 3.2 assists. he recorded double-doubles in each of the last three games of the series.

you like apples, fish? well how you like THEM apples?

nyk4ever
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8/19/2010  9:42 AM
Marv wrote:
fishmike wrote:he's just too one dimensional for me. He's been to one more all star game than David Lee. He's got a pretty average shooting %. Thats offset some by the amount of FTs he takes but he's not a great playmaker or defender and he's only a good rebounder.

He could be a nice option in the offseason

he's been to 2 more all-star games than lee.

in last kyear's 6-gaem series agasinate tahe jazz he averaged 30.7 points, 8.5 rebounds and 3.2 assists' he recorded double-doubles in each of the last three games of the series.

you like apples, fish? well how you like THEM apples?

startin the fruity drinks early today marv?

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Marv
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8/19/2010  9:58 AM
nyk4ever wrote:
Marv wrote:
fishmike wrote:he's just too one dimensional for me. He's been to one more all star game than David Lee. He's got a pretty average shooting %. Thats offset some by the amount of FTs he takes but he's not a great playmaker or defender and he's only a good rebounder.

He could be a nice option in the offseason

he's been to 2 more all-star games than lee.

in last kyear's 6-gaem series agasinate tahe jazz he averaged 30.7 points, 8.5 rebounds and 3.2 assists' he recorded double-doubles in each of the last three games of the series.

you like apples, fish? well how you like THEM apples?

startin the fruity drinks early today marv?

nah. i keep asking them not to but starbucks keeps spiking my coffee.

A different perspective on the Melo situation. It's the Knicks or Bust.

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