We want them to shut down their nuclear program and they have spit in our face and now want to put them in mountains. I hope the US and Israel send them back to the middle ages. This is a new Germany brewing and we have to rip the head from the snake.

Silverfuel wrote:I wonder nothing is being done about Pakistan's nuclear arsenal? There is an actual threat of Pakistan's government falling to the Taliban. If that happens, every single terror cell will have access to nuke's. Why shouldn't we disarm their nuclear arsenal first?

The real reason we are in afganistan.........

Hope for Iran is the people topple the government. Lord knows they are trying.

If we preemptive strike it looks bad. If we wait until an event its justifiable.

If Iran tosses a nuke toward Israel, Iran will get lite up. Same for anyone who phucks with them.

Millions die, includeing the very palastinians they claim to support.

TMS wrote:so what do u propose, we nuke em?

No--blow their oil infrastructure to kingdom come--it will be viewed as a defensive measure that did not involve bloodshed. The collateral damage on this type of attack would be very small.

kam77 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

TMS wrote:so what do u propose, we nuke em?

No--blow their oil infrastructure to kingdom come--it will be viewed as a defensive measure that did not involve bloodshed. The collateral damage on this type of attack would be very small.

And the price of Gasoline will be very high.

Very little in the scheme of things--if they wanted to--they could say no oil today. The price might change .25/35--that's it. Take the bulk of money out of their hands--they are tied up from being able to put billions into nuclear programs and their economy will crumble. We don't have to do it either--Israel could do this job--we just back them up.

Cosmic wrote:Well, I've always felt that if North Korea and Iran want advanced nuclear weapons we should just give it to them.

Of course my method of delivering the goods might not go over so well with the international community, but, hey...I tried!

The fact is we're eventually going to be at war again, perhaps a world war, and it will center around Iran and their pursuit to destroy everything in their path. Why they are so insane I will never know.

I don't like us being over there however. I would have pulled out of Iraq and Afghanistan long ago. I wouldn't have bothered to even go in there with troops in the first place. Air raids supported by small special ops groups on the ground would have been sufficient.

Knock them down and then watch from afar...and if need be go knock them down again.

Invasion was a terrible idea. We created the technology we have so invasion and occupation would be unnecessary. Why we didn't use it is beyond logic.

Looking back we should have dropped a small tactical nuke or two on Afghanistan after 9/11. We had the world's support to go in heavy and we went in like pussies instead. If we had one shot to squash the hornet's nest that is the Middle East and do so with weapons that people are horrified of, that was the time and we would have been justified in doing so.

Perhaps if we nuked Kandahar - Iraq never happens.

Hey, we went into Iraq and Libya threw their arms up and surrendered LOL.

Our problem is no one fears us and everyone knows we try to operate in a pussified manner. That could have ended in 2001. Take out Kandahar and the majority of the Taliban, Osama, and others in one swift shot on top of an ICBM and other regions might have said "OH SHIT! They do have them and they do use them! The hell with that!"

But, no, they know to poke us with sticks until we go over there and make ourselves targets of guerrilla war.

We're idiots.

I will tell you this though no matter what the US wants to do the Jews are eventually going to go into Iran and **** it up good. And we will have to help.

The worry I have is we're occupying countries on either side of Iran. So in that we've got all these retaliatory targets for Iran to attack.

So we need to get the hell out of there so they can't do that when Israel goes in there and takes out their nuclear capability - something they absolutely will. They will not allow Iran to go nuclear. It will be like in 1980 when they went into Iraq and took out Saddam's nuclear program in those raids.

Problem is - Iran does have a hell of a lot of military power - they can and will strike back and in full.

Not a pretty picture unfolding. Reagan should have just destroyed them when he had the chance.

You think we're going to war again you ready for a draft? You ready to see every young man enlisted into military service you personally ready to go fight a war? A draft will be an absolute necessity if we Invade Iran. Israel isn't stupid going into Iran and do a straight-up act of War would turn the entire Middle East against them. Even though the Shittes and the Sunnis are hardly friends an attack by Israel on Iran would unite many of the Islamic influenced governments.

Bitty is right, you can't galvanize the them.

The actual state of nuclear progression Iran is taking is well documented by the IAEA. They just announced that they enriched uranium to 20%. That is the amount needed to use it in nuclear power plants. You need 90% enriched uranium to build bombs. That is not an easy task guys! They need more factories and more centrifuges to enrich enough to build power plants. The actual risk of Iran having a Nuke in the near future is slim. You might be in a state of fear Iran will bomb Israel, but even if they had a nuke right now, that is just not true! They are not as stupid. They have not only a big and diverse military, they also have a big and diverse culture and there politcians are rethorically agressive, but not stupid! They would never risk their country by prematuraly striking out. They are working with everything the US is giving them (retorically threats and sanctions), using it to build on their own means and keeping a firm grip on progressive thinking Iranians. There is no hope of a revolution from inside of the Iran because they are under constant pressure and constant risk of beeing bombed or invaded by US/Israel.

The US and UK overtook a democratically voted system in 1953, because the voted leaders of this system were bold enough that they wanted to have half of what a british company was earning by exploiting Iranian Oil! They installed a Schah (Sheik) to keep their grip on the oilhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat. Back then it was the same reason the US are at war now for nearly a decade.

And please, think about the stuff you guys are writing here. Calling Iran a military state might be true, but its hipocritical to call out someone else when you have more than half of your budget going to the military! You guys, the US is spending 41% of military money worldwide! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_federations_by_military_expenditures#Stockholm_International_Peace_Research_Institute_figures

The US is working with CIA operations and open military invasions as the main mean of foreign politics since 65 years! There is no region in this world the US was not interfering with the natural progress of civilization. You wonder why the middle east is a big bomb waiting to go boom? Look no further than Israel. Just imagine, native americans would have a lobby as strong as the Jews and would be as aggressive towards you guys as the israelian government is towards everyone in the region! If the UN would demand Manhattan as the place were native americans should live from tomorrow and everybody living there right now would be set into a place not that far away from a concentration camp. Then the Indians would have the support of a increadibly advanced military and would use this as their only means of dealing with discontent from former inhabitiants of Manhattan and bomb the rest of NYC whenever there is something like insurgence. You would hate them! You would (rightfully) fight for the land you are living on since hundreds of years. The only difference is, the palestinians are in no way successors of the reason Israel was founded. You guys live on land once owned by Indians, and in a historical way, are to blame for their downfall. The Jews were killed by Germans! The jews should have gotten a big piece of post WW2 germany, but to give them their own state in a part of the world were no Jew was rooted since more than 2000 years out of religious reasons and not even thinking about those people living there since, was historically the upmost stupid idea anyone could ever have!

The reasons you are talking like you do are set in a media that is a satire of what it should be. The US americans are held in a state of fear and stupidity. I seriously do not want to insult you guys here, but to read hipocritical stuff like this, it just gets to me. I see the US led politics, supported by countrys like my own Germany, as the main reason for conflict in this world. Since the breakdown of USSR and the missing of someone to keep the US globally in check, your presidents had gone rogue in a way unprecedented. The US invaded Iraq twice, Afghanistan (a country without anything, seriously, there is nothing but sand, stone and **** in the air), and Yugoslavia. The CIA started to torture people for informations in a war against terror! Youre right, the US lost all of its credibility, but not by beeing military inept. The US lost its credibility by beeing hipocritical to the max!

Damn, until America is talking directly with Iran, and for that, all of the countrys your still at war with in a formal sense, nothing will change. As long as the US is treatening every country that is not doing as the US wants them to do, the hate will grow. If you would really bomb Iran, you would unleash hell far beyond 9/11 upon this world. If you want to stop them from having nukes someday, you have to talk to them and propose different options. All they have to do now, is take a look at northern korea. A mentally instable despot is destroying a country without any serious opposition. Kim Yong-Ill has the nuke, and he is sitting on it while he lets the people starve to death and nothing is happening. Because HE HAS THE NUKE!

I will stop right here. Sorry if I offend you, but it was just necessary to write that, I couldnt sleep well without standing up for my believes. I will continue to argue with you guys, and I will give you links to every information you distrust.

what's even scarier is listening to people living in this country that thinks bombing other countries into oblivion is ever an acceptable answer to solve any problem... has the Iraq War not taught any of u guys anything?
it's easy to sit in the safety of our homes & lay out plans to send bombs 20,000 miles away without thinking of the possible collateral damage to innocent civilians u would be causing & justify it by saying it's saving American lives, but all that does is make you a terrorist yourself... gotta address these kinds of issues through diplomacy & economic sanctions, not by the use of force.

SteveSmith wrote:Sorry, but are you guys serious? I know I risk my credibility in many of your minds, but know what? I Dont care!

The actual state of nuclear progression Iran is taking is well documented by the IAEA. They just announced that they enriched uranium to 20%. That is the amount needed to use it in nuclear power plants. You need 90% enriched uranium to build bombs. That is not an easy task guys! They need more factories and more centrifuges to enrich enough to build power plants. The actual risk of Iran having a Nuke in the near future is slim. You might be in a state of fear Iran will bomb Israel, but even if they had a nuke right now, that is just not true! They are not as stupid. They have not only a big and diverse military, they also have a big and diverse culture and there politcians are rethorically agressive, but not stupid! They would never risk their country by prematuraly striking out. They are working with everything the US is giving them (retorically threats and sanctions), using it to build on their own means and keeping a firm grip on progressive thinking Iranians. There is no hope of a revolution from inside of the Iran because they are under constant pressure and constant risk of beeing bombed or invaded by US/Israel.

The US and UK overtook a democratically voted system in 1953, because the voted leaders of this system were bold enough that they wanted to have half of what a british company was earning by exploiting Iranian Oil! They installed a Schah (Sheik) to keep their grip on the oilhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat. Back then it was the same reason the US are at war now for nearly a decade.

And please, think about the stuff you guys are writing here. Calling Iran a military state might be true, but its hipocritical to call out someone else when you have more than half of your budget going to the military! You guys, the US is spending 41% of military money worldwide! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_federations_by_military_expenditures#Stockholm_International_Peace_Research_Institute_figures

The US is working with CIA operations and open military invasions as the main mean of foreign politics since 65 years! There is no region in this world the US was not interfering with the natural progress of civilization. You wonder why the middle east is a big bomb waiting to go boom? Look no further than Israel. Just imagine, native americans would have a lobby as strong as the Jews and would be as aggressive towards you guys as the israelian government is towards everyone in the region! If the UN would demand Manhattan as the place were native americans should live from tomorrow and everybody living there right now would be set into a place not that far away from a concentration camp. Then the Indians would have the support of a increadibly advanced military and would use this as their only means of dealing with discontent from former inhabitiants of Manhattan and bomb the rest of NYC whenever there is something like insurgence. You would hate them! You would (rightfully) fight for the land you are living on since hundreds of years. The only difference is, the palestinians are in no way successors of the reason Israel was founded. You guys live on land once owned by Indians, and in a historical way, are to blame for their downfall. The Jews were killed by Germans! The jews should have gotten a big piece of post WW2 germany, but to give them their own state in a part of the world were no Jew was rooted since more than 2000 years out of religious reasons and not even thinking about those people living there since, was historically the upmost stupid idea anyone could ever have!
This is totally incorrect - see below.

The reasons you are talking like you do are set in a media that is a satire of what it should be. The US americans are held in a state of fear and stupidity. I seriously do not want to insult you guys here, but to read hipocritical stuff like this, it just gets to me. I see the US led politics, supported by countrys like my own Germany, as the main reason for conflict in this world. Since the breakdown of USSR and the missing of someone to keep the US globally in check, your presidents had gone rogue in a way unprecedented. The US invaded Iraq twice, Afghanistan (a country without anything, seriously, there is nothing but sand, stone and **** in the air), and Yugoslavia. The CIA started to torture people for informations in a war against terror! Youre right, the US lost all of its credibility, but not by beeing military inept. The US lost its credibility by beeing hipocritical to the max!

Damn, until America is talking directly with Iran, and for that, all of the countrys your still at war with in a formal sense, nothing will change. As long as the US is treatening every country that is not doing as the US wants them to do, the hate will grow. If you would really bomb Iran, you would unleash hell far beyond 9/11 upon this world. If you want to stop them from having nukes someday, you have to talk to them and propose different options. All they have to do now, is take a look at northern korea. A mentally instable despot is destroying a country without any serious opposition. Kim Yong-Ill has the nuke, and he is sitting on it while he lets the people starve to death and nothing is happening. Because HE HAS THE NUKE!

I will stop right here. Sorry if I offend you, but it was just necessary to write that, I couldnt sleep well without standing up for my believes. I will continue to argue with you guys, and I will give you links to every information you distrust.

You are very right about Iran. We shouldn't bomb them or invade. The present gov't is supported by the uneducated, poor class and the religious fanatics. The educated people, business class, etc are very much opposed to the present gov't. Those are the ones we should be rooting for. But, one thing all Iranians have in common, they love their country. We can't destroy the country. Best is if the present gov't falls. The Revolutionary Guard is taking more and more power (they are the elite fighting force and now control the nuclear program as well). We have to be careful. I am hoping for a military takeover by generals who will support the return to normalcy in the country.

Re: Israel
Your comments are so far off. Your Iran posts are backed up. Your Israeli ones aren't. Briefly, Jews have been living in Palestine/Israel continuously for more than 2,000 years. They just didn't move there....they have lived there all of this time.

Jews lived together with the Palestinians before the Palestinians were Muslim (Islam started less than 1,500 years ago and it took time to "convert" some of the residents of Palestine. Converting then meant - believe in Islam or we kill you.) Palestine was never an independent country but has been ruled by conquerors for over 2,000 years - Rome, Byzantine, Turks, British, etc. The last time it was a country it was Israel, ruled by Jews.

The main thing you have wrong is that the Jews kicked out the Palestinians when Israel became a nation. Actually they were all invited to stay and be part of the new nation. Israel today is 15% Muslim. The other Palestinians left and expected to return in a day or 2 because on the day Israel gained independence, the armed forces of 5 Arab nations mounted an attack which was to purge Israel of every Jewish person, i.e, kill/murder every man, woman and child. Sounds similar to Hitler's Germany. Somehow Israel survived and that was without the support of any other nation.

The Palestinians still live in camps outside of Israel (Gaza Strip, West Bank), after more than 60 years. This is the problem. The other Arab nations wouldn't allow them into their nations. For more than 60 years they have been kept in camps with no economy to develop themselves; their education consists of hating Israel - this is the breeding ground for terrorists. It keeps Israel under attack while some of the other radical arab nations sit back and let these people do their dirty work. The other Arab nations who have so much oil money won't do squat for these people other than send them arms and encourage terrorism. Most of the food and humanitarian aid to the Palestinians comes from the U.S.

It is a tough problem. Fighting is not going to solve it. You need some coherence infused into the collective consciousness of the entire region. Meditation (Transcendental - TM) can do this. And there are programs underway, but larger numbers are needed.