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It took 2 years to clean up, it will take 2 years to build back up.
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Cosmic
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2/19/2010  8:00 AM
Anyone expecting a championship team come July 15, 2010 needs a bit of a wakeup call.

This project was a three part process.

Step 1 (complete): Put an end to the business practice that created the mess. Remove the malcontents. Remove the salary.

Step 2 (pending): Begin building a new team. Try to land a franchise building block and add to it. (2010 offseason through trade deadline Feb 2011

Step 3 (pending): Add to the core in place, possibly even with another top level FA (2011 offseason) and then put some finishing touches on the roster (through deadline 2011)

---->COMPETE (Season of 2011/2012)


This is what it takes to build a team, folks. There will be bumps along the way but make NO mistake this was what had to be done. No use crying over mediocre players that were let go during the process. No use speculating what we can or won't be able to do months from now. Absolutely no reason to expect immediate results and then get upset when they may not come.

It took two years to tear down the mess.

As far as Mike and Walsh are concerned their real job begins this summer. I give management 2 years to prove they are on top of things. Unfortunately I'm quite certain more than half of the NYK internet fan base will lose their minds come August 2010 and demand mass firings and pine for the return of Crawful, Zach, Jeffries, Q, Isiah, and Jordan "Chris Bosh" Hill. But, well...that's on those folks to drive themselves up a wall because they either don't or refuse to understand how things work in the basketball world.

Give them time, pretend that Walsh and Mike were just hired July 1st, 2010. Because, in reality, they were.

Their job is to build a team. Unfortunately they had to spend two years tearing down a team full of mistakes. You should judge them on how they build the team from here on out and forget about the past two seasons entirely.

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TheGame
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2/19/2010  8:51 AM
2 years to clean up, 2 years to build up another mess, 2 years to clean that up, and 2 more years to build up another mess. Do you see a pattern here?
Trust the Process
alau53
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2/19/2010  9:30 AM
a major reason for this mess was trading away 1st rd picks..so what does donnie do..he trades 1st rd picks..stop the insanity
SupremeCommander
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2/19/2010  9:49 AM
Well said. Though I would make a slight alteration:

Step 1 (complete): Put an end to the business practice that created the mess. Remove the malcontents. Remove the salary.

Step 2 (pending): Begin building a new team. Try to land a franchise building block and add to it. (2010 offseason through trade deadline Feb 2011

Step 3 (planned): Add to the core in place, possibly even with another top level FA (2011 offseason) and then put some finishing touches on the roster (through deadline 2011)

Point being that patience is required here and you can't build a house on a **** foundation

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
kam77
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2/19/2010  9:57 AM
Cosmic wrote:
It took two years to tear down the mess.


Inexcusable that the clean up took this long. Should've had this wrapped up last trade deadline with Nate+JJ to Sacto for Kenny Thomas.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
Nalod
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2/19/2010  9:59 AM
Good thread Cos!

Expectations are high amung fans.

Briggy for all his intelect is almost demanding accountability NOW and does not see how unless we land two stars how we can possibly grow. I don't know all that will happen (no Shyt Nalod!) but we could build a team like the Pistons but keep some cap open for Lebron the year after, or CP3, or Howard, or even Durant. Rubio lurks as an interesting possibilty down the road. Not next season, but the year after.

Only Eddy's contract remains as the only toxic remnant from the past. It took two years to erradicate the stench created by the sins of Layden/Isiah.

Our cap space can always be used to aquire picks if we can't starphuch the roster.

We have not even begun to be "crawling from the wreckage"! This is going to take time.

Let the healing begin..........

AnubisADL
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2/19/2010  9:59 AM
2 yrs to build back up with no picks?
NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
Panos
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2/19/2010  10:03 AM
kam77 wrote:
Cosmic wrote:
It took two years to tear down the mess.


Inexcusable that the clean up took this long. Should've had this wrapped up last trade deadline with Nate+JJ to Sacto for Kenny Thomas.


Can we stop throwing this trade rumor around like its fact, please?

Nalod
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2/19/2010  10:10 AM
AnubisADL wrote:2 yrs to build back up with no picks?

We flip our pick next year. Lets be real, if Yao does not come all the way back, and KevMart stays always injured Rockets might not be that great, and we might not be that bad. We lose our 12' pick. Hold your breath.

SerRod is only 23. A young euro style point who MAYBE in the hands of the man that made Nash into a two time MVP could enhance this kid into somting special. Im not saying MVP or Nash 2, but a good player.

Yeah, JHill could be special and Im not thrilled about losing him, but teams lose picks to injury or they are busts all the time. Somtimes the right player on the right team chemistry with the right coach can become special.

Maybe Sergio here can change Rubio about NYC cold weather.

Maybe with some cap we can take a contract from Minny with Rubio's rights for Wilson?

You can get assets with cap.

kam77
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2/19/2010  10:15 AM
Panos wrote:
kam77 wrote:
Cosmic wrote:
It took two years to tear down the mess.


Inexcusable that the clean up took this long. Should've had this wrapped up last trade deadline with Nate+JJ to Sacto for Kenny Thomas.


Can we stop throwing this trade rumor around like its fact, please?


You don't believe it? Fine. Let's say Sacto didn't want that deal as contructed. We could've sweetened the pot and offered our 2012 pick and still had Hill and our 2011.

Donnie ****ed up the ZBO trade too when he could've traded him for a 2nd rounder (and a massive trade exception we could've traded for multiple first rounders) to memphis in the offseason but didn't want to trade him for "nothing".

Donnie Walsh, the game has passed you by.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
iSergio
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2/19/2010  10:21 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/19/2010  10:22 AM
Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.
kam77
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2/19/2010  10:22 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/19/2010  10:24 AM
iSergio wrote:Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.

We had an offer over the summer that Walsh rejected. His value would've been a 2nd round pick to Memphis, but a massive trade exception to us. Sam Presti used the Kurt Thomas trade exception to acquire extra #1 picks. Instead we got Tim Thomas because Walsh that trade exceptions were "nothing".

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
iSergio
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2/19/2010  10:23 AM
kam77 wrote:
iSergio wrote:Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.

We had an offer over the summer that Walsh rejected.

Which 1? Memphis wanted our 1st along with Zach Randolph.

WindsorPl
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2/19/2010  10:24 AM
Nalod wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:2 yrs to build back up with no picks?

We flip our pick next year. Lets be real, if Yao does not come all the way back, and KevMart stays always injured Rockets might not be that great, and we might not be that bad. We lose our 12' pick. Hold your breath.

SerRod is only 23. A young euro style point who MAYBE in the hands of the man that made Nash into a two time MVP could enhance this kid into somting special. Im not saying MVP or Nash 2, but a good player.

Yeah, JHill could be special and Im not thrilled about losing him, but teams lose picks to injury or they are busts all the time. Somtimes the right player on the right team chemistry with the right coach can become special.

Maybe Sergio here can change Rubio about NYC cold weather.

Maybe with some cap we can take a contract from Minny with Rubio's rights for Wilson?

You can get assets with cap.

We can get assets with cap that we gave up assets to get. sounds useless to me.
We had cap without giving away the picks. Everything Cosmic says could have been done without this trade. And why is Al still on the team? I thought he can get us a first. Why didn't Nate get us a first? I am hesitant to trust this regime to get assets, they have proven they gutted the team only by giving them away. Sign of good management is to clear cap while preserving or enhancing the future.

I sincerely hope that Lebron signs here in July. that will solve all these issues, and make everything nice again.

kam77
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2/19/2010  10:25 AM
iSergio wrote:
kam77 wrote:
iSergio wrote:Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.

We had an offer over the summer that Walsh rejected.

Which 1? Memphis wanted our 1st along with Zach Randolph.

Not ths info I have. Walsh simply didn't want to get "nothing" back for a "20-10" player.

He is not aware of how the new NBA works.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
iSergio
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2/19/2010  10:28 AM
kam77 wrote:
iSergio wrote:
kam77 wrote:
iSergio wrote:Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.

We had an offer over the summer that Walsh rejected.

Which 1? Memphis wanted our 1st along with Zach Randolph.

Not ths info I have. Walsh simply didn't want to get "nothing" back for a "20-10" player.

He is not aware of how the new NBA works.

Can you share this info?

And Zach Randolph wasn't viewed as a "20-10" player when he was traded. He was viewed as a cancer with a monster contract.

GodSaveTheKnicks
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2/19/2010  11:26 AM
Nalod wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:2 yrs to build back up with no picks?

We flip our pick next year. Lets be real, if Yao does not come all the way back, and KevMart stays always injured Rockets might not be that great, and we might not be that bad. We lose our 12' pick. Hold your breath.

SerRod is only 23. A young euro style point who MAYBE in the hands of the man that made Nash into a two time MVP could enhance this kid into somting special. Im not saying MVP or Nash 2, but a good player.

Yeah, JHill could be special and Im not thrilled about losing him, but teams lose picks to injury or they are busts all the time. Somtimes the right player on the right team chemistry with the right coach can become special.

Maybe Sergio here can change Rubio about NYC cold weather.

Maybe with some cap we can take a contract from Minny with Rubio's rights for Wilson?

You can get assets with cap.

First time I thought about the whole Sergio --> Ricky recruiting potential. Tantalizing!

Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
Sangfroid
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2/19/2010  11:29 AM
iSergio wrote:
kam77 wrote:
iSergio wrote:Did you forget that Zach Randolph had no trade value when he was traded? No team was going to offer picks for him. And there was is no guarantee Randolph would have played well here and made the All-Star team like he has with Memphis.

We had an offer over the summer that Walsh rejected.

Which 1? Memphis wanted our 1st along with Zach Randolph.

Regardless of anything, our position has to be stronger due to our new cap space and flexibility.

"We are playing a game. We are playing at not playing a game..."
AnubisADL
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2/19/2010  11:45 AM    LAST EDITED: 2/19/2010  11:45 AM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:
Nalod wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:2 yrs to build back up with no picks?

We flip our pick next year. Lets be real, if Yao does not come all the way back, and KevMart stays always injured Rockets might not be that great, and we might not be that bad. We lose our 12' pick. Hold your breath.

SerRod is only 23. A young euro style point who MAYBE in the hands of the man that made Nash into a two time MVP could enhance this kid into somting special. Im not saying MVP or Nash 2, but a good player.

Yeah, JHill could be special and Im not thrilled about losing him, but teams lose picks to injury or they are busts all the time. Somtimes the right player on the right team chemistry with the right coach can become special.

Maybe Sergio here can change Rubio about NYC cold weather.

Maybe with some cap we can take a contract from Minny with Rubio's rights for Wilson?

You can get assets with cap.

First time I thought about the whole Sergio --> Ricky recruiting potential. Tantalizing!

Minnesota still holds his rights and Sergio cant do a dam thing to change. I dont think Rubio needs convincing to come to NYC. He wanted to land here before the draft.

NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
TMS
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2/19/2010  5:18 PM
alau53 wrote:a major reason for this mess was trading away 1st rd picks..so what does donnie do..he trades 1st rd picks..stop the insanity

it's always been Donnie's mantra that he wouldn't mortgage our future just to gain flexibility & dump contracts, yet all that went down the tubes w/this trade... he's gone all in & there's no turning back now... this is just par for the course for DW & MDA's Mode of operations... say 1 thing & do another.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
It took 2 years to clean up, it will take 2 years to build back up.

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