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I missed all of Summer League.. need help
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Elite
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7/22/2009  9:12 PM
I know cosmic hooked it up as usual.... but I'm not tryna watch alllll the games lol which couple of games should I watch to get a good feel for our new guys?
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TMS
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7/22/2009  9:17 PM
Jordan Hill's best game was game 5 vs. WAS
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BasketballJones
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7/22/2009  9:33 PM
Don't bother. Our rookies suck. Jordan Hill has only been playing ball for 5 years, and Tony Douglas can't shoot.

Now you know all you need to know about the Knicks summer league team.
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Cosmic
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7/22/2009  10:00 PM
I put up four out of five games, Elite.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=9IA7GK5T - MEMPHIS

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=H256T8OM - PISTONS

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=VDAKTDS7 - BULLS

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=JFOFPGLR - WIZARDS

...I missed the Kings game.

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Elite
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7/22/2009  10:03 PM
Thanks cos, if you were to watch.. 2 lets say lol which would you choose?
Cosmic
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7/22/2009  10:08 PM
I don't know what to tell you. Hill finally looked good in the Washington game - looked pretty lost the rest of the time.

I suggest you check the boxscores and make a decision based on that.


http://www.nba.com/summerleague2009/team/index.jsp?team=knicks

I liked the Memphis and Bulls games personally. Not really any given reason I just did. But I suggest you do the Washington game to get a look at Hill at his best I suppose. Not too high on the guy but that's a different story altogether.
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Elite
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7/22/2009  10:18 PM
from what i seen and read he sounds like a Udanis Haslem type... at best. Wilcox at worst... Am I far off? What about Douglas?
Cosmic
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7/22/2009  10:32 PM
Posted by Elite:

from what i seen and read he sounds like a Udanis Haslem type... at best. Wilcox at worst... Am I far off? What about Douglas?

Douglas' shot wasn't falling but hearing he is a scorer I guess it will at some point. He was VERY quick and seemed to have a good feel for running an offense, definitely a leader out there, maybe pounded the ball a bit too much but he seems very coachable.

Hill... eh, I just don't know. People are telling me I way too harsh on him but to me I saw a taller, slower, more offensively polished, disinterested, lazy, excuse making, Balkman out there. (He actually said "i'm out of shape" after putting up a garbage performance. Even in his good game, the final Washington game, the guy just got destroyed on the defensive end. I just don't know but I don't feel it with this guy at all. We have enough backup players, in fact, 15 of them, and we select yet another backup player - if he's LUCKY at that. Just looked like TRASH out there.

But, you need to watch to put together your own opinion on the kid. I'm not the end all to end all's but I really feel we had to trade that pick - and after watching Hill? I'd swear trading Hill and Jeffries for a flaming bag of dog **** that expires in 2010 would be a steal.

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Paladin55
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7/22/2009  10:41 PM
Posted by Cosmic:


But, you need to watch to put together your own opinion on the kid. I'm not the end all to end all's but I really feel we had to trade that pick - and after watching Hill? I'd swear trading Hill and Jeffries for a flaming bag of dog **** that expires in 2010 would be a steal.

So you're not the guy who said that Douglas and Hill were going to be the Stockton and Malone of the next decade? ...My mistake.
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Cosmic
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7/22/2009  11:12 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by Cosmic:


But, you need to watch to put together your own opinion on the kid. I'm not the end all to end all's but I really feel we had to trade that pick - and after watching Hill? I'd swear trading Hill and Jeffries for a flaming bag of dog **** that expires in 2010 would be a steal.

So you're not the guy who said that Douglas and Hill were going to be the Stockton and Malone of the next decade? ...My mistake.

Nope. I liked what I saw of Douglas though absolutely. Hill I am way down on. Nothing as advertised. Nothing we need. Nothing we should have picked at 8 or kept.

I mean, the kid himself shows some things, but this isn't what we're needing - a kid to watch develop into a backup PF. That's....what we're looking at.

So my interest is just...not there with Hill. Much more interested in Douglas. Kid has the fire and passion - and is very smart, has a good family background, etc. All the tool to succeed. Hill? Lazy, disinterested, overwhelmed...I could go on but I've already ranted WAY too much on this guy. Hope he proves me wrong - but - he's got a LOT to do to get there.
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Marv
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7/22/2009  11:13 PM
Posted by Elite:

Thanks cos, if you were to watch.. 2 lets say lol which would you choose?

chi and wash.
TMS
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7/22/2009  11:24 PM
Posted by Elite:

from what i seen and read he sounds like a Udanis Haslem type... at best. Wilcox at worst... Am I far off? What about Douglas?

from what's we've seen in SL there's no possible way to put a cap on his upside... he could be Haslem, or he could be Amare, who knows... it's all up to him how hard he works, the physical tools are all there... he showed some nice post moves & a solid midrange shot & he was active under the boards & ran the break well, all things that we talked about in the weeks leading up to the draft when his topic came up.

as far as Douglas goes, he seems like a very active player on the perimeter & obviously has a nose for the ball, good on ball defender & very fast up the court on the break... he was looking to pass first in the first couple games which sorta dispels the notions about him being a shoot first G when we heard people's scouting reports on him after the draft... he definitely still needs to work on shooting consistency... i think he'll be a solid role player for us at the very least, who knows maybe grow into a legitimate starting player someday.

[Edited by - TMS on 07-22-2009 11:25 PM]
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subzero0
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7/23/2009  12:00 AM
Posted by Cosmic:
Posted by Elite:

from what i seen and read he sounds like a Udanis Haslem type... at best. Wilcox at worst... Am I far off? What about Douglas?

Douglas' shot wasn't falling but hearing he is a scorer I guess it will at some point. He was VERY quick and seemed to have a good feel for running an offense, definitely a leader out there, maybe pounded the ball a bit too much but he seems very coachable.

Hill... eh, I just don't know. People are telling me I way too harsh on him but to me I saw a taller, slower, more offensively polished, disinterested, lazy, excuse making, Balkman out there. (He actually said "i'm out of shape" after putting up a garbage performance. Even in his good game, the final Washington game, the guy just got destroyed on the defensive end. I just don't know but I don't feel it with this guy at all. We have enough backup players, in fact, 15 of them, and we select yet another backup player - if he's LUCKY at that. Just looked like TRASH out there.

But, you need to watch to put together your own opinion on the kid. I'm not the end all to end all's but I really feel we had to trade that pick - and after watching Hill? I'd swear trading Hill and Jeffries for a flaming bag of dog **** that expires in 2010 would be a steal.

Hmm so instead of trying to trade for picks we traded for players straight up and ended up with yet another backup player with the only 1st round pick we had. Interesting, interesting.
JohnWallace44
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7/23/2009  10:13 AM
Was I watching the same games? Wasn't the Washington game the one where McGee beat Hill like a redheaded step child?
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TMS
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7/23/2009  10:32 AM
Elite asked which games to watch where our rookies looked the best... Hill had his best game in that game stats wise & put up 21 & 7 against McGee on 9 of 17 shooting, so i wouldn't exaggerate to the extent you're making it out to be... yes, McGee had a very good game with 31 & 8 with 4 blocks on 11 of 16 shooting but he's also got a full year on Hill in development at the NBA level.
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JohnWallace44
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7/23/2009  10:40 AM
Honestly Elite, I wouldn't torture yourself. Watch some of Douglas - he's got a nice handle, but the rest of the time its just players with their own agendas trying to show other teams their skills. We got beat in all the games because we played as a bunch of individuals. Its ugly basketball. I don't think you can take much from it.
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Bippity10
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7/23/2009  12:49 PM
Posted by TMS:

Elite asked which games to watch where our rookies looked the best... Hill had his best game in that game stats wise & put up 21 & 7 against McGee on 9 of 17 shooting, so i wouldn't exaggerate to the extent you're making it out to be... yes, McGee had a very good game with 31 & 8 with 4 blocks on 11 of 16 shooting but he's also got a full year on Hill in development at the NBA level.

I watched that game again. I thought Hill lost concentration over and over again on D. I also think a few times he went after balls like a sissy and guards got rebounds over him. I think at times he is very aggressive and at other times he seems passive. On the offensive end of the ball I thought he looked really good. I'm not sure why not many people talked about it. He has some real nice moves. Drive and spin. Nice bump into hook shots. Missed a couple chippies. I thought he looked pretty good that game. Two shade above the other games in terms of offense.
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TMS
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7/23/2009  12:54 PM
Posted by Bippity10:
Posted by TMS:

Elite asked which games to watch where our rookies looked the best... Hill had his best game in that game stats wise & put up 21 & 7 against McGee on 9 of 17 shooting, so i wouldn't exaggerate to the extent you're making it out to be... yes, McGee had a very good game with 31 & 8 with 4 blocks on 11 of 16 shooting but he's also got a full year on Hill in development at the NBA level.

I watched that game again. I thought Hill lost concentration over and over again on D. I also think a few times he went after balls like a sissy and guards got rebounds over him. I think at times he is very aggressive and at other times he seems passive. On the offensive end of the ball I thought he looked really good. I'm not sure why not many people talked about it. He has some real nice moves. Drive and spin. Nice bump into hook shots. Missed a couple chippies. I thought he looked pretty good that game. Two shade above the other games in terms of offense.

fair assessment & i agree, he's still got things to work out on defense but his offensive game is miles better than what we saw out of D Lee his rookie season.
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TheGame
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7/23/2009  1:45 PM
Elite,

This was the worst summer league team we have had in 5 years. Absolutely clueless on how to play team basketball. Honestly, you would be better off not watching it.
Trust the Process
TMS
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7/23/2009  1:51 PM
SL games don't mean squat either way, so from that standpoint i agree w/TheGame... but he's saying we had the worst SL team in 5 years as if that should reflect on how these guys will perform in regular season games... don't pay much mind to what you see either way, just pay attention to the skillsets that are being displayed by the prospects you're watching... like Bippity pointed out, Hill showed some good things & in other areas he was a little deficient, just like almost any other rookie prospect you will watch in SL games... Stephen Curry shot the ball absolutely horrendously during SL games but that doesn't mean he's a bust either.
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