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From RealGm Poster review of Harden workout w/Grizzlies
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CrushAlot
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6/20/2009  10:11 PM
The Grizzlies held their second major draft workout Friday morning with former Arizona State swingman James Harden, considered a darkhorse candidate for the #2 pick.

Harden had, frankly, a terrible workout, missing an avalanche of jumpshots while dealing with the stifling defense of small orange cones. Arguably worse than all the missed shots was how clearly frustrated Harden got.

Afterward, a team official pulled me aside and said 'Look, we both know that was one of the worst workouts we've seen, but we've seen this kid enough to know what he can do."

The Grizzlies were supposed to have three individual workouts in succession tomorrow morning with Hasheem Thabeet, Jordan Hill, and DeMar DeRozan, but apparently Thabeet has pulled out of the workout, citing injury. From what I've been told, Thabeet did not make the trip to Memphis at all this weekend. I'll try to find out more about this at the Forum tomorrow.
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Anji
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6/20/2009  10:34 PM
Honestly, the way this reads players are saying they don't want to play in Memphis without actually coming out and saying it...............
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
Caseloads
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6/20/2009  10:43 PM
teh Grizz should have stayed in 'Couveer
TMS
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6/21/2009  3:43 AM
Harden is not impressive to me in the least
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Paladin55
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6/21/2009  8:50 PM
Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
TMS
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6/21/2009  9:32 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.

he's just average talent wise & isn't particularly athletic if u ask me, doesn't possess a great handle, doesn't have great explosion... he's a solid shooter but i don't think he projects as a star in the NBA... plus he looked completely lost in the biggest game of the year for his team last year... i didn't like what i saw outta him.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Pharzeone
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6/21/2009  10:14 PM
I was on the DeRozan bandwagon over a year ago but you got to kidding yourself if you don't think this guy is falling faster than bricks. Use a #5 pick on him when he will there at 6, 7, 8 and 9. I see now where the Raptors have soured on him. As far as Harden goes, he has been taking his workouts serious. Everyone got on Jennings for running his mouth but DeRozan did the same with Harden and didn't measure up at the combine against him.

Hoopsworld says that therefs a rumor making the rounds that the Thunder might take DeMar DeRozan #3. This sounds a little fishy to me because everything Ifm seeing shows DeRozan slipping a little after poor agility and sprint tests at the combine. James Harden has the better standing vertical and is just 1.5 off of DeRozanfs max vertical. Harden also beat DeRozan soundly in the agility and sprint tests and is the much more polished offensive player at this point. DeRozan is 1.5 taller, but Harden has a higher reach because he has a longer wingspan.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
TMS
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6/22/2009  10:47 AM
i don't give a rat's patootie if his stock is falling... he's the same exact kid now that he was at the end of the season when i saw him playing like a star in the making... all these scouting reports & mock drafts don't mean jack to me, i know what i saw & i see some special talent in this kid.

i defy anyone who actually watched the Pac 10 championship game to tell me that Harden is the better prospect out of the 2... don't give me standing vertical tests or whatever... Derozan is so much more athletic & explosive than Harden it's not even funny... this is on the basketball court i'm talking about, not during some combine tests with some bald dude with a stopwatch or ruler standing next to you.

[Edited by - TMS on 06-22-2009 07:50 AM]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
K22
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6/22/2009  10:49 AM
Posted by Caseloads:

teh Grizz should have stayed in 'Couveer

To be fair, the Grizz have built a champion.

In Los Angeles.
-- the preceding post was brought to you by the letter K and the number 22.
SupremeCommander
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6/22/2009  10:54 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.

he's just average talent wise & isn't particularly athletic if u ask me, doesn't possess a great handle, doesn't have great explosion... he's a solid shooter but i don't think he projects as a star in the NBA... plus he looked completely lost in the biggest game of the year for his team last year... i didn't like what i saw outta him.

I'm with you... and I'm not really all that into DeRozan either. Harden crapped the bed in the clutch and isn't exactly an uber athlete... I wouldn't be surprised if Harden's career loosely mirrored JJ Reddick's and I think you'd want more from #2

[Edited by - supremecommander on 06-22-2009 10:54 AM]
DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
Paladin55
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6/22/2009  5:18 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.

he's just average talent wise & isn't particularly athletic if u ask me, doesn't possess a great handle, doesn't have great explosion... he's a solid shooter but i don't think he projects as a star in the NBA... plus he looked completely lost in the biggest game of the year for his team last year... i didn't like what i saw outta him.

Just trying to get you going... I know that DeRozan is someone you like


Harden looked very average in his last 3 games. Crafty, but nothing special and very slow.

Of the non-Blake Griffin draft hopefuls, only Rubio, Thabeet, Harden, and DeRozan have refused to workout against other players, I think. I can understand why Rubio (in his case he has not worked out at all) feels he can get away with it- he has a large body of work against good competition for a team to use in making a decision on him (and he can also choose to remain in Spain), and as for Thabeet, I think he and his agent are cowards- hoping that his major flaws do not get exposed.

As for Harden and especially DeRozan, who has not generally been thought of as a top 5 pick, I think that they are trying to minimize the exposure of certain weaknesses in their games. At least Harden seems to have improved his body though, that was obvious in the Combine. DeRozan was surprisingly common at the Combine. Most likely Harden is trying to hide some of the issues that came up during March Madness, and DeRozan is trying to hide the fact that he is still very raw as a player.

It is sad that the agents are the driving force behind everything a prospect does leading up to the draft.
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
BRIGGS
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6/22/2009  5:33 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Paladin55:

[quote]Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.

he's just average talent wise & isn't particularly athletic if u ask me, doesn't possess a great handle, doesn't have great explosion... he's a solid shooter but i don't think he projects as a star in the NBA... plus he looked completely lost in the biggest game of the year for his team last year... i didn't like what i saw outta him.

Just trying to get you going... I know that DeRozan is someone you like


Harden looked very average in his last 3 games. Crafty, but nothing special and very slow.

Of the non-Blake Griffin draft hopefuls, only Rubio, Thabeet, Harden, and DeRozan have refused to workout against other players, I think. I can understand why Rubio (in his case he has not worked out at all) feels he can get away with it- he has a large body of work against good competition for a team to use in making a decision on him (and he can also choose to remain in Spain), and as for Thabeet, I think he and his agent are cowards- hoping that his major flaws do not get exposed.



I'll just say this for Thabeet--I have seen him play up close and personal in pick up basketball. I believe that he would look incredible in a private type workout. If someone is calling him into see if he jack up 3s--than he was the wrong guy for the job anyway. If you want to see a 7-3 athletic C who can do a lot of things with the ball not even seen in games he has played--then I think some people would be surprised.

If it is game film you are looking for --it's in incredible abundance--he's been at the college level for 3 years. I don't think there is anywhere near the film on Rubio than there is on Thabeet. If that is not good enough why don't the Knicks simply call guys like the Ray Allen's Emeka Okafor Caron Butler who have played against Hash last summer and ask them what they think.
I cant buy the argument that Rubio went up agaisnt players who are even 1/2 as good as guys like Allen and Butler. Earl Clark went up against Hash in a game this year and shot like 2-15
I would love to see Rubio go up against Nate Miles nevermind guys like Tyreke Evans or Johnny Flynn. I am not buying 5 minutes against team USA--if thats what the Knicks are looking at they should be picking Patty Mills first. To me Rubio is the biggest risk in the top picks for many reasons.
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JohnWallace44
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6/22/2009  5:43 PM
If somebody can predict who will be the top five players two-three years down the road in this draft I would be amazed.

I can't tell you who has the stuff to make it.

However, I know which guys are big for their positions, and they won't be any smaller in three years.

Derozan, Evans, Holiday and Thabeet

Seems like there are a lot of flawed guys in this draft that could help us because of the system. Johnson, Brown, Jennings, Rubio, Beaubois...

who knows... I just hope we can get multiple picks so that there's better odds that we hit on something
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
BRIGGS
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6/22/2009  5:55 PM
Posted by JohnWallace44:

If somebody can predict who will be the top five players two-three years down the road in this draft I would be amazed.

I can't tell you who has the stuff to make it.

However, I know which guys are big for their positions, and they won't be any smaller in three years.

Derozan, Evans, Holiday and Thabeet

Seems like there are a lot of flawed guys in this draft that could help us because of the system. Johnson, Brown, Jennings, Rubio, Beaubois...

who knows... I just hope we can get multiple picks so that there's better odds that we hit on something

I have a strong feeling Evans Griffin and Curry will be the top 3. After that--I have some guesses but thats all it is. I do think that Thabeet is going to be way better than all of these experts who say he is a bust.
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TMS
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6/22/2009  7:42 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by TMS:

Harden is not impressive to me in the least

Spoken like a true supporter of DeRozan, who, for some reason, seems to dislike Harden.

he's just average talent wise & isn't particularly athletic if u ask me, doesn't possess a great handle, doesn't have great explosion... he's a solid shooter but i don't think he projects as a star in the NBA... plus he looked completely lost in the biggest game of the year for his team last year... i didn't like what i saw outta him.

Just trying to get you going... I know that DeRozan is someone you like


Harden looked very average in his last 3 games. Crafty, but nothing special and very slow.

Of the non-Blake Griffin draft hopefuls, only Rubio, Thabeet, Harden, and DeRozan have refused to workout against other players, I think. I can understand why Rubio (in his case he has not worked out at all) feels he can get away with it- he has a large body of work against good competition for a team to use in making a decision on him (and he can also choose to remain in Spain), and as for Thabeet, I think he and his agent are cowards- hoping that his major flaws do not get exposed.

As for Harden and especially DeRozan, who has not generally been thought of as a top 5 pick, I think that they are trying to minimize the exposure of certain weaknesses in their games. At least Harden seems to have improved his body though, that was obvious in the Combine. DeRozan was surprisingly common at the Combine. Most likely Harden is trying to hide some of the issues that came up during March Madness, and DeRozan is trying to hide the fact that he is still very raw as a player.

It is sad that the agents are the driving force behind everything a prospect does leading up to the draft.

i can see your reasoning on this & to a certain extent i think you're right about Derozan, his game is still very raw & he's got some obvious weaknesses that he probably wouldn't want displayed next to guys who are more advanced in their development... that said, i am willing to bet u that put him & 4 other SG's on the floor at the same time & ask a GM to determine who stands out to them in terms of upside potential & sheer "Wow" factor, & IMO Derozan is very likely to come out on top.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
kam77
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6/22/2009  9:40 PM
Is it me, or does Harden seem overweight to you guys too.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
nyk4ever
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6/22/2009  10:40 PM
Posted by kam77:

Is it me, or does Harden seem overweight to you guys too.

Harden seems overweight, overhyped and overated.
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McK1
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6/22/2009  10:58 PM
Harden is a play-maker and will be one of those guys who average 15-20 and 4-5 assists from the 2 spot.




the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
TMS
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6/23/2009  1:10 AM
15 & 4, i can see that... 20 & 5 is definitely a reach but i guess anything can happen w/prospects... i never thought Rondo would ever be as good as he's turned out to be either... i don't see Harden ever becoming a go-to guy on any team... he's more of a 3rd fiddle type player in my eyes.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
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