I meant this as an original topic, not a reply on the previous post.>>>
The rumored deal between the Mavs & Warriors is interesting. It's supposed to be announced/approved on Monday. Garbage aside...this is basically a Nick Van Exel/Antawn Jamison deal with the added exchange of decent rebounders Popeye Jones & the better, but more expensive Danny Fortson. I can see the sense from the Warrior angle (replacing Arenas). But the Mavs? Sure Jamison can score but didn't they become more of the same thing (a bunch of guns with little inside toughness)?

Posted by purple012870:

I meant this as an original topic, not a reply on the previous post.>>>
The rumored deal between the Mavs & Warriors is interesting. It's supposed to be announced/approved on Monday. Garbage aside...this is basically a Nick Van Exel/Antawn Jamison deal with the added exchange of decent rebounders Popeye Jones & the better, but more expensive Danny Fortson. I can see the sense from the Warrior angle (replacing Arenas). But the Mavs? Sure Jamison can score but didn't they become more of the same thing (a bunch of guns with little inside toughness)?

I agree, I mean where does Jamison fit in Dallas? they needed a inside presence, espcially on defense, Jamison is weak defensively..
the warriors got rid of a lot of garbage contracts. Jamison was a max player and Fortson had a garbage contract, the only thing I didn't like was throwing Welsh into the deal..

Golden State got raped! I don't care if they say they did it for cap space or to free up a forward spot because cap space is the most overrated thing in the NBA today. You basically trade your best player or players for expiring contracts so you can get under the cap in a year or two and after sucking for those one or two years you sign that hot free agent you've been after for a huge deal and you end up being in the same situation that you were a couple of years ago with the same type of player that you are overpaying. It makes no sense. Jamison was their best player. They will look to sign another player exactly like him in a couple of years and be in the same situation. Thats why i never want the knicks to trade for cap space. Holding onto a contract like Knight's is nice because you can get him off the books without losing a lot or going out of your way. But the Knicks need to sign players for large contracts as long as they know they will contribute. If they trade for cap space they are basically wasting a few years and sucking really bad just to sign that player a few years down the road whos going to make them no better than they were when the were trying to free up space. I can't stand how all the teams are doing this now. Dallas came out a great team having Bradley and LaFrentz at center, Jamison, Nowitzki, Fortson, and Howard as forwards, and Finley, Nash, and Welsh at guards. Plus they could still sign someone like Best, Anderson, or Strickland. They are going to be loading while GS just traded away a team that almost made it to the playoffs last year in the west and are going to be one of the worse 5 or 6 teams in the league this year.

My breakdown:

Dallas gets the better players in this deal.
Jamison is a quality scorer, inside and out--- he's a lot like KVH, a very good "versatile" forward (tho KVH is taller and a better shooter, with Jamison perhaps the better rebounder).

Fortson is a potential double-double guy, a Dennis Rodman-like rebounder in a thick little body. If anything, he gives them bulk and toughness off the bench, perhaps like a young Mase or young KT for the Knicks. He's something the team lacked last year (sorry Popeye, you just haven't been the same since your first stint w/ Dallas!). IMHO, he could be the key player in this deal. His tweener size might not be a problem with the 7' Nowitzki on the floor. However, he didn't do much last year, and his contract is fairly sizable...

Mills is junk--- at his best, he's not much more than Buckner or Griffin. He's been broken down for years.

Welsch was a highly touted draft pick last year, and if he's ready to contribute, he provides the team with a good shooter in the backcourt.

The loss of Van Exel removes their "structural flaw" of having 2 top PGs on the team, and also sheds them of one of their oldest players.


I don't get what Golden State accomplished with this deal-- did they really get better? They'll probably save/earn millions from this deal, and they'll open up more playing time for their younger players.

I bet Speedy Claxton is PISSED OFF--- 1 minute, he's pegged as starting PG, next... it's 15 minutes off the bench again!!! Dunleavy Jr stands to benefit greatly from this deal, as does their first round pick and Richardson, at least in terms of playing time potential.

I don't think Popeye has a guaranteed contract, neither does AJ. Eschmeyer is at least relatively cheap.

I guess this ends any talk of Kurt Thomas to Dallas. I wonder how this affects Foyle being traded--- if they deem him useless (he is coming off surgery after all), they could potentially package him for Ward and buy out Ward... then the Knicks or another team could sign him for Vet's minimum.

Posted by technomaster:

My breakdown:

Dallas gets the better players in this deal.
Jamison is a quality scorer, inside and out--- he's a lot like KVH, a very good "versatile" forward (tho KVH is taller and a better shooter, with Jamison perhaps the better rebounder).

Fortson is a potential double-double guy, a Dennis Rodman-like rebounder in a thick little body. If anything, he gives them bulk and toughness off the bench, perhaps like a young Mase or young KT for the Knicks. He's something the team lacked last year (sorry Popeye, you just haven't been the same since your first stint w/ Dallas!). IMHO, he could be the key player in this deal. His tweener size might not be a problem with the 7' Nowitzki on the floor. However, he didn't do much last year, and his contract is fairly sizable...

Mills is junk--- at his best, he's not much more than Buckner or Griffin. He's been broken down for years.

Welsch was a highly touted draft pick last year, and if he's ready to contribute, he provides the team with a good shooter in the backcourt.

The loss of Van Exel removes their "structural flaw" of having 2 top PGs on the team, and also sheds them of one of their oldest players.


I don't get what Golden State accomplished with this deal-- did they really get better? They'll probably save/earn millions from this deal, and they'll open up more playing time for their younger players.

I bet Speedy Claxton is PISSED OFF--- 1 minute, he's pegged as starting PG, next... it's 15 minutes off the bench again!!! Dunleavy Jr stands to benefit greatly from this deal, as does their first round pick and Richardson, at least in terms of playing time potential.

I don't think Popeye has a guaranteed contract, neither does AJ. Eschmeyer is at least relatively cheap.

I guess this ends any talk of Kurt Thomas to Dallas. I wonder how this affects Foyle being traded--- if they deem him useless (he is coming off surgery after all), they could potentially package him for Ward and buy out Ward... then the Knicks or another team could sign him for Vet's minimum.

Fortson will not see enough minutes to get double, doubles in dallas, dallas is a motion offense team, fortson really for his size does not have a good post game, he will give them some tough boards, but lets not fool ourselves Dallas is a offensive team, Fortson will not see the minutes, to mention he and rodman in the same sentence is a Joke, Rodman was not only a great rebounder but a good passer, great defender and he ran the floor like a deer, rodman was not a scorer but a good guy on offense because he was a good passer and took care of the ball well..

Jamison is a SF who prefers to play PF but is too small.... He is a good scorer but his game over the past few years has gone more outside than inside. Again people rely on ESPN to tell them how good a player is. I have seen a lot of GS games and believe me that team will be better with NVE at the point and Richarson at the SG and murphy getting Jamison's minutes...

Perhaps I overstated Fortson's value-- he isn't Rodman-- he is a good rebounder. He's a banger, there's no doubt about that. Having someone with his strength in the post certainly will help when they try to face the Shaqs, Duncans, Brad Millers, Karl Malones, etc. I think he can eat away at La Frentz and Bradley's PT.

I'm not exactly sure how Jamison fits in with the team--- but it's always a luxury to have someone with his talent level on the team (regardless what his critics say).

Murphy was already getting big minutes (he was a major find on my keeper fantasy league)--- one thing he'll get is more shots on the offensive end.

hahaha.. Fortson is too short to guard the malones nevertheless the shaqs of the world, believe me if fortson was worth his weight he would have been getting burn in GS. In the playoffs, the team that dictates the tempo wins, don't always buy into the cliche half court game playa, if the other team aint making shots the mavs will run. fortson may be good for a team that plays a grind em out half court game but that is not the mavs dukes!!

<I guess this ends any talk of Kurt Thomas to Dallas.>

Yep. they don't need Thomas now. Man, how can Dallas get rid of 4 players and still be so damn deep?

With Lafrentz/Bradley/(Fortson?) at Center, Notzwiki/Najera/Fortson at Forward, Jamison/Mills/Najera at SF, Finley/Howard/Abdul-wahad at Gaurd, and Nash/(Daniels?) at the point, they have alot of options.

I don't know. There could be a deal there, still. They need a real backup for Nash, unless they go with the rook at point. They could also use another option at the 2, and another option at center.

I don't think there is any deal here for the knicks, despite the help several of the knicks could give them. They aren't going to give up anything at this point, so unless Trader Scott wants to get nothing for something the Knicks should stand firm.

<Nash is lacking a proper backup now...maybe Ward can be shipped to Dallas for someone or they could work out a 3-way with another team?>

Yeah, but the Knicks are thin in the backcourt as well. Houston/Andersen at the 2, Eisley/Williams/Ward at Point. I guess it will have to do.

Ward is probably the only tradable option there, but what do the Mavs have to offer in return? They aren't likely to give up anything of value, like Najera or Finely, and we under no circumstances want Bradley.

Posted by tkf:

hahaha.. Fortson is too short to guard the malones nevertheless the shaqs of the world, believe me if fortson was worth his weight he would have been getting burn in GS. In the playoffs, the team that dictates the tempo wins, don't always buy into the cliche half court game playa, if the other team aint making shots the mavs will run. fortson may be good for a team that plays a grind em out half court game but that is not the mavs dukes!!

Sorry bro, but don't mix my point with other postas.My point was when the 4th qtr comes around and the game is close it's "ALL ABOUT HALF COURT"! When Fortson gets the REB it means he starts the fast break, he doesn't have to be a finisher on the break he has too many teammates(weapons) to do that. Now what playoff game this past season didn't you see half court being huge in 4th qtr with the game being tight, cmon man this aint enyspree you talking to.Fortson has a nose for the rock, he's the guy who positions himself to get that loose (off)reb that resets the shot clock and demoralizes the other team that's hustling trying to play good defense as shot clock is running down defense.

Posted by GoNyGoNyGo:

Playa, one question. All of a sudden you are a half court guy? Didn't wae argue about whether NY should run ore or stay half court for all those years? What gives? I agree with your last 2 posts but I am suprised they come from you!

A running team has not won a ring since the Showtime Lakers.

exactly, but one thing playa is forgetting, Fortson is one step above Being a bum, playa is making him out to be bill russel starting the breaks with rebounds. Fortson is a better offensive rebound and that is only because he knows he can get extra shots that way. he is overestimating fortson..