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D'Antoni quote - when asked what trait do you least like -- "I hate selfish basketball players".
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LivingLegend
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7/18/2008  12:34 PM
That doesn't bode well for Steph and Zach.

At the heart of it - Walsh may feel he's better off keeping the talent around but D'Antoni may be telling him get these guys out of my locker room.
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purple012870
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7/18/2008  12:40 PM
I loved reading that. That quote, to me, was step 1.
nyk4ever
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7/18/2008  12:45 PM
Posted by purple012870:

I loved reading that. That quote, to me, was step 1.

Yeah I agree.

I honestly think all this is geared towards pumping up Zach's value. I see Zach averaging 23pts and 12rebs and the Knicks will get something decent in return for him at some point before the trade deadline this year. Zach will be on his absolute best behavior this year so he can get out.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Elite
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7/18/2008  12:56 PM
nice quote
Bippity10
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7/18/2008  1:15 PM
As long as he doesn't steal their joy he will be fine
I just hope that people will like me
Paladin55
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7/18/2008  1:21 PM
D'Antoni is also establishing a fair standard for playing and not playing guys. I believe that he is coming into this season with an "open mind" regarding certain players, but we all know that he has a pretty good idea how certain guys will play based on past history.

I actually have problems understanding the idea that you might play a guy to build up his value for a trade. If Zach, for instance, plays "well" in D'Antoni's system, and we win more than we lose- why trade him? If he plays well and the Knicks are still losing, other teams will probably figure that Zach is Zach- putting up big numbers on a losing team, so why offer anything more than they would offer now. At the same time I understand that if the guy simply cannot play in the system, and his numbers are down because of limited time on the floor- it will be more difficult to trade him.

Everyone knows what Randolph, Marbury, and Lee can do. I prefer to keep Lee, despite the talk that D'Antoni did not like him coming out of college. He is young and has talent. He's improved his foul shooting, and don't see why he cannot do the same with his jumper. Marbury and Randolph might have value for veteran teams. Randolph is still a great offensive player and effective rebounder- he could help a team in need of instant offense, and Marbury could be serviceable on a team with vets who will keep him in his place. If we could get some kind of cap related deal and a later 1st round pick for Randolph, and a 2nd for Marbury I would trade them quickly. I might even do it just for the picks.

By the way, I don't know what they're going to do with Curry on this team, and who would want him at this point. Maybe trade him for Tractor Traylor- at least Gallinari would feel safer.

[Edited by - Paladin55 on 07-18-2008 1:23 PM]
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EnySpree
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7/18/2008  1:22 PM
D'antoni is a very confident person. I think he truly believes in what he wants to do. I don't think he'll have a problem convincing these guys to play his way.

Zach himself is kind of a douche.....on the court I don't think anyone can accuse him of being selfish. He wants to win and he's never takin a game off. He just hasn't been on a good team in a while. When he was young on portland he wasn't accused of being selfish....cuz they were winning.

Knicks as a team still sucks.....but selfish? I don't think he'll have a problem with that. Marbs is the only person.

I believe in D'antoni's ability to coach. The players will follow, and hopefully Walsh can follow that lead and not screw it up.
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EnySpree
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7/18/2008  1:31 PM
I agree with paladin's point on Zach.....

If he plays well in D'antoni's system......shouldn't we look to keep him and add pieces that fit around him? I mean damn if Zach puts up more than 20/10.....who would we look to trade him for that we can't trade him for now?

[Edited by - enyspree on 18-07-2008 1:34 PM]
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fishmike
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7/18/2008  2:04 PM
Posted by EnySpree:

D'antoni is a very confident person. I think he truly believes in what he wants to do. I don't think he'll have a problem convincing these guys to play his way.

Zach himself is kind of a douche.....on the court I don't think anyone can accuse him of being selfish. He wants to win and he's never takin a game off. He just hasn't been on a good team in a while. When he was young on portland he wasn't accused of being selfish....cuz they were winning.

Knicks as a team still sucks.....but selfish? I don't think he'll have a problem with that. Marbs is the only person.

I believe in D'antoni's ability to coach. The players will follow, and hopefully Walsh can follow that lead and not screw it up.
to me you nailed it. Zach has been on bad teams plain and simple. The one decent team he was on he played very very well. He was huge in that playoff series where the Blazers almost came back 0-3 on the Mavs and pushed a game 7. And yes Eny.. I agree... he's a douche. But he's a good player for us and helps us win he's our douche. Kinda like DJ is my douche. Zach is an emotional guy and wants to win. Of this I have no doubt. The question will be what he's willing to do to win. Mike's a player's coach and Zach will play hard.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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7/18/2008  2:09 PM
we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
playa2
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7/18/2008  2:29 PM
Posted by fishmike:

we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov

Fish with the names mentioned above what will make this team perform when they didn't for LB ?


I can see players having issues with each other, when somebody else is shooting too much and not making shots and then on top of that not playing any defense and the team continues to lose.

What will Dantoni do differently with this same group of guys adding roberson and "the gall" + letting chandler play more.

Winning is contagious and makes passing the rock easy, but losing with the coach giving you a green light can be detrimental to a cultural change.


Is everyone convinced that Dantoni is that much of a difference this coming season with the knicks players to change the culture?

LB was a HOF coach and he couldn't change the culture.

REMEMBER YOU CAN'T TRADE REBELLIOUS PLAYERS THAT NOBODY IS WILLING TO TRADE FOR- ASK LARRY.

Can we say the knicks could average 105 pts a game , but not many W's.

JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
EnySpree
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7/18/2008  2:41 PM
Styles have to match the players.....

Now the Knicks haven't had a style of play since lenny was out there. when he was fired and Herb was the coach, you could immediately see the spacing change. He shifted things around Sweetney.

Anyway.....these current Knicks always seem to go nuts and play well when the pace is quick and frantic......D'antoni likes to play this way for 48 mins.....only thing is he's under control of this madness and actually has guys setting up in area's where they can be sucessfull.

I think D'antoni fits the Knicks quite well. Like I said is up to Donnie to make the right moves to continue to bring in the right players 1-15.
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EnySpree
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7/18/2008  2:42 PM
Styles have to match the players.....

Now the Knicks haven't had a style of play since lenny was out there. when he was fired and Herb was the coach, you could immediately see the spacing change. He shifted things around Sweetney.

Anyway.....these current Knicks always seem to go nuts and play well when the pace is quick and frantic......D'antoni likes to play this way for 48 mins.....only thing is he's under control of this madness and actually has guys setting up in area's where they can be sucessfull.

I think D'antoni fits the Knicks quite well. Like I said is up to Donnie to make the right moves to continue to bring in the right players 1-15.
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fishmike
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7/18/2008  2:47 PM
Posted by playa2:
Posted by fishmike:

we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov

Fish with the names mentioned above what will make this team perform when they didn't for LB ?


I can see players having issues with each other, when somebody else is shooting too much and not making shots and then on top of that not playing any defense and the team continues to lose.

What will Dantoni do differently with this same group of guys adding roberson and "the gall" + letting chandler play more.

Winning is contagious and makes passing the rock easy, but losing with the coach giving you a green light can be detrimental to a cultural change.


Is everyone convinced that Dantoni is that much of a difference this coming season with the knicks players to change the culture?

LB was a HOF coach and he couldn't change the culture.

REMEMBER YOU CAN'T TRADE REBELLIOUS PLAYERS THAT NOBODY IS WILLING TO TRADE FOR- ASK LARRY.

Can we say the knicks could average 105 pts a game , but not many W's.
for starters Larry asked them to do things they were not good at.. at all. He asked a bunch of scorers to share the ball and play defense. Mike D will ask a bunch of scorers to score.

Also Larry clearly wasnt backed by Isiah and the players quit on him. Watch was happens if someone quits on Mike D... I can be quiet sure that player will be gone very very quickly.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
MS
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7/18/2008  2:48 PM
Wait so it's just steph and zach?

Jamal isn't selfish why?
Settles for long range jumpers, takes the offense on when the numbers are against him, doesn't ever play defense?

Nate?
He isn't selfish

If you don't try on the defensive end your'e a selfish player, if you don't get yourself into shape your'e selfish, if you don't but the team first you're selfish.

So selfish players include: Steph, Nate, Crawford, Zach, Curry
Bippity10
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7/18/2008  2:48 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by playa2:
Posted by fishmike:

we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov

Fish with the names mentioned above what will make this team perform when they didn't for LB ?


I can see players having issues with each other, when somebody else is shooting too much and not making shots and then on top of that not playing any defense and the team continues to lose.

What will Dantoni do differently with this same group of guys adding roberson and "the gall" + letting chandler play more.

Winning is contagious and makes passing the rock easy, but losing with the coach giving you a green light can be detrimental to a cultural change.


Is everyone convinced that Dantoni is that much of a difference this coming season with the knicks players to change the culture?

LB was a HOF coach and he couldn't change the culture.

REMEMBER YOU CAN'T TRADE REBELLIOUS PLAYERS THAT NOBODY IS WILLING TO TRADE FOR- ASK LARRY.

Can we say the knicks could average 105 pts a game , but not many W's.
for starters Larry asked them to do things they were not good at.. at all. He asked a bunch of scorers to share the ball and play defense. Mike D will ask a bunch of scorers to score.

Also Larry clearly wasnt backed by Isiah and the players quit on him. Watch was happens if someone quits on Mike D... I can be quiet sure that player will be gone very very quickly.

Amen on both points brother
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nixluva
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7/18/2008  2:52 PM
Posted by playa2:
Posted by fishmike:

we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov

Fish with the names mentioned above what will make this team perform when they didn't for LB ?


I can see players having issues with each other, when somebody else is shooting too much and not making shots and then on top of that not playing any defense and the team continues to lose.

What will Dantoni do differently with this same group of guys adding roberson and "the gall" + letting chandler play more.

Winning is contagious and makes passing the rock easy, but losing with the coach giving you a green light can be detrimental to a cultural change.


Is everyone convinced that Dantoni is that much of a difference this coming season with the knicks players to change the culture?

LB was a HOF coach and he couldn't change the culture.

REMEMBER YOU CAN'T TRADE REBELLIOUS PLAYERS THAT NOBODY IS WILLING TO TRADE FOR- ASK LARRY.

Can we say the knicks could average 105 pts a game , but not many W's.
Don't even bring up LB, cuz that situation was totally different. He had an agenda from day one and no one can convince me otherwise. He even apologizes for his behavior now. His friends even said that they didn't agree with what he did. Mike is a guy that gets players to buy in and his track record proves it. Even now his old team still loves him. LB can't say the same. He's a HOF coach, but he does wear on his players and owners. LB is a short term fix in the right situation, ours wasn't it.

This team isn't going to be browbeat into doing things they aren't capable of doing. Mike wants to play fast and smart and he's going to identify players that can play that way. We have some guys that can do it now and some that can't. i would expect that Walsh will do what he can to add what Mike needs and move those we don't.

We can't continue to live in the past with this new regime. Different people with a new purpose and skill set. Mike and Walsh are on the same page and that will make a huge difference. Also neither coach is a lame duck like isiah was so that will also mean that they aren't being pressured into making selfish decisions. They can focus on the success of the team.
nyk4ever
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7/18/2008  2:57 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by playa2:
Posted by fishmike:

we have scorers. Crawford, Zach, Eddy, Gallo, Chandler and Nate are all guys that can put the ball in the basket. I am very curious and excited to see what the best offensive coach comes up with for this group and what it looks like in Nov

Fish with the names mentioned above what will make this team perform when they didn't for LB ?


I can see players having issues with each other, when somebody else is shooting too much and not making shots and then on top of that not playing any defense and the team continues to lose.

What will Dantoni do differently with this same group of guys adding roberson and "the gall" + letting chandler play more.

Winning is contagious and makes passing the rock easy, but losing with the coach giving you a green light can be detrimental to a cultural change.


Is everyone convinced that Dantoni is that much of a difference this coming season with the knicks players to change the culture?

LB was a HOF coach and he couldn't change the culture.

REMEMBER YOU CAN'T TRADE REBELLIOUS PLAYERS THAT NOBODY IS WILLING TO TRADE FOR- ASK LARRY.

Can we say the knicks could average 105 pts a game , but not many W's.
for starters Larry asked them to do things they were not good at.. at all. He asked a bunch of scorers to share the ball and play defense. Mike D will ask a bunch of scorers to score.

Also Larry clearly wasnt backed by Isiah and the players quit on him. Watch was happens if someone quits on Mike D... I can be quiet sure that player will be gone very very quickly.

Couldn't have said it better myself Fish. D'Antoni and Walsh are working together unlike Isiah/Larry.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
fishmike
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7/18/2008  3:16 PM
I will say this... we have all varied in great degree about these players. There was a time when earl, holfresh, nixluva, etc were preaching patience for Isiah and a lot of the players currently on the roster. Bottom line is its now or never for Curry, Crawford, Zach and even Nate for the most part. I hope they all do well, and I think except for Curry they will. I think Curry is dealt during training camp.. hopefully after a couple good preseason games
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
bitty41
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7/18/2008  3:29 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by purple012870:

I loved reading that. That quote, to me, was step 1.

Yeah I agree.

I honestly think all this is geared towards pumping up Zach's value. I see Zach averaging 23pts and 12rebs and the Knicks will get something decent in return for him at some point before the trade deadline this year. Zach will be on his absolute best behavior this year so he can get out.

If Zach puts up 23points/12 bouards and the Knicks get better if I will personally slap Walsh if they trade him.
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D'Antoni quote - when asked what trait do you least like -- "I hate selfish basketball players".
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