1 Jared Baylees PG Arizona
2 Eric Gordon G Indiana
3 Deandre Jordan C Texas AM
4 Kosta Koufos C Ohio State
5 Michael Beasley F Kansas State
6 DJ Augustin PG Texas
7 Derrick Rose G Memphis
8 Blake Griffin F Oklahoma
9 Darrell Arthur PF Kansas
10 Donte Green F Syracuse

Koufos needs to show me alot more, beasley is the best player right now IMO. I really love Augustin too.

Give me EG isnt he about the same size as Arenas? They guy is athletic can stroke it and understands the game. He is a high character guy and him or Rose are they two I want

Posted by King1:

Give me EG isnt he about the same size as Arenas? They guy is athletic can stroke it and understands the game. He is a high character guy and him or Rose are they two I want

And with Arenas out the Wiz seem like a better team...

Before the season started, my hope for the direction of this team was that we would start Mardy, Chandler, Q, ZBo, and Curry to have a huge line-up with perimeter D to mask the interior problems. What I had thought was that this lineup would wear teams out with their physicality. A bench of Nate, Craw, Lee, Balkman would be so lightning quick that the change of pace would destroy teams.

Knowing what we know now about Q and his deficiencies coming off of surgery, maybe that wouldn't have worked either.

Point is, I'd still like to keep going with size. Remember when the biggest complaint on this site was that we had thirteen 6'8" power forwards? That problem hasn't really gone away.

Watching Greene at 6'10" bringing the ball up, stroking treys, and playing all over the floor I saw something that the Knicks definitely do not have.

I'd love to trot out a line-up next year where we had a bigger players by a wide margin at the perimeter positions than any opponent. This would make for better defense and better post entry passes. Less turnovers, better defense, better outside shooting.

Mardy, Balkman, Greene, Randolph, Curry is a line-up that would cause the opposing coach to lose some sleep in terms of dealing with matchup problems.

You sub in Craw, Lee, Chandler for Balkman, Randolph, Mardy, in one wave of subs, and Nate and Randolph could come back in for Curry and Green for a third group. Splitting Randolph and Curry when you don't have a big-time defensive perimeter team on the floor, balancing the scoring, it seems to make sense.

Adding a 6'10" wing like Greene seems like it changes the equation and makes use of the other strong players on the team more than any other player we could draft in my opinion. If you don't do that, we'd have to trade for a player like him anyway because the problem with that position is not going away any time soon.

if the pick this year is between a pg and a wing, we need to factor in who & what might be available next year in the draft.

and its garbage that dolan doesn't move now to get a new gm that might be able to deal our parts at the deadline to possibly pick up another late round pick.

great thread- should be stickied since we are going to be talking a lot about these and other guys...

Posted by BRIGGS:

1 Jared Baylees PG Arizona
2 Eric Gordon G Indiana
3 Deandre Jordan C Texas AM
4 Kosta Koufos C Ohio State
5 Michael Beasley F Kansas State
6 DJ Augustin PG Texas
7 Derrick Rose G Memphis
8 Blake Griffin F Oklahoma
9 Darrell Arthur PF Kansas
10 Donte Green F Syracuse

How are you coming up with these rankings? It seems like you're going by best college season so far... in which case, I don't see how you have Michael Beasley as number one. I like Koufos, but number 4? Koufos there makes sense if you aren't projecting towards the future at all, which I think you need to for the draft. In this case, Brook Lopez should be at the top of your list as well. Maybe you don't like Rose and maybe there is an argument to have be the second best point available, but to claim Augustin better overall seems shortsighted. Rose is a 6'4" fast-as-hell point... he's not doing great this year but oure distributors with that combo are rare.

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by SupremeCommander:

How are you coming up with these rankings? It seems like you're going by best college season so far... in which case, I don't see how you have Michael Beasley as number one. I like Koufos, but number 4? Koufos there makes sense if you aren't projecting towards the future at all, which I think you need to for the draft. In this case, Brook Lopez should be at the top of your list as well. Maybe you don't like Rose and maybe there is an argument to have be the second best point available, but to claim Augustin better overall seems shortsighted. Rose is a 6'4" fast-as-hell point... he's not doing great this year but oure distributors with that combo are rare.

Supreme, I haven't had a chance to watch Koufos yet.. what do you think of him?

The guy can ball, that's for sure... he's got a ton of polish, just not a lot of athleticism. If the Knicks were going to do a full rebuild and could get a second half lotto pick, I'd be all about drafting him... he knows how to play and I like that. He's not the type of guy I would feel comfortable building around though because of the lack of athleticism, but has second banana potential.

Posted by joec32033:

What are the chances we can get some type of combo?

Something like Beasley and Collison or Rose and Hansborough?

Hansborough isn't a scout favorite... so if the Knicks can get the 18th - 24th pick, they have a good chance of getting him. He currently is not listed, but that's probably because he hasn't declared his intent, but he may stay in school. He's almost done, so why not?

Darren Collison ranges from a late lotto choice to the end of the first, like 10th - 18th. I actually think this guy could be steal, and kudos for pointing him out. Derrick Rose COULD BE a great NBA point, but we're talking about potential here. Jerryd Bayless' ceiling, to me, is Gilbert Arenas but I don't know how realistic an assumption that is. I've heard him compared to Jay Williams more than Areanas, and in his brief career at Chicago, he looked like a bust. He's also a safe pick than Augustin, who is real small and unathletic.

The Knicks would need a top three pick to get either Beasley or Rose (hence why I root for ping pong balls).

You would think the Knicks would stabilize at some point and we're looking at another 5th - 8th selection. If that the case, I'd advocate drafting Blake Griffin (not the same player, but think Al Horford) and trade David Lee to Phoenix for the Atlanta pick for Darren Collison, who plays for UCLA where Jordan Farmar came from. That would be some tough defense between the two.

Unless there is another way to get a decent first round pick, then I don't see it happening. Knicks management is not going to trade David Lee and we all know that. Maybe Nate Robinson has some value in the league right now.

[Edited by - supremecommander on 01-08-2008 1:01 PM]

Posted by EnySpree:

I wish we really knew what we had in Chandler.

As far as making sense Johnwallace44? Only person that needs to make sense is Isiah.....isiah gets the gas face.

Koufos is supposed to be like Durant. The only game I saw him play was his worst game of the season. Even the announcers played it off as him just having his first bad day. Just my luck.

I like Derrick Rose too but when we went to the Jimmy V classic he played probably his worse game of the year...maybe Im just bad luck.

Koufos is good, I caught one of his games. I just think if you get a player designed to displace one of the "KEY" players here, you'd better have a plan on what to do with that player. I didn't think Koufos looked like a wing player. He's no Durant, but he can shoot. Maybe Radmonovic.

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by SupremeCommander:

How are you coming up with these rankings? It seems like you're going by best college season so far... in which case, I don't see how you have Michael Beasley as number one. I like Koufos, but number 4? Koufos there makes sense if you aren't projecting towards the future at all, which I think you need to for the draft. In this case, Brook Lopez should be at the top of your list as well. Maybe you don't like Rose and maybe there is an argument to have be the second best point available, but to claim Augustin better overall seems shortsighted. Rose is a 6'4" fast-as-hell point... he's not doing great this year but oure distributors with that combo are rare.

Supreme, I haven't had a chance to watch Koufos yet.. what do you think of him?

He plays very hard and is far and away the most skilled 7 footer in the draft. He plays better inisde and this should be emphasized by a good NBA club--he can shoot that Patrick Ewing 12 footer which is fine because he has nice touch. I would compare him to a young Pau Gasol but he's bigger--much more 5 and if he stays inside--like a Chris Kaman does--his skill/size[he's big 7-1 265] but also agile--pretty athletic for his size/nothing spectacular--he just knows how to really play basketball


On another note--why did I put Beasely lower than maybe others believe--from the 3 times I have watche d him--he plays imho lackadsical without heart and determination--I hate to use the word stat whore and prima dona but they come to mind. I think the next guy we bring in has to be a leader like a brandon Roy with serious skills to match--there are more intangibles to grade a player than just numbers. I put Bayless at number 1 for us because he seems to have the combination of size/impact/intangibles/skills/leadership from probably the 2nd most important position in basketball[and sometimes its first in many cases] I dont think Beasley is Lebron James or Kobe Bryant--so his position--the three spot--while it's been a disaster position for the Knicks for a long time--still doesn't rank as high as PG. Heart/leadership WITH the two way skills is very high on my list.

Posted by BRIGGS:

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by SupremeCommander:

How are you coming up with these rankings? It seems like you're going by best college season so far... in which case, I don't see how you have Michael Beasley as number one. I like Koufos, but number 4? Koufos there makes sense if you aren't projecting towards the future at all, which I think you need to for the draft. In this case, Brook Lopez should be at the top of your list as well. Maybe you don't like Rose and maybe there is an argument to have be the second best point available, but to claim Augustin better overall seems shortsighted. Rose is a 6'4" fast-as-hell point... he's not doing great this year but oure distributors with that combo are rare.

Supreme, I haven't had a chance to watch Koufos yet.. what do you think of him?

He plays very hard and is far and away the most skilled 7 footer in the draft. He plays better inisde and this should be emphasized by a good NBA club--he can shoot that Patrick Ewing 12 footer which is fine because he has nice touch. I would compare him to a young Pau Gasol but he's bigger--much more 5 and if he stays inside--like a Chris Kaman does--his skill/size[he's big 7-1 265] but also agile--pretty athletic for his size/nothing spectacular--he just knows how to really play basketball


On another note--why did I put Beasely lower than maybe others believe--from the 3 times I have watche d him--he plays imho lackadsical without heart and determination--I hate to use the word stat whore and prima dona but they come to mind. I think the next guy we bring in has to be a leader like a brandon Roy with serious skills to match--there are more intangibles to grade a player than just numbers. I put Bayless at number 1 for us because he seems to have the combination of size/impact/intangibles/skills/leadership from probably the 2nd most important position in basketball[and sometimes its first in many cases] I dont think Beasley is Lebron James or Kobe Bryant--so his position--the three spot--while it's been a disaster position for the Knicks for a long time--still doesn't rank as high as PG. Heart/leadership WITH the two way skills is very high on my list.

We actually agree on Beasley. I'm going to do my list and tell me what you think.

1. Derrick Rose
2. Eric Gordon
3. DeAndre Jordan
4. OJ Mayo
5. Blake Griffin (unlisted)
6. Michael Beasley
7. Kosta Koufuos (unlisted)
8. Donte Greene
9. Nicholas Batum (I am going on reviews, haven't seen him play)
10a. Jerryd Bayless
10b. Darren Collison

Honorable mention: Chase Budinger

Notes: because of Derrick Rose's unique blend of size, speed, and being a natural pass-first point guard, he has Deron Williams type of potential, which Jason Kidd also had. For this reason alone, he is worth drafting. If the Knicks pass up the next Jason Kidd I will sob until I get a Xanax prescription. If they wind up with the next Deron Williams I will be ecstatic. If he becomes 60-75 percent of that I will be content. Eric Gordon is proving to be a stud. I compared him to Ben Gordon before... no, he's better. Gordon is shooting .490 from the field and .434 from three. Ben Gordon shot .416 from three and I can't find any information on his shooting percentage. DeAndre Jordan is a huge project. He has all the tools to be a great player. Will he put it together? I think he will, but he won't if the Knicks draft him. We don't develop players; we ruin them. OJ Mayo is a future stud. I also think he is the rare player that CRAVES New York. Just like Michael and Kobe, he has that big stage ability. Is he as good as those to guys? Hell no. But I'll take 60-75% of either ANY day. Blake Griffin is similar to Al Horford in a lot of ways. Beasley gets stats for Kansas State. He puts up those numbers and plays at Duke or UNC, its much more impressive. On the other hand, if he has a big tournament season, he jumps to number one, no questions asked. Koufos and Greene are mentioned previously in this thread. Nicolas Batum has gotten good reviews from people who are typically critical of European prospects and actually watch Euro basketball. From what I understand he is a tall, long SF with some high-flying ability. Jerryd Bayless is the next great shoot-first point guard, so he'll be good. I'm not sure you can build a winner around that though, whereas Darren Collison is a complete point. He may not be as gifted as Bayless, but I could see him being a major contributor on a winner.


[Edited by - supremecommander on 01-08-2008 5:02 PM]

[Edited by - supremecommander on 01-08-2008 5:06 PM]