Posted by TMS:

Joba was the most dominant reliever in baseball since he got called up... minor league ratings don't amount to much but best guess projections... when u see a kid like Joba light up the league the way he did, there's going to be a ton of teams out there interested in him... when u see a hyped up kid like Carlos Gomez come up & post poor #'s, it doesn't do much for his trade value.

i never said Gomez was a bust, only that you rate his supposed value way too highly... when GM's trade their best players, they usually are looking for kids that either have dominated at the minor league level, or who have proven on the major league level that they're more than just hype, 2 things that Gomez has failed to do up to this point & that Joba has already shown.

this is why i say the Mets have no chance of getting a guy like Johan or Kazmir unless you're willing to give up a Reyes or Wright, which your team would obviously be averse to do... if u really think u can get a Santana or Kazmir for a couple of B level prospects or completely unproven supposed "blue chippers", that's your prerogative... it's not reality tho... when those 2 guys get traded, their respective teams are going to be looking for names like Ellsbury, Bucholtz, Lester, Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Cano, Reyes, Wang, etc. in return... guys like Carlos Gomez, Phil Humber, Mike Pelfrey, Aaron Heilmann, Lastings Milledge, etc. aren't gonna get it done, believe that.

Like i said before, I know you think all the Mets prospects are crap, but GMs and people involved in baseball don't agree. I think they may know a bit more than you, so thanks for playing.

i didn't say your guys were crap... i said they were overrated... i guess ur incapable of distinguishing the difference there... & we'll see how much value your prospects can get back in a trade... ask just about any GM in baseball & i'm willing to bet you any amount of cash that they rank the Yankees top 3 pitching prospects higher than anyone you have in your system.

convince ur friend here of that... i'm just telling it like it is... why u guys gotta get so defensive when i say your prospects are overrated when they are?

of course injuries can happen... that's true for anyone, including Santana... what's that go to do w/this discussion?

how the hell am i spoiled being a Yankees fan when it comes to having top notch prospects coming up from the farm system when we get one of the last picks in every round of the draft because of the team's consistently good record year after year? a crop of young talent like this comes along once every 10 years or so w/this team... it happened w/the class of Jeter, Jorge, Mo & Pettitte, & from the looks of it, it's happening again w/the class of Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Cano, Wang & Melky... this doesn't happen by accident or chance like you seem to think it does.

the Yankees made very smart decisions over the past several years in the draft & held onto all the prospects worth a damn (Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Melky, Cano, Wang), & got rid of those that weren't (Brad Halsey, Ruben Rivera, D'Angelo Jimenez, Adrian Hernandez, etc.)... for u to dismiss this as just a "it had to happen someday" excuse is ridiculous, because you're right, it's NOT normal reality.

many teams, including the Yankees & Mets, oftentimes sacrifice future potential for the here & now... luckily for Yankee fans, Cashman didn't budge when just about every team that engaged us in trade talks over the past few years were asking for the Yankees' top prospects... now they're in a position to go out & get a guy like Santana if they want to because they have the young talent to get the deal done... like i told u before, the Mets can do it too if they're willing to give up Reyes... u have to give up top notch quality to get top notch quality... prospects who come w/major question marks like Pelfrey, Milledge, Gomez, etc. no longer qualify as top notch quality that could get you a guy like Santana... that's the whole point of this discussion.

Omar is always looking for these low-risk high-reward deals. He wouldn't be ready until late in the season. If its cheap, why not. But I still think we should be looking for another SP that will be ready at the beginning of the year.

Posted by TMS:

how the hell am i spoiled being a Yankees fan when it comes to having top notch prospects coming up from the farm system when we get one of the last picks in every round of the draft because of the team's consistently good record year after year? a crop of young talent like this comes along once every 10 years or so w/this team... it happened w/the class of Jeter, Jorge, Mo & Pettitte, & from the looks of it, it's happening again w/the class of Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Cano, Wang & Melky... this doesn't happen by accident or chance like you seem to think it does.

the Yankees made very smart decisions over the past several years in the draft & held onto all the prospects worth a damn (Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Melky, Cano, Wang), & got rid of those that weren't (Brad Halsey, Ruben Rivera, D'Angelo Jimenez, Adrian Hernandez, etc.)... for u to dismiss this as just a "it had to happen someday" excuse is ridiculous, because you're right, it's NOT normal reality.

many teams, including the Yankees & Mets, oftentimes sacrifice future potential for the here & now... luckily for Yankee fans, Cashman didn't budge when just about every team that engaged us in trade talks over the past few years were asking for the Yankees' top prospects... now they're in a position to go out & get a guy like Santana if they want to because they have the young talent to get the deal done... like i told u before, the Mets can do it too if they're willing to give up Reyes... u have to give up top notch quality to get top notch quality... prospects who come w/major question marks like Pelfrey, Milledge, Gomez, etc. no longer qualify as top notch quality that could get you a guy like Santana... that's the whole point of this discussion.

Not only are you spoiled, but you're high now too. money money money. The Yankees promise these players boat loads of money to sign and they end up miraculously falling to them in the draft. Duh. They've been doing that on the international market for the longest time too. The Yankee way...money money money money money money....money

Well to be fair, it's also been the Red Sox way now too. money...

sorry, i didn't even realize Garland had already been traded to the halos... my bad.

Blanton's a very solid alternative, but i think u'll have to give up more to get him... u might be better off just targetting a FA like Lieber & saving ur young kids to make a move at the trade deadline & give them a chance to build up their trade value during the 1st half of the 08 season

[Edited by - TMS on 11-25-2007 4:59 PM]

Posted by TMS:

Posted by majorleads:

Posted by TMS:

how the hell am i spoiled being a Yankees fan when it comes to having top notch prospects coming up from the farm system when we get one of the last picks in every round of the draft because of the team's consistently good record year after year? a crop of young talent like this comes along once every 10 years or so w/this team... it happened w/the class of Jeter, Jorge, Mo & Pettitte, & from the looks of it, it's happening again w/the class of Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Cano, Wang & Melky... this doesn't happen by accident or chance like you seem to think it does.

the Yankees made very smart decisions over the past several years in the draft & held onto all the prospects worth a damn (Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Melky, Cano, Wang), & got rid of those that weren't (Brad Halsey, Ruben Rivera, D'Angelo Jimenez, Adrian Hernandez, etc.)... for u to dismiss this as just a "it had to happen someday" excuse is ridiculous, because you're right, it's NOT normal reality.

many teams, including the Yankees & Mets, oftentimes sacrifice future potential for the here & now... luckily for Yankee fans, Cashman didn't budge when just about every team that engaged us in trade talks over the past few years were asking for the Yankees' top prospects... now they're in a position to go out & get a guy like Santana if they want to because they have the young talent to get the deal done... like i told u before, the Mets can do it too if they're willing to give up Reyes... u have to give up top notch quality to get top notch quality... prospects who come w/major question marks like Pelfrey, Milledge, Gomez, etc. no longer qualify as top notch quality that could get you a guy like Santana... that's the whole point of this discussion.

Not only are you spoiled, but you're high now too. money money money. The Yankees promise these players boat loads of money to sign and they end up miraculously falling to them in the draft. Duh. They've been doing that on the international market for the longest time too. The Yankee way...money money money money money money....money

Well to be fair, it's also been the Red Sox way now too. money...

the classic copout excuse... u can't even give credit to the Yankees for knowing what talent to hold onto & what talent they could afford to lose... i guess any fan of a team that's dumb enough to trade away their top stud in the making in Kazmir for a pathetic joke like Victor Zambrano can't be expected to see the light here.

I say do the math and it's obvious who's been making better decisions since the Yankees and Mets have been on planet earth together. Oh' and no dis to the Mets.

Posted by TMS:

Posted by majorleads:

Posted by TMS:

how the hell am i spoiled being a Yankees fan when it comes to having top notch prospects coming up from the farm system when we get one of the last picks in every round of the draft because of the team's consistently good record year after year? a crop of young talent like this comes along once every 10 years or so w/this team... it happened w/the class of Jeter, Jorge, Mo & Pettitte, & from the looks of it, it's happening again w/the class of Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Cano, Wang & Melky... this doesn't happen by accident or chance like you seem to think it does.

the Yankees made very smart decisions over the past several years in the draft & held onto all the prospects worth a damn (Joba, Hughes, Kennedy, Melky, Cano, Wang), & got rid of those that weren't (Brad Halsey, Ruben Rivera, D'Angelo Jimenez, Adrian Hernandez, etc.)... for u to dismiss this as just a "it had to happen someday" excuse is ridiculous, because you're right, it's NOT normal reality.

many teams, including the Yankees & Mets, oftentimes sacrifice future potential for the here & now... luckily for Yankee fans, Cashman didn't budge when just about every team that engaged us in trade talks over the past few years were asking for the Yankees' top prospects... now they're in a position to go out & get a guy like Santana if they want to because they have the young talent to get the deal done... like i told u before, the Mets can do it too if they're willing to give up Reyes... u have to give up top notch quality to get top notch quality... prospects who come w/major question marks like Pelfrey, Milledge, Gomez, etc. no longer qualify as top notch quality that could get you a guy like Santana... that's the whole point of this discussion.

Not only are you spoiled, but you're high now too. money money money. The Yankees promise these players boat loads of money to sign and they end up miraculously falling to them in the draft. Duh. They've been doing that on the international market for the longest time too. The Yankee way...money money money money money money....money

Well to be fair, it's also been the Red Sox way now too. money...

the classic copout excuse... u can't even give credit to the Yankees for knowing what talent to hold onto & what talent they could afford to lose... i guess any fan of a team that's dumb enough to trade away their top stud in the making in Kazmir for a pathetic joke like Victor Zambrano can't be expected to see the light here.

Just take your 300 million dollar payroll and all of your bought prospects back on over to the Yankee forum. If you want to continue here babbling about the boring Yankees, then fine by me, but don't whine and complain when we bring up the fact you guys are all about outspending everyone.

calm down you two. maybe you can make another sticky thread called "mets vs. yankees" and let it out. anyway, tms maybe right that we might deal for d train. for some reason, i don't think we will give up too much for him since his trade value is at an all time low. he had one bad year but when he is on, he is an ace. it helps that the marlins are our consistent trade partners so it is doable.

well, tms, i would peg willis as a last option. who knows? it might be time for a marlin fire sale. however, garland could be more attainable. the problem is that i don't know what kind of status is the oakland team is currently in. are they trying to make the playoffs or are they just going to blow up the team and go young?