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KG Deal Sets the Market for a Superstar Trade
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Queeniepop
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7/31/2007  9:51 AM
Aside from the fact that it makes for good conversation that McHale and Ainge engaged in a little collusion with the KG trade, it seems that we can now see what it takes to make a blockbuster superstar trade. So the market has been set...if Kobe gets traded, LA is going to ask for the WORLD because he is younger and more accomplished than KG as far as winning goes.

BIG EXPIRING DEAL (>$10M)
FOUR YOUNG PLAYERS (one a future stud (Big Al), lotsa upside (Gerald Green), solid player (Gomes), troubled yet talented but expiring (Telfair)
TWO FUTURE FIRST ROUNDERS



[Edited by - queeniepop on 07-31-2007 09:52 AM]
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Silverfuel
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7/31/2007  10:01 AM
Should we hold our cards for a year to talk to Kobe or go after Artest now?

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 07-31-2007 10:02 AM]
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VDesai
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7/31/2007  10:12 AM
Artest we should be able to get without giving up our cards.
Solace
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7/31/2007  10:15 AM
Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]
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Queeniepop
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7/31/2007  10:17 AM
Artest is not on the level as a KG or Kobe...he is a very controversial player that can make or break a team.

I think two exp deals (Dickau/FJones) and Nate with either Mardy or Morris should get it done...maybe Balkman.

BUT...the Lakers may offer Kwame and Farmar.

We can't get Kobe this year. It would have to be next year using Marbury's exp deal and four young players on rookie deals and 2-3 future picks. Plus we would have to give him an extension as well.
Silverfuel
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7/31/2007  10:20 AM
Good points VDesai and Queenie. So we save Marbury + Lee and other young talent make run at Kobe next year. Will LA take Crawford in that deal? Because that would be a decent package. Expiring Marbury + rebounding machine in Lee and a combo guard in Crawford as the core for a disgruntled Kobe?
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Queeniepop
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7/31/2007  10:26 AM
The idea is to give players without contractual years remaining. Marbs exp., Lee is exp and the other deals are minimal in salary with a year remaining. So no they would want players a la Jamal with no strings attached or years on their contracts.
djsunyc
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7/31/2007  10:30 AM
Posted by Queeniepop:

The idea is to give players without contractual years remaining. Marbs exp., Lee is exp and the other deals are minimal in salary with a year remaining. So no they would want players a la Jamal with no strings attached or years on their contracts.

if we don't get a high lotto pick in the 2008 draft, then we don't have the pieces to get kobe.
UB
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7/31/2007  10:45 AM
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.
Panos
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7/31/2007  10:47 AM
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?
UB
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7/31/2007  10:50 AM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now
islesfan
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7/31/2007  11:37 AM
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

Are you really suggesting that Artest has common sense???
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Panos
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7/31/2007  11:48 AM
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

Again, based on what? Hasn't he already spoken of retiring?
Didn't he take time off (or wanted to) to promote an album?
What makes you think you know what he wants?
TheGame
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7/31/2007  11:50 AM
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

The dude is crazy, i.e. he lacks common sense. He is totally unpredictable and I don't know why we would have any interest in the guy when we have Balkman and a solid young prospect in Chandler to man the SF spot. Yes, Artest is an established star, but he is also an established nutcase. This is not like taking on a Randolph who happened to have made a few bad off the court decisions. Artest has already been suspended for a year and consistently does and says things to wear out his welcome everywhere he goes. I would rather take my chances with Balkman and Chandler, both of whom have potential as defensive stoppers and solid offensive players. We need to focus on getting rid of Jeffries more so than taking on Artest.

As far as Kobe, I think an offer of Marbury, Crawford, Lee, and Balkman and a 1st round pick would be highly competitive for Kobe and Farmer. The Lakers would still have Jarvis C., Lamar Odom, and Bynum. Add, Lee, Balkman, and Crawford and the Lakers would have some talent. Hopefully, IT will get Lee 30 minutes a game this year to keep his value up because he will be the key to the deal.

[Edited by - thegame on 07-31-2007 11:55 AM]
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UB
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7/31/2007  12:45 PM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

Again, based on what? Hasn't he already spoken of retiring?
Didn't he take time off (or wanted to) to promote an album?
What makes you think you know what he wants?

Panos, you have valid points and I honestly don't know what he wants (im not even sure if he does most of the time) But its no secret that he has always wanted to be in NY and I feel that if he is going to behave (and be happy i.e. not cause trouble) anywhere, it will be on the knicks. We need a shut down defender like Artest as its something our team currently severly lacks and I don't see any other feasable options out there at this time (with his potential skill-set). Plus, I actually like the fact that Artest speaks his mind and is a little off tilt; you better believe that he will be getting into guys faces if they are not d'ing up their man! On the other hand, do I want him to jump into the stands and punch out fans? no. But if he does go this route, we let him go and its a chance we took to become a contender again. Yes we would loose Balk, but a hard-working, hustlilng type player like Balkman is much easier to find and replace than a potential all-star who does it all. Don't forget, we still keep Lee and may be able to rid ourselves of JJ2 and some of our glut at foward.. Anyway, all of this has been said before and we could go back and forth and debate on this forever. The bottom line is that Artest would: 1.) strengthen our D and overall talent 2.) Come cheaper than any other options based on talent and skills alone and 3.) make for a very interesting season-either way. What better options do you see? I'm sick of watching 33-win mediocrity, what about u?..lets roll the dice!
Panos
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7/31/2007  12:48 PM
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

Again, based on what? Hasn't he already spoken of retiring?
Didn't he take time off (or wanted to) to promote an album?
What makes you think you know what he wants?

Panos, you have valid points and I honestly don't know what he wants (im not even sure if he does most of the time) But its no secret that he has always wanted to be in NY and I feel that if he is going to behave (and be happy i.e. not cause trouble) anywhere, it will be on the knicks. We need a shut down defender like Artest as its something our team currently severly lacks and I don't see any other feasable options out there at this time (with his potential skill-set). Plus, I actually like the fact that Artest speaks his mind and is a little off tilt; you better believe that he will be getting into guys faces if they are not d'ing up their man! On the other hand, do I want him to jump into the stands and punch out fans? no. But if he does go this route, we let him go and its a chance we took to become a contender again. Yes we would loose Balk, but a hard-working, hustlilng type player like Balkman is much easier to find and replace than a potential all-star who does it all. Don't forget, we still keep Lee and may be able to rid ourselves of JJ2 and some of our glut at foward.. Anyway, all of this has been said before and we could go back and forth and debate on this forever. The bottom line is that Artest would: 1.) strengthen our D and overall talent 2.) Come cheaper than any other options based on talent and skills alone and 3.) make for a very interesting season-either way. What better options do you see? I'm sick of watching 33-win mediocrity, what about u?..lets roll the dice!

I am too. I just not sure I want yet another headcase in here.
Also, I might be wrong, but I'm not sure Balk + expirings gets the deal done.
UB
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7/31/2007  1:22 PM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by UB:
Posted by Solace:

Honestly, on Artest, I'll believe he comes for peanuts when I see it. Everyone says he's going to come at a bargain price, yet, if there were true, I think he'd have been traded by now. What it looks like more is that the Kings might keep Artest for a year, hope he behaves well and drives his value up, then reevaluate.

But if Artest were to be traded now, minimum price from the Knicks would be Balkman, Fred Jones, Dan Dickau and a first rounder, IMHO.

[Edited by - Solace on Jul 31 2007 10:17 AM]

Agreed, which is why we need to get him now because I have a feeling he's going to behave himself and have a monster year. I really like Balk and would like to see him develop on our team, but we also have to face reality. By reality, I mean that we already have a very similar player in D Lee and we are not going to get a player like Artest for nothing, baggage or not.

You have a feeling? Based on what? Are you his psychologist?

No but I do believe he has enough common sense to realize that if he wants to stay in the league and garner some decent money he better start maturing. If he's ever going to grow up it will be now

Again, based on what? Hasn't he already spoken of retiring?
Didn't he take time off (or wanted to) to promote an album?
What makes you think you know what he wants?

Panos, you have valid points and I honestly don't know what he wants (im not even sure if he does most of the time) But its no secret that he has always wanted to be in NY and I feel that if he is going to behave (and be happy i.e. not cause trouble) anywhere, it will be on the knicks. We need a shut down defender like Artest as its something our team currently severly lacks and I don't see any other feasable options out there at this time (with his potential skill-set). Plus, I actually like the fact that Artest speaks his mind and is a little off tilt; you better believe that he will be getting into guys faces if they are not d'ing up their man! On the other hand, do I want him to jump into the stands and punch out fans? no. But if he does go this route, we let him go and its a chance we took to become a contender again. Yes we would loose Balk, but a hard-working, hustlilng type player like Balkman is much easier to find and replace than a potential all-star who does it all. Don't forget, we still keep Lee and may be able to rid ourselves of JJ2 and some of our glut at foward.. Anyway, all of this has been said before and we could go back and forth and debate on this forever. The bottom line is that Artest would: 1.) strengthen our D and overall talent 2.) Come cheaper than any other options based on talent and skills alone and 3.) make for a very interesting season-either way. What better options do you see? I'm sick of watching 33-win mediocrity, what about u?..lets roll the dice!

I am too. I just not sure I want yet another headcase in here.
Also, I might be wrong, but I'm not sure Balk + expirings gets the deal done.

Unfortunately, you're probably right about that
JohnWallace44
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7/31/2007  10:52 PM
We could spin Randolph back around with Nate and get back Odom. He's a more natural balance for the team although I still think Curry and Randolph can work.
Alan Hahn: Nate Robinson has been on a ridonkulous scoring tear lately (remember when he couldn't hit Jerome James with a Big Mac in early January?)
bobs3304
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8/1/2007  12:33 AM
Here's the tools we have to get Kobe next summer:


1. Exp. Contracts - Stephon & Malik

2. David Lee

3. We could swap a good player (like Jamal) for a bad player with a similiar contract (like Radman)

4. 2008 Lottery Pick (no way we make the playoffs) + Fut. 1st

5. Cheap role players (Balkman, Morris, Nate, etc.)



Of course this is coming from the mind of a sane person; who knows what Isiah's thinking.


Probly thinking - LET'S SIGN TROY HUDSON TO THE FULL MLE!

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 08-01-2007 12:34 AM]

[Edited by - bobs3304 on 08-01-2007 12:36 AM]
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
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KG Deal Sets the Market for a Superstar Trade
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