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The Question Isn't "IS ARTEST AVAILABLE?", But Rather "IS HE WORTH IT?"
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bobs3304
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6/6/2007  1:15 AM
http://realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=656503&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=168


Scroll down to what poster "Smills" writes.


I've been lightly keepin tabs on Sac fans, and the overwhelming feeling is that -

A.) Artest is gone

and B.) probably to the Knicks.



There was also a rumor from a DX podcast that I posted recently, which made its way to RGM.



So the question really isn't....."Can Artest be had?", but rather....is he worth trading for?


I think it's worth a debate...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
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TMS
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6/6/2007  1:28 AM
for Frye & Jefferies/Turd or Malik & a future 2nd rounder, absolutely.
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bobs3304
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6/6/2007  1:37 AM
Posted by TMS:

for Frye & Jefferies/Turd or Malik & a future 2nd rounder, absolutely.


general consensus over there, though, seems to be Francis + Frye + 23 for Artest + Kenny Thomas is the deal that would most likely be struck...
DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
Pharzeone
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6/6/2007  1:43 AM
Posted by bobs3304:

http://realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=656503&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=168


Scroll down to what poster "Smills" writes.


I've been lightly keepin tabs on Sac fans, and the overwhelming feeling is that -

A.) Artest is gone

and B.) probably to the Knicks.



There was also a rumor from a DX podcast that I posted recently, which made its way to RGM.



So the question really isn't....."Can Artest be had?", but rather....is he worth trading for?


I think it's worth a debate...

Yeah from all Sac blogs, they believe that Artest/Kenny Thomas will be offered to the Knicks in exchange for Francis/Lee/Balkman or Frye and the 23rd pick. I don't see it happening (1) Thomas made it quite clear during his time in Indiana that Artest was a headcase with a very short fuse (this was before any brawl or real Artest incident). Wanted Walsh to trade him. (2) When Brown asked Thomas to pursue a trade for Artest two seasons ago. Thomas was against a trade for Artest but he made the call and was informed that it would cost them Frye or Lee. Thomas said no (one of the many reasons which caused Brown to go nuts with Isiah). (3) Thomas is looking to get rid of one headcase in Nate Robinson and is not looking to add another.

On a side note, interesting that Brown felt that he could control Artest and was willing to acquire him but felt Nate and Ariza were headcases and wanted them gone. Now I understand Artest is a superior talent to those two and he felt that Artest was worth the gamble ala Rasheed but he is still one of the biggest headcases in the NBA or maybe all sports. Ron is really out there. I used to take classes with him at SJU and that guy would say some of the weirdest **** in class.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
bobs3304
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6/6/2007  1:58 AM
Posted by Pharzeone:

(3) Thomas is looking to get rid of one headcase in Nate Robinson and is not looking to add another.

On a side note, interesting that Brown felt that he could control Artest and was willing to acquire him but felt Nate and Ariza were headcases and wanted them gone. Now I understand Artest is a superior talent to those two and he felt that Artest was worth the gamble ala Rasheed but he is still one of the biggest headcases in the NBA or maybe all sports. Ron is really out there. I used to take classes with him at SJU and that guy would say some of the weirdest **** in class.


Haven't heard any rumors of Zaya trying to deal Nate.


Btw, care to expand on youre "experiences" with Mr. Artest?

DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
Ira
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6/6/2007  4:29 AM
One important point. Kenny Thomas's contract doesn't end until 2010.
Ira
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6/6/2007  4:31 AM
How about this trade - Artest + Kevin Martin for Jamal Crawford + David Lee? Each team would be trading a top young player. Sacramento would be getting rid of Artest. We'd be getting a good scoring guard and upgrading our d.
VDesai
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6/6/2007  8:56 AM
Crawford straight up for Artest.
franco12
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6/6/2007  9:14 AM
here is the thing- I haven't really seen any talk in the local papers of Isiah's perceived interest in Artest. I don't think Isiah would want him- even if it was gifted to us- artest for jeffries straight up type deal.

And I've got to defer to isiah on this deal- he's dealt with him in Indiana first hand- and he knows whether he is controllable or not.
martin
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6/6/2007  9:17 AM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by bobs3304:

http://realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?t=656503&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=168


Scroll down to what poster "Smills" writes.


I've been lightly keepin tabs on Sac fans, and the overwhelming feeling is that -

A.) Artest is gone

and B.) probably to the Knicks.



There was also a rumor from a DX podcast that I posted recently, which made its way to RGM.



So the question really isn't....."Can Artest be had?", but rather....is he worth trading for?


I think it's worth a debate...

Yeah from all Sac blogs, they believe that Artest/Kenny Thomas will be offered to the Knicks in exchange for Francis/Lee/Balkman or Frye and the 23rd pick. I don't see it happening (1) Thomas made it quite clear during his time in Indiana that Artest was a headcase with a very short fuse (this was before any brawl or real Artest incident). Wanted Walsh to trade him. (2) When Brown asked Thomas to pursue a trade for Artest two seasons ago. Thomas was against a trade for Artest but he made the call and was informed that it would cost them Frye or Lee. Thomas said no (one of the many reasons which caused Brown to go nuts with Isiah). (3) Thomas is looking to get rid of one headcase in Nate Robinson and is not looking to add another.

On a side note, interesting that Brown felt that he could control Artest and was willing to acquire him but felt Nate and Ariza were headcases and wanted them gone. Now I understand Artest is a superior talent to those two and he felt that Artest was worth the gamble ala Rasheed but he is still one of the biggest headcases in the NBA or maybe all sports. Ron is really out there. I used to take classes with him at SJU and that guy would say some of the weirdest **** in class.

I think there is a difference between the Weed Wallace/Artest headcase and the Nate/Ariza headcase scenario. The former know how to play and if you can control their outbursts, they will get you into the playoffs and beyond. Nate and Ariza still need to learn how to get better, how and when to practice, what it takes to win in the NBA etc.
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arkrud
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6/6/2007  9:22 AM
Posted by franco12:

here is the thing- I haven't really seen any talk in the local papers of Isiah's perceived interest in Artest. I don't think Isiah would want him- even if it was gifted to us- artest for jeffries straight up type deal.

And I've got to defer to isiah on this deal- he's dealt with him in Indiana first hand- and he knows whether he is controllable or not.

To be precise - controllable or not by IT...
We know that IT cannot control players and Artest under him will be a disaster.
But under other GM and coach with strict discipline who knows

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Nalod
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6/6/2007  9:29 AM
I think Isiah must do his other star(PHUCH)search first then see what he can do after and if Artest then fills a void done by other trades. His contract is friendly but he can only be had on the cheap because nobody else wants him.

Problem here is at the moment we don't have a leadership vacume to keep him "Balanced" in times of need.

We could just go with Ron, Nate, Starbury and Rasheed and let them just scowl and go nuts on everyone.

Think about it, its an entertainment business so why not just go with a totally nutty team that garners all kinds of attnetion beit good or bad.

Its ratings!

Bring in Telfair too and lots of cafeine, guns, legal mood altering drugs, mess up their prescriptions and see what happens. We can kind of make it like a lab experiment and give them the nickname "labmice!"

They can make the playoffs, get suspended, get into fights, have shoot outs, sell sneakers, rap music, take early retirement, get arrested and do ASPCA events. Bring back QWoods and do a whole dog thing with Artest.

Telfair and Starbury can go off on their sneaker deals and how much money they giving their mom's. JJ and Eddy can do Nutrisystem comercials and beat on Jared from Subway when they get wigged out on calorie deprevation.

They can build a man sized habitrail at halftime and see if Nate can make it thru and get the cheese!
franco12
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6/6/2007  9:35 AM
Don't forget about Darius Miles!
franco12
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6/6/2007  9:38 AM
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by franco12:

here is the thing- I haven't really seen any talk in the local papers of Isiah's perceived interest in Artest. I don't think Isiah would want him- even if it was gifted to us- artest for jeffries straight up type deal.

And I've got to defer to isiah on this deal- he's dealt with him in Indiana first hand- and he knows whether he is controllable or not.

To be precise - controllable or not by IT...
We know that IT cannot control players and Artest under him will be a disaster.
But under other GM and coach with strict discipline who knows


I think you are completely wrong about IT- I think his one strength is his ability to relate to players.

Now- maybe you are thinking about control in the sense of 'controlling' crawford and his crazy shot selection- I think Isiah believes Crawford needs to be 'free' and not thinking- I don't think he wants him taking bad shots.

Isiah clearly got through to Marbury- the first coach probably ever- besides Flip and he's been exposed over in detroit.

Isiah has also gotten Curry to perform better- granted, loads more to do, but Isiah has done a better job of controlling Curry than a control freak like Skiles ever did.

No head bands!
MS
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6/6/2007  9:44 AM
Eddy had the same year in Chi-town under skiles and was actually in shape during that season. He used him in spurts which is what isiah should be doing. If Curry is overweight again this season did he really get through to him?

Crawford doesn't need to be free he is a much better player when he is working on his midrange game in control.....

And Isiah has really reached Marbury, please he is the same guy with some discount shoes that thinks the marbury cause is more important than the team
Elite
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6/6/2007  9:47 AM
Frye + Jeffries is deff worth it
MS
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6/6/2007  10:03 AM
makes us a contender right away if we do that move, we can play artest at the two position and then jamal can play his natural off guard combo spot or look to move him......Try to get Atlanta to bite on a nate, jamal, package
TMS
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6/6/2007  10:05 AM
Kenny Thomas is a good player, but unless we're getting rid of Jamal Crawford's contract, i don't make that deal... we need to ONLY trade for guys who's contracts expire when Marbury's does... i want to be under the cap to make a run at the bigname FA's that season, & no player is worth sacrificing that unless we're talking elite top quality talent.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Nalod
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6/6/2007  10:11 AM
Posted by franco12:
Posted by arkrud:
Posted by franco12:

here is the thing- I haven't really seen any talk in the local papers of Isiah's perceived interest in Artest. I don't think Isiah would want him- even if it was gifted to us- artest for jeffries straight up type deal.

And I've got to defer to isiah on this deal- he's dealt with him in Indiana first hand- and he knows whether he is controllable or not.

To be precise - controllable or not by IT...
We know that IT cannot control players and Artest under him will be a disaster.
But under other GM and coach with strict discipline who knows


I think you are completely wrong about IT- I think his one strength is his ability to relate to players.

Now- maybe you are thinking about control in the sense of 'controlling' crawford and his crazy shot selection- I think Isiah believes Crawford needs to be 'free' and not thinking- I don't think he wants him taking bad shots.

Isiah clearly got through to Marbury- the first coach probably ever- besides Flip and he's been exposed over in detroit.

Isiah has also gotten Curry to perform better- granted, loads more to do, but Isiah has done a better job of controlling Curry than a control freak like Skiles ever did.

No head bands!

Isiah is good at "coddling" his troubled young player and is good at being a mentor.

I think Marbury is more about maturation and humility that his game is in decline and the Scowl is really not tolerated anymore.

Craw is 27 and the year under larry taught him more about rounding his game.

When Wooing Eddy (it was a sign and trade!) Eddy had to have grown up a bit as to the business side of things and what he is responsable for to be a pro. Also maturation. If not he would be dead or have eaten himself into a mid level contract and nothing more.

After 4 years and 4 coaches I don't see how much a 33 game win season is a benchmark of improvment.

I know its better than the weird 23 game win debacle, but at best we can see that Marbury has become a more well rounded "MAN" and is a decent guy and his scowl has been tempered by humility.

Isiah has failed miserabley with JJ1.

Bottom line is Isiah had Ron in Indy and it would be interesting to see if he wants an encore relationship with him.
Pharzeone
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6/6/2007  10:35 AM
Posted by bobs3304:
Posted by Pharzeone:

(3) Thomas is looking to get rid of one headcase in Nate Robinson and is not looking to add another.

On a side note, interesting that Brown felt that he could control Artest and was willing to acquire him but felt Nate and Ariza were headcases and wanted them gone. Now I understand Artest is a superior talent to those two and he felt that Artest was worth the gamble ala Rasheed but he is still one of the biggest headcases in the NBA or maybe all sports. Ron is really out there. I used to take classes with him at SJU and that guy would say some of the weirdest **** in class.


Haven't heard any rumors of Zaya trying to deal Nate.


Btw, care to expand on youre "experiences" with Mr. Artest?

Those S&T deals for Lewis all include Nate. Seattle wants him and Thomas seems very willing to move him.

Ron Ron is a free spirit. If you ever spent time around the guy. You know his elevator doesn't go all the way to the top. The guy would just say off the wall stuff. Sometimes it was hard to tell if he was just being the class clown or being serious. I will say that my Sociology professor predicted that he would have an 'episode' in the future. He spent many of classes with his head down and humming to himself after debating on a subject matter.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
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