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TrueBlue
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1/26/2007  10:52 AM
The Debacle Game from a couple days ago......

Eddy Curry has improved as an offensive talent and appears to have a bright future as a player. His numbers look good, very comparable to some of the top Centers in the NBA. One knock on him is that his defense needs major improvement, his rebounding and ability to block shots. He won't become an All-Star and taken seriously until these numbers change.

___________________________________________________________________________________________________


I quoted almost word 4 word what they said about him the other night.

It got me to thinking are Eddy's offensive stats hollow?

What happens if he never grabs more than 8reb/gm and under 1blk/gm does that mean he'll only get voted in by fans and left off by the coaches?

Whenever a commentator from a major market or from a market with a top player says something like this does it give the player a bad rap undeservedly?

Kinda of like SAR a guy who was 20/19pts 9/10reb pretty much his whole career, hardly ever made the All-Star game, and has always been looked at as a loser guy who puts up good stats.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
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babyKnicks
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1/26/2007  10:54 AM
coaches game plan around him, to me that's an indicator that they will vote him in more than the fans.
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
TrueBlue
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1/26/2007  10:58 AM
Posted by babyKnicks:

coaches game plan around him, to me that's an indicator that they will vote him in more than the fans.

Coaches game planned around Marbury and tried often times to keep him out the paint, he hasn't made that many All-Star appearances. He's another player that has good stats but were they at the expense of his team? Another reason I bring this up is because I feel Okafor will get voted in by the coahces but he's on a bad team recordwise. When coaches vote players in, generally don't they look at the players impact on the team's record.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-26-2007 09:59 AM]
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
babyKnicks
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1/26/2007  10:59 AM
coaches game planning around marbury "often" is different from coaches game planning around Curry ALWAYS.


[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-26-2007 11:02 AM]
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
kam77
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1/26/2007  11:04 AM
PLUS, you can gameplan Curry, send doubles at him, and he's still scoring 20+. The more doubles Eddy sees, the more comfortable he is at getting the ball out so it can swing around again, or for an open shot right away, or to repost and get the ball back.

None of these things happened last season by the way.

Contrast with Marbury, you double Marbs like the Nets did in the playoffs two years ago and we lose. Doubling Curry doens't guarantee you'll beat us.

[Edited by - kam77 on 01-26-2007 11:05 AM]
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
islesfan
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1/26/2007  11:04 AM
Here's how opposing coaches gameplan against Curry:

"Go to the basket every time for uncontested layups."

"Pick and roll, he still has no clue how to defend it."

"Hustle for rebounds because he won't unless it's right to him."
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
bettalaylow
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1/26/2007  11:19 AM
Posted by babyKnicks:

coaches game plan around him, to me that's an indicator that they will vote him in more than the fans.

Almost every game coaches have a player that they may focus on that doesn't mean there voting for the guy to make the All-Star team. Hell Adur Rahim, Zach Randolph, Gilbert Arenas, Josh Howard have all been left off the all-star for putting up numbers way better than Curry's.

babyKnicks
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1/26/2007  11:20 AM
I think the combination of a lack of big men and new york being a media capital will help.

Hey, you can think of millions of reason why he should NOT be in the game.

I believe he is worthy of the all star team this year.
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Masterplan
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1/26/2007  11:22 AM
uh, if coaches gameplan around curry, he still scores 20, and they still beat us anyway, did the gameplan work? isn't that empty stats and all?

the best way to silence critics is to win.
kam77
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1/26/2007  11:34 AM
Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
TrueBlue
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1/26/2007  11:36 AM
Posted by babyKnicks:

coaches game planning around marbury "often" is different from coaches game planning around Curry ALWAYS.


[Edited by - babyknicks on 01-26-2007 11:02 AM]


First of all I was referring to how coaches played Marbury throughout the yrs and let's stop acting like Curry has been a beast his whole career. Coaches have just now started game planning for him at best 20gms ago which would be sample sized if you are doubting Curry's ability to maintain his level of production.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
Masterplan
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1/26/2007  11:46 AM
Posted by kam77:

Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20

don't know, what is it?

what about when he doesn't, though? does the other coach's gameplan have anything to do with it? or is it his own limitations? or are you assuming that 20 ppg will become the norm?


whatever selection of games you want to judge the team on, overall we're a hair above .400. bottom line is as long as curry is the go-to-guy on a bad team he doesn't deserve many accolades- goes for most players on the team to theri own degree. my main point wasn't to knock curry. to reiterate:

the best way to silence critics is to win.
TrueBlue
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1/26/2007  12:07 PM
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by kam77:

Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20

don't know, what is it?

what about when he doesn't, though? does the other coach's gameplan have anything to do with it? or is it his own limitations? or are you assuming that 20 ppg will become the norm?


whatever selection of games you want to judge the team on, overall we're a hair above .400. bottom line is as long as curry is the go-to-guy on a bad team he doesn't deserve many accolades- goes for most players on the team to theri own degree. my main point wasn't to knock curry. to reiterate:

the best way to silence critics is to win.

I think the record is 13-11 when he does. 5-15 when he doesn't, this taking into account he could be scoring 17,18,19 pts in those losses(15). It's decent but nothing to go hog wild over. You bring up a good point though, If he's a All-Star/Superstar talent does the team still win when he doesn't score 20pts. If they do then that means he's playing a huge part in making his teammates better. It also suggests that if he doesn't score 20pts then it's practically a lock opponents will beat this team. He may be the most valuable player but it's debateable. Guess what the team is 13-11 when Lee double doubles.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-26-2007 11:08 AM]
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
Bonn1997
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1/26/2007  12:14 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by kam77:

Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20

don't know, what is it?

what about when he doesn't, though? does the other coach's gameplan have anything to do with it? or is it his own limitations? or are you assuming that 20 ppg will become the norm?


whatever selection of games you want to judge the team on, overall we're a hair above .400. bottom line is as long as curry is the go-to-guy on a bad team he doesn't deserve many accolades- goes for most players on the team to theri own degree. my main point wasn't to knock curry. to reiterate:

the best way to silence critics is to win.

I think the record is 13-11 when he does. 5-15 when he doesn't, this taking into account he could be scoring 17,18,19 pts in those losses(15). It's decent but nothing to go hog wild over. You bring up a good point though, If he's a All-Star/Superstar talent does the team still win when he doesn't score 20pts. If they do then that means he's playing a huge part in making his teammates better. It also suggests that if he doesn't score 20pts then it's practically a lock opponents will beat this team. He may be the most valuable player but it's debateable. Guess what the team is 13-11 when Lee double doubles.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-26-2007 11:08 AM]

You also tend to score more points against bad teams that you're likely to beat anyway. I bet for most players on the team, the record is better when they do than when they don't score 20 points. Nothing shocking.
arkrud
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1/26/2007  12:15 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by kam77:

Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20

don't know, what is it?

what about when he doesn't, though? does the other coach's gameplan have anything to do with it? or is it his own limitations? or are you assuming that 20 ppg will become the norm?


whatever selection of games you want to judge the team on, overall we're a hair above .400. bottom line is as long as curry is the go-to-guy on a bad team he doesn't deserve many accolades- goes for most players on the team to theri own degree. my main point wasn't to knock curry. to reiterate:

the best way to silence critics is to win.

I think the record is 13-11 when he does. 5-15 when he doesn't, this taking into account he could be scoring 17,18,19 pts in those losses(15). It's decent but nothing to go hog wild over. You bring up a good point though, If he's a All-Star/Superstar talent does the team still win when he doesn't score 20pts. If they do then that means he's playing a huge part in making his teammates better. It also suggests that if he doesn't score 20pts then it's practically a lock opponents will beat this team. He may be the most valuable player but it's debateable. Guess what the team is 13-11 when Lee double doubles.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-26-2007 11:08 AM]

Hmm... Loks like team need at least 2 players playing productive to get above 50%.
Is this something new?

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
Masterplan
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1/26/2007  12:18 PM
Posted by TrueBlue:

I think the record is 13-11 when he does. 5-15 when he doesn't, this taking into account he could be scoring 17,18,19 pts in those losses(15). It's decent but nothing to go hog wild over. You bring up a good point though, If he's a All-Star/Superstar talent does the team still win when he doesn't score 20pts. If they do then that means he's playing a huge part in making his teammates better. It also suggests that if he doesn't score 20pts then it's practically a lock opponents will beat this team. He may be the most valuable player but it's debateable. Guess what the team is 13-11 when Lee double doubles.

thanks for the numbers.

i personally don't think all-star appearances mean too much- interesting but overhyped by a lot of people IMO. fan voting... something else entirely . the key is to focus on what will get us wins, and worry about personal stats and honors later. down the road, i would trade eddy curry in the All-Star game for 5-10 extra wins on the season.
TrueBlue
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1/26/2007  12:43 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TrueBlue:
Posted by Masterplan:
Posted by kam77:

Masterplan - Check our record when Eddy Scores 20

don't know, what is it?

what about when he doesn't, though? does the other coach's gameplan have anything to do with it? or is it his own limitations? or are you assuming that 20 ppg will become the norm?


whatever selection of games you want to judge the team on, overall we're a hair above .400. bottom line is as long as curry is the go-to-guy on a bad team he doesn't deserve many accolades- goes for most players on the team to theri own degree. my main point wasn't to knock curry. to reiterate:

the best way to silence critics is to win.

I think the record is 13-11 when he does. 5-15 when he doesn't, this taking into account he could be scoring 17,18,19 pts in those losses(15). It's decent but nothing to go hog wild over. You bring up a good point though, If he's a All-Star/Superstar talent does the team still win when he doesn't score 20pts. If they do then that means he's playing a huge part in making his teammates better. It also suggests that if he doesn't score 20pts then it's practically a lock opponents will beat this team. He may be the most valuable player but it's debateable. Guess what the team is 13-11 when Lee double doubles.

[Edited by - TrueBlue on 01-26-2007 11:08 AM]

You also tend to score more points against bad teams that you're likely to beat anyway. I bet for most players on the team, the record is better when they do than when they don't score 20 points. Nothing shocking.


Excellent point. That's why it's more noteworthy IMO to look at their averages and go from there.
LMFAO @ the Bio [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephon_Marbury[/url]
kam77
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1/26/2007  12:51 PM
Curry is the only consisent guy scoring 20 on the Knicks. He's carrying the team offensively. The knick offense revolves around him. So if the team is 2-0 when David Lee scores 20 thats not telling me much because how often are we going to see David go for 20?

If your main cog, when he's on you generally win... i'd call that a formula for winning in the NBA. Now just get guys that compliment this main cog even more.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
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