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Jefferies worse offensively than Ben Wallace! Loreen Woods is back........
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MS
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1/4/2007  9:16 AM
I have never scene anyone this bad outside of Chris Dudley, he might as well stay at the other end of the floor, i am willing to bet he might be even with most high school kids on offense if not for his frame. Seriously I am not joking, he can't even dunk the ball, his hands are weak and he more often than not loses it around the rim, he looks like just given a ball last week with the way he shoots it, i didn't think it was possible to match last years mid-level, but Isiah has done it. And I am still waiting for ron artest 2 to shut someone down.

Combine him with French Frye out there, who might not even be as tough as Loren Woods and we have a problem, I have never scene anyone want the ball less than this kid. He just runs to spots, isn't active and doesn't seem to want to bang with anyone, never battles for position.....

Thank God Curry is doing what he needs to do out there, and Lee is banger allowing the Knicks to hide what these guys bring. Q starts over JJ, Lee over Frye (who needs to find his balls and attack the basket), floor is spread period with that team.

Isiah is a joke, and Balkman is already the better shotblocker, rebounding, and finisher it's downright disgraceful this kid has to sit behind someone that almost shot an airball to the side of the basket.....
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VDesai
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1/4/2007  9:19 AM
I was saying just now that Jefferies reminds me of a taller Shanderson. Except he's a worse FT shooter.
TheGame
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1/4/2007  9:22 AM
Posted by MS:

I have never scene anyone this bad outside of Chris Dudley, he might as well stay at the other end of the floor, i am willing to bet he might be even with most high school kids on offense if not for his frame. Seriously I am not joking, he can't even dunk the ball, his hands are weak and he more often than not loses it around the rim, he looks like just given a ball last week with the way he shoots it, i didn't think it was possible to match last years mid-level, but Isiah has done it. And I am still waiting for ron artest 2 to shut someone down.

Combine him with French Frye out there, who might not even be as tough as Loren Woods and we have a problem, I have never scene anyone want the ball less than this kid. He just runs to spots, isn't active and doesn't seem to want to bang with anyone, never battles for position.....

Thank God Curry is doing what he needs to do out there, and Lee is banger allowing the Knicks to hide what these guys bring. Q starts over JJ, Lee over Frye (who needs to find his balls and attack the basket), floor is spread period with that team.

Isiah is a joke, and Balkman is already the better shotblocker, rebounding, and finisher it's downright disgraceful this kid has to sit behind someone that almost shot an airball to the side of the basket.....

LOL. I did not think any signing could be worse that JJ1 but JJ2 is starting to look pretty bad. Hopefully, this guy can work on his free throws and jumpshooting. In Washington, he was not asked to score because they ran their offense through their jumpshooters and there was no need for him to hit alot of jumpshots. In our offense, with the offense running through Curry, he is going to get alot of open looks and we need him to make a decent percentage of them. Hopefully, this is an aspect of his game that he can improve on in the offseason.
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izybx
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1/4/2007  9:26 AM
I agrre with your description of Jeffries, tho I am still hopeful that his reputation as a defensive presence will end up having some basis...I dont know about what you said about Frye, I really dont think hes as soft as you make him out to be, hes no banger, but hes not a cupcake out there...he did have three blocls yesterday, and has been blocking multiple shots with regularity...that being said he is only an average defender.

Youre right tho, Lee should start once Q gets back, that way we will have some perimeter shooting off the bench in Frye (you can knock him all you want but his shot is money) and a three point threat in Q who, at this point, plays better defense than our "defensive stopper". Lee is also a much better passer than Frye, and if hes starting he will be able to move the ball well when Curry gets doubled.
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MS
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1/4/2007  9:37 AM
I think Frye can be productive, but just watch him out there he doesn't know how to play basketball, he knows how to do one thing knock down a jumper, but he should be working hard around the basket, setting screens and popping and moving to get the ball.......

And I think Isiah just keeps proving that he is braindead, saying Lee just doesn't give you much offensively.....last night he had two great looks in a row of course JJ2 blew the dunk, he got the ball back and found curry for a layup, the kid had 4ass and should have had more, and you can't ever leave him on the floor from 12 and under I don't care if he doesn't force his outside shot, he makes the plays to win, and has fun working with his teammates........But JJ2 can't lose a position he didn't earn, just for defending his teammates, **** you isiah
izybx
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1/4/2007  9:46 AM
Posted by MS:

I think Frye can be productive, but just watch him out there he doesn't know how to play basketball, he knows how to do one thing knock down a jumper, but he should be working hard around the basket, setting screens and popping and moving to get the ball.......

And I think Isiah just keeps proving that he is braindead, saying Lee just doesn't give you much offensively.....last night he had two great looks in a row of course JJ2 blew the dunk, he got the ball back and found curry for a layup, the kid had 4ass and should have had more, and you can't ever leave him on the floor from 12 and under I don't care if he doesn't force his outside shot, he makes the plays to win, and has fun working with his teammates........But JJ2 can't lose a position he didn't earn, just for defending his teammates, **** you isiah

I think Lee should start too, but not at small forward...lets not kid ourselves, Lee is a power forward, and against most teams he is going to get torched guarding threes...Lee vs lebron, melo, pierce, tmac, carter, etc...if hes starting at the three, several things will happen:

1. Lee will get burned for 20-30 points by any half decent true small forward
2. Lee will be in foul trouble all game
3. Lee will not get as many rebounds because he will be playing on the perimeter.

Lee should start, but not at the three, he should be starting at the four, with Frye coming off the bench...as for Frye not knowing how ot play basketball, I dont think you can count a guy out who can already block shots and hit the outside jumpshot as well as be somwhat effective in the post with that little jumphook of his...Im not saying that hes all star status, but given that the guy has a decent skill set at a young age and only 1 1/2 years into his career, I think that if your goin got knock the Knicks you should probbaly look to other players than Frye. Frye will be a solid player during his career, and at this point will be perfect coming off the bench at the 4/5



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MS
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1/4/2007  9:49 AM
Without question, Frye isn't quick enough to guard most power fowards and why the knicks have had trouble this year is because isiah has put lee and frye on players that are outside guys that can stick the three and that opens up way to much.......

Lee brings more to the table offensively than frye, he needs less shots, he gets the team more opportunities, he allows are guards to be aggressive and he doesn't take away from curry's offense and when he gets the ball he knows where to swing it, Isiah left all that out because he is lost, but can score big when he is taking 18 shots a night
Swishfm3
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1/4/2007  9:51 AM
Jeffries confuses me because he was pretty good shooter in Indiana with a decent post up.
K22
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1/4/2007  9:54 AM
Posted by Swishfm3:

Jeffries confuses me because he was pretty good shooter in Indiana with a decent post up.

I was just about to say that.

The guy seriously looks like a deer in headlights on offense. And I hope I wasn't alone in being a little fearful of those turnaround fadeaway jumpers he took last night.

-- the preceding post was brought to you by the letter K and the number 22.
izybx
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1/4/2007  9:55 AM
Posted by MS:

Without question, Frye isn't quick enough to guard most power fowards and why the knicks have had trouble this year is because isiah has put lee and frye on players that are outside guys that can stick the three and that opens up way to much.......

Lee brings more to the table offensively than frye, he needs less shots, he gets the team more opportunities, he allows are guards to be aggressive and he doesn't take away from curry's offense and when he gets the ball he knows where to swing it, Isiah left all that out because he is lost, but can score big when he is taking 18 shots a night

I agree that Frye is too slow to guard a lot of fours, and Lee is better suited to guard the four...but until Q gets back, we need to have Frye on the floor for his perimeter shooting if Curry and Jeffries are on the floor...Curry/Lee/Jeffries does not work as an offensive unit...Curry/Lee/Q does. Curry/Frye/Lee does not work as a defensive unit...Curry/Lee/Q does. You got to admit bro, right now Lee doesnt fit into the starting lineup.

I suspect that this is the reason why Isiah has not started Lee yet, and I think that a couple games after Q is back we will see Curry/Lee/Q as out starting frontcourt with Frye/JJ/Balkman off the bench.



[Edited by - izybx on 01-04-2007 09:56 AM]
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MS
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1/4/2007  9:59 AM
It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......
izybx
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1/4/2007  10:10 AM
Posted by MS:

It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......

I love Lee as much as the next guy, but he has no jumpshot...yes he can sometimes hit little 15 foot jumpers from the corner, but in a 2-3 zone those. wont be available. Keep in mind, Frye has to be guarded out to 20ft. When the Knicks play tommorow, watch where Lees man when he gets the ball on the perimeter. Watch where JJs man is. How will Curry scorewhen the opposing team can triple team him with no fear of paying for it on the perimeter?

And Lee is effective offensively in the role he is being asked to provide; putbacks and layups. He is great at doing what he does, but when you ask him to nail the open shot he simply cant do it at this point in his career. So with Curry/Lee/JJ on the floor, who is keeping defenses honest? Do you really think we can any games by defense alone()?

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Anji
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1/4/2007  10:16 AM
Posted by MS:

It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......

Forgt that, I wanted to choke Isiah when I read he saw JJ2 and Lee as the same offensively.
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
franco12
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1/4/2007  10:17 AM
back to jefferies- I think he's just trying to find his rhythm still- he's had some nice tips on defense and on the offensive glass- hustle plays- and I am sure at some point, his FT % will return to his career normal of 50%.

Right before the suspension, he had a game where he was like 7/8 from the field.
SkyWalker
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1/4/2007  10:18 AM
Hey I remember Jeffries from Indiana U and I recall he was an extremely effective low post scorer in college. Am i mistaken?
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izybx
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1/4/2007  10:18 AM
Posted by Anji:
Posted by MS:

It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......

Forgt that, I wanted to choke Isiah when I read he saw JJ2 and Lee as the same offensively.

I think he means that Lee and Jeffries are not threats from the perimeter, considering that was the central theme of that particular interview (lack of perimeter shooting).

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MS
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1/4/2007  10:26 AM
Anyone that is 6'11 and long is going to be effective in college
Anji
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1/4/2007  11:00 AM
Posted by izybx:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by MS:

It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......

Forgt that, I wanted to choke Isiah when I read he saw JJ2 and Lee as the same offensively.

I think he means that Lee and Jeffries are not threats from the perimeter, considering that was the central theme of that particular interview (lack of perimeter shooting).

Do you think Lee has a better jumpshot then Jeffries??? YEs or NO.
Plus he does all that other "Stuff".
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bigbeast
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1/4/2007  11:18 AM
Posted by MS:

I think Frye can be productive, but just watch him out there he doesn't know how to play basketball, he knows how to do one thing knock down a jumper, but he should be working hard around the basket, setting screens and popping and moving to get the ball.......

And I think Isiah just keeps proving that he is braindead, saying Lee just doesn't give you much offensively.....last night he had two great looks in a row of course JJ2 blew the dunk, he got the ball back and found curry for a layup, the kid had 4ass and should have had more, and you can't ever leave him on the floor from 12 and under I don't care if he doesn't force his outside shot, he makes the plays to win, and has fun working with his teammates........But JJ2 can't lose a position he didn't earn, just for defending his teammates, *** you isiah


Lee played 35 minutes last night and 36 against the Kings. Lee is playing starter minutes. Dont kid yourself into believing Isiah doesn't know what Lee does for this team. If he didn't know or is braindead as you claim, Lee wouldn't be getting the minutes he gets. So what is name isn't called by the public announcer, he's there when it counts.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
izybx
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1/4/2007  11:22 AM
Posted by Anji:
Posted by izybx:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by MS:

It makes perfect sense

Frye
10.1pts 5.7rbs 0.6ass 0.6stls 1.0blks 11fga 40%from the field

Lee
10.7pts 10.7rbs 1.7ass 1.0stls 0.4blks 7fga 61.5%from the field

So 68 power fowards are shooting a higher percentage from the field than Channing Frye, a guy that doesn't defend at all, yet Isiah uses his offensive logic and his ability to shoot the ball as his reasoning, unless Lee reminds him of Larry Bird, I can't see how him can keep making these claims about a player that is average more points on 4 less shots, 2nd best shooting percentage in the nba, 4 more rebounds, not to mention tied at 3.8 on the offensive glass for the league lead and one more assist, but he is less productive......

Forgt that, I wanted to choke Isiah when I read he saw JJ2 and Lee as the same offensively.

I think he means that Lee and Jeffries are not threats from the perimeter, considering that was the central theme of that particular interview (lack of perimeter shooting).

Do you think Lee has a better jumpshot then Jeffries??? YEs or NO.
Plus he does all that other "Stuff".

I have a better jump shot than both of them. Is a bad jumpshot better than no jumpshot, yes. But his point was that neither provides the perimeter shooting that is needed to keep zones from shutting our offense down. I think that is the the point if his statement. And Lee cannot play small forward. Jeffries can. Whos the better player? Lee, of course, but a Lee for Jeffries debate is pointless. Its like saying Balkman should start at center. Lee cant play the position in question.

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