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This dude will probably never talk to Isiah...article
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joec32033
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12/31/2006  9:57 AM
Feud still lingers in NBA

Thomas-Brown tiff just won't go away

BY CHRISTIAN RED
DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Isiah Thomas has had both ups and downs so far as Knicks' coach, but comparisons to Larry Brown, the man he replaced, are a constant.
An hour and 20 minutes have passed and Isiah Thomas has still not arrived at the Garden in preparation for a post-Christmas marquee battle between his Knicks and Eastern Conference powerhouse Detroit. A team spokesman paces the interior corridor checking his Blackberry. Knick beat writers move from the coach's interview room to the clubhouse. Hall of Famer Walt Frazier chats with Detroit TV analyst Greg Kelser about Frazier's epic Game 7 performance in the 1970 NBA Finals.

Moments later, Thomas breezes up the hallway wearing a dark gray pinstriped suit, crisp blue shirt and striped blue tie. He spins between legends and unknowns, shakes hands with everyone, all the while beaming his signature smile and showing no ill effects of the upper West Side traffic snarl that delayed him.

"Good holiday, Clyde?" he asks Frazier. "Good, good. All right, how you doin'? Here we go, here we go."

Nearly six hours later, Thomas' sunny attitude carries over to the interview room after the Knicks survive regulation and three grueling overtimes - not to mention a technical foul on Thomas - to topple the Pistons, 151-145, and inch closer to .500.

But while Knick fans may be encouraged by the team's recent success under Thomas' watch - the victory over Detroit was the fourth in five games before Friday night's 108-86 pasting by the Suns - the former Piston "Bad Boy" is not endearing himself to his coaching peers or even to the players in the league.

It was only a year ago today - with roughly the same group of players - that Larry Brown, the Hall of Fame coach considered by many to be one of the best teachers in the history of the NBA, was presiding over a 7-21 Knick sinkhole. The Knicks ended up winning only 16 more times against 38 more defeats before Thomas, the Knick president, and Garden chairman James Dolan orchestrated a divorce with Brown as acrimonious as any Hollywood celebrity split.

"Thank God that situation is over," says Joe Glass, Brown's longtime agent. "We're not going to comment on anything - neither I nor Larry. We're finished with it."

The rest of the league, however, apparently is still feeling the effects.

There was the Nov. 11 verbal smackdown between Thomas and Spurs forward Bruce Bowen that later spilled into a shouting match with San Antonio coach Gregg Popovich. Over a month later, Thomas sparked one of the ugliest brawls in league history by publicly upbraiding Denver star Carmelo Anthony on the Garden court and ordering a hard foul on Anthony's teammate J.R Smith with just over a minute left in the Nuggets' rout. The fallout resulted in four Knicks being suspended for a combined 21 games, though Thomas himself went unpunished. Nuggets coach George Karl, whose nasty remarks about Brown's firing led to Thomas seeking out Karl during the summer league in Las Vegas and asking him to worry about his own franchise, called Thomas a "jerk" and a "jackass" following the incident.

Brown's legion of supporters surely agreed.

"You're comparing nothing to something," says Denver assistant coach Doug Moe, when asked to compare Thomas' and Brown's coaching philosophies. "You're comparing a guy who has done nothing as a coach to a guy who has been an unbelievable coach. I don't have a clue about Isiah's coaching, but I know Larry's a great coach. There's no doubt in my mind about that."

Moe, who played alongside Brown at North Carolina, underscores an important point. While Thomas had three years' coaching experience with the Pacers prior to this season, Brown brought a Hall of Fame resume to New York that included a 987-741 NBA record, a title with the Pistons, an NCAA championship (Kansas) and the knack for turning lowly teams into contenders.

Thomas never got the Pacers past the first round of the playoffs and has yet to preside over a Knick playoff win or even a winning record since being hired as team president on Dec. 22, 2003. He was fired from the Indiana job by one-time playoff nemesis Larry Bird and prior to taking the Pacers' coaching job, Thomas ran the 55-year-old Continental Basketball Association into bankruptcy during his 18-month ownership of the league. Many of the CBA owners complained about Thomas' temper and bullying manner while he was in charge and one owner, Bill Ilett of the Idaho Stampede, told the Daily News earlier this year that Thomas coaching the Knicks in place of Brown was akin to "one of those Harvard Business School studies on what not to do."

*****

It's difficult to fathom how the Garden atmosphere went from the summer of 2005 and Brown saying, "One of the neatest things is that I get to work with Isiah. I love Isiah," on the eve of his July 28 press conference to formally announce his hiring as Knick head coach, to Brown proclaiming he was "a dead man walking" during the weeks leading up to his pink slip. The Garden itself provides few answers. Garden president Steve Mills declined an interview request by The News. The Knicks' PR department issued a "no comment" for Knicks assistant coach Brendan Suhr - who worked alongside Thomas in the CBA and speaks positively of Thomas' CBA stewardship - after an interview request.

Thomas' one consistent ally in the coaching fraternity, his former coach with the Pistons, Chuck Daly, defends his Hall of Fame player.

"I told him when he took the (Knick) job, 'Don't ever coach. Never, never.' But you know, he was forced into the job," says Daly. "I saw him at the Hall of Fame and he said, 'I'm gonna work my ass off to make this work.' You know what? He's making progress. I don't think (the Knicks) are gonna contend for a title this year, but they're making progress.

"A guy like Isiah comes in - he's president and he wants to get it done. And he makes moves and they don't work out because they're 5-0/50 moves. Then he tries something else, but he's so competitive, he keeps wanting to try and make it better."

That desire has been expensive, costing the Knicks two Hall of Fame coaches (Brown and Lenny Wilkens), another coach (Don Chaney) and the largest payroll in the league (roughly $125 million). Thomas also faces a sexual harassment lawsuit filed by a former team executive and empty seats at the Garden on many nights.

Daly, at least, sees the survivor in Thomas.

"In New York, it's always the coach's fault," he says. "When I was in Jersey (coaching the Nets), I used to listen to (WFAN). (Pat) Riley would go along, win 14 and lose one (coaching the Knicks). You'd have thought the world was coming to an end. I used to laugh my ass off. But (Thomas) is the ultimate competitor. You can be competitive to a fault and not even know it. (The Knicks) don't have a great record now (13-19), but they're winning key games, getting more confidence. That's part of the building process."

Thomas the architect has over half a season left to prove he has assembled a contender and that he can fare better than Brown, the Hall of Famer he helped oust. And although Thomas, for now, has Dolan's support, that could easily change, leading Thomas to the same unemployment line he put Brown in.

"I was sitting just a few feet away at the end of Saturday night's game," Dolan said after the Dec. 16 brawl. "I believe the commissioner acted appropriately, as it was an ugly incident, not worthy of the Knicks, Nuggets, Madison Square Garden or the people of New York. The incident was deeply regrettable, unacceptable on every level and I hope and expect to never witness anything like it again."

The rest of the NBA would surely agree.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/484504p-407917c.html

Daly has a point about NY at the end.
~You can't run from who you are.~
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babyKnicks
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12/31/2006  10:23 AM
what dude will probably never talk to Isiah?

I'm confused by the title of the thread.
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
joec32033
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12/31/2006  10:27 AM
Posted by babyKnicks:

what dude will probably never talk to Isiah?

I'm confused by the title of the thread.

Take off on the whole Simmons -Isiah fued thing. The article trashed Isiah pretty good. I probably could have named it better, but I didn't. Marting, Andrew if you want to change the title of the thread go ahead.
~You can't run from who you are.~
babyKnicks
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12/31/2006  10:28 AM
makes sense...no worries. thanks joe.
Let's go Knicks. That's amare
TheGame
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12/31/2006  11:47 AM
What I don't understand is how these NBA coaches could witness the crap LB did last year and still act like LB did nothing wrong and the whole situation was IT's fault. Moe and Karl would have more credibility if they said LB is a great coach but he did not do a great job last year for the Knicks. Otherwise, they are just blindly supporting LB. Not that I am saying IT has not done some things wrong both this year and last as far as coaching, but this article makes it seem like LB did nothing to do with the state of the Knicks last year, which was not the case.
Trust the Process
K22
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12/31/2006  3:09 PM
I'm already of the mindset that last season didn't count and shouldn't be used to measure anything.

LB is gone. He ain't coming back. Time to move on, already.
-- the preceding post was brought to you by the letter K and the number 22.
rojasmas
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12/31/2006  6:45 PM
There is the whole North Carolina coaching fraternity. Made up of ex Carolina grads: Moe, Karl, LB. They each cover each other's back. Not to mention coaches usually cover each other's butt. Isiah didn't do a bad job in Indiana. He isn't a bad coach. Give him a chance.
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joec32033
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12/31/2006  6:46 PM
Posted by rojasmas:

There is the whole North Carolina coaching fraternity. Made up of ex Carolina grads: Moe, Karl, LB. They each cover each other's back. Not to mention coaches usually cover each other's butt. Isiah didn't do a bad job in Indiana. He isn't a bad coach. Give him a chance.

The problem is as a GM Isiah has treated coaches like crap, so it is going to be very hard to break into that club with respect.
~You can't run from who you are.~
Nalod
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1/1/2007  3:51 PM
Posted by TheGame:

What I don't understand is how these NBA coaches could witness the crap LB did last year and still act like LB did nothing wrong and the whole situation was IT's fault. Moe and Karl would have more credibility if they said LB is a great coach but he did not do a great job last year for the Knicks. Otherwise, they are just blindly supporting LB. Not that I am saying IT has not done some things wrong both this year and last as far as coaching, but this article makes it seem like LB did nothing to do with the state of the Knicks last year, which was not the case.


larry juice card still got pulp in it. Isiah has left a path of ruin while larry got cred.

Last year sucked, but maybe they all know the inside scoop and we don#t.
This dude will probably never talk to Isiah...article

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