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Mature Francis takes shot at winning
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fishmike
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10/12/2006  12:31 PM
BY DAVID WALDSTEIN
Star-Ledger Staff
GREENBURGH, N.Y. -- In seven years in the NBA he has been the kind of player who delights so many of the game's young fans, but also the kind who has turned many old-timers away from the league.

He loves to shoot that ball. He loves to dribble it, too. He isn't known as a prolific passer, but he could score almost at will, and would fill up a highlight reel in the process. He has averaged 21 points three times in those seven years, and played in three All-Star games, but in seven years he has been in only one playoff series.

Now Steve Francis has the seven-year itch.

Here in the second week of training camp, in his first full season with the Knicks, Francis vowed old highlight-reel player to be a thing of the past. The old Francis who pounded the ball on the perimeter and then drove to the rim? No more, he says.

"I don't want to be that," he said after yesterday's practice. "I want to be the Steve Francis of new. Every year you mature in the NBA as a player and a person. I just want to do something that I've never done. The stuff that I did was points and dunks. But that didn't equal victories. It didn't equal playoffs. I've done everything but win games, and that's what I'm out to do."

That's a rare admission from a superstar player these days, but perhaps that's what comes from the soul-wrenching misery Francis says he endured last season after being traded to the lowly Knicks. Bad?

"It was the worst thing that I've ever experienced as a basketball player in my career, he said."

Francis was traded from Orlando on Feb. 22 for Trevor Ariza and Penny Hardaway, and was supposed to be the Earl Monroe to Stephon Marbury's Walt Frazier -- even though Marbury claims Larry Brown brought in Francis just to push Marbury out. Either way, neither scenario worked out that way.

Brown started Francis the first two games, then moved him to the bench, and then back into the starting lineup again. In his return to Orlando, Francis started and played only 11 minutes, and later called it the absolute low point of his career. His 14.4-point average was also the lowest of his career, as were his assist (4.9) and rebound (4.1) averages.

In New York, he fit right in.

In fact, Francis said when he joined the Knicks morale was so low that basketball was secondary to the off-court sideshows, most of which involved Brown, Marbury and Thomas.

"There was so much stuff that went on last season that basketball didn't seem to be the focal point of the players on this team," Francis said.

And what was?

"I couldn't even tell you," he said. "I don't remember. I don't remember nothing from last year."

That's probably for the best. Like all of the Knicks, Francis claims to be hyped about the upcoming season, and is reveling in the clean, fresh air of Isiah Thomas's new regime. Thomas made it his priority to return some of the joy and love of the game to the players, and so far Francis has bought in.

"It's good to feel good about basketball," Francis said. "As much as people say, 'Oh, you make all this money,' still you're human and there's a mental part of basketball that you have to be prepared for. Throughout our training camp and our practices, we're all prepared for what we have at stake."

In the past, that was always about scoring points, dunking the ball and making an All-Star team. Now, he claims, it's about those elusive victories, and last season that wasn't the case for anyone.

"It's not new," he said. "I just think guys have found it back in themselves that, 'Hey, I can do this, or 'I can do that.' From the time that I was here last year, I didn't see that from anybody on this team."

Stephon Marbury, who launched his new Starbury line of sneakers this summer, said Starbury II is coming out soon, and a third edition of the shoe is in the works, too. He said they will "always" sell for $14.98.... Thomas said he plans to "experiment" with lineups during the team's exhibition season, which starts tomorrow against the Nets.


FIVE THINGS WE'VE LEARNED SO FAR AT CAMP

1. It's all Larry's fault -- everything from the 23-59 record last year, to the high prices of gas over the summer: And since its now company policy, the players are all very willing to go along with the program and rip the Hall of Fame coach for last year's debacle.

2. Up is down and day is night: To renew his players' confidence and love for the game, Isiah Thomas made it a point to be the anti-Larry. Whatever Brown did last year, Thomas has done the opposite -- hoping the record will be closer to the opposite, as well.

3. Run and fun. They won't be the Suns, but they promise to finally run more than last year. That won't be hard, considering their performance last year.

4. Channing Frye grew sideways. The Knicks asked him to beef up over the summer, and he obviously spent a lot of time in the weight room. Boy, did he. You'll notice much wider shoulders, which the Knicks hope will make him tougher inside.

5. The rookies are going to sit: Thomas said it's going to take a while -- perhaps all season -- for Mardy Collins and Ronaldo Balkman to see meaningful time. It won't be like last year's precocious class.

CO-BEST PLAYERS: Jamal Crawford and Quentin Richardson. They were paired together in Charleston and never lost a game.

MOST DISAPPOINTING PLAYER: Has to be Jerome James because of his injury. He worked hard all summer to get into shape and put last year's injury-riddled season behind him, and in the first practice he injures his plantar fascia in his right foot and is out indefinitely.

BIGGEST SURPRISE: That the Knicks didn't blame Larry Brown for the Yankees collapse as well.

-- DAVID WALDSTEIN

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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fishmike
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10/12/2006  12:31 PM
good news on Frye.. looking forward to seeing that
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
nixluva
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10/12/2006  12:40 PM
I like that Q and Jamal are really clicking. We need them to help this team be consistent all game. This is gonna be a deep squad.

I like what i'm hearing from Francis and hopefully he's really gonna try to change his ways to be more focused on the big picture of winning.
MS
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10/12/2006  12:41 PM
He did put on a little weight but is still very lanky, I saw him in vegas waiting on the cab line
martin
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10/12/2006  12:43 PM
I like to hear Stevie say what he has. Now I want to see it.
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fishmike
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10/12/2006  12:55 PM
not to sounds like Larry (I love him... GOD I LOVE HIM) but if Francis rebounds, plays D and shares the ball he will be a very good player for us. We already know he's a good rebounder, but its usually at the 1, where his minutes will be at the 2 this year.

No reason a guy as fast and strong as he is cant be a good defender if there's a commitment to it.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
martin
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10/12/2006  1:04 PM
Posted by fishmike:

not to sounds like Larry (I love him... GOD I LOVE HIM) but if Francis rebounds, plays D and shares the ball he will be a very good player for us. We already know he's a good rebounder, but its usually at the 1, where his minutes will be at the 2 this year.

No reason a guy as fast and strong as he is cant be a good defender if there's a commitment to it.

I'd really like to see Stevie at the 1 and Marb at the 2.
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Swishfm3
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10/12/2006  1:42 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by fishmike:

not to sounds like Larry (I love him... GOD I LOVE HIM) but if Francis rebounds, plays D and shares the ball he will be a very good player for us. We already know he's a good rebounder, but its usually at the 1, where his minutes will be at the 2 this year.

No reason a guy as fast and strong as he is cant be a good defender if there's a commitment to it.

I'd really like to see Stevie at the 1 and Marb at the 2.


really? You think Steve is a better playmaker than Marbury?


I say LET them all blame Larry Brown for everything that went last season....If thats what they want to use motivation...then fine. Whatever works.
martin
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10/12/2006  2:02 PM
Posted by Swishfm3:
Posted by martin:
Posted by fishmike:

not to sounds like Larry (I love him... GOD I LOVE HIM) but if Francis rebounds, plays D and shares the ball he will be a very good player for us. We already know he's a good rebounder, but its usually at the 1, where his minutes will be at the 2 this year.

No reason a guy as fast and strong as he is cant be a good defender if there's a commitment to it.

I'd really like to see Stevie at the 1 and Marb at the 2.


really? You think Steve is a better playmaker than Marbury?

I think both are only so-so at playmaking but Marbury is the better scorer and has better range.... plus he did show a desire to play SG last year.

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Nalod
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10/12/2006  2:47 PM
SOunds like if they sacrifice to win, play strong defense they will be allowed to run.

Sounds familiar?

We may run more, but if we dont take care of the ball and play defense we gonna run right out the building.

Hey, its preseason, all looks good!
Swishfm3
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10/12/2006  2:50 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by Swishfm3:
Posted by martin:
Posted by fishmike:

not to sounds like Larry (I love him... GOD I LOVE HIM) but if Francis rebounds, plays D and shares the ball he will be a very good player for us. We already know he's a good rebounder, but its usually at the 1, where his minutes will be at the 2 this year.

No reason a guy as fast and strong as he is cant be a good defender if there's a commitment to it.

I'd really like to see Stevie at the 1 and Marb at the 2.


really? You think Steve is a better playmaker than Marbury?

I think both are only so-so at playmaking but Marbury is the better scorer and has better range.... plus he did show a desire to play SG last year.

I would prefer Francis at the two because he is the better athlete..slasher..rebounder..post up player.
and like you said Marbury has better range..so he can play on the top.

either way...Marbury is going to HAVE TO sacrifice a lot of his game this year.
nyk4ever
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10/12/2006  2:51 PM
It's great to hear this stuff from these guys, I hope and pray that they ALL back up their words BUT they HAVE to show me on the court, not in the papers. I want the Knicks to matter again so bad, but until these guys show me they have their acts together, all I can do is go on their pasts and for most of them it's not that good. Again, great to hear Francis saying this, if things play out right with him and Steph, the backcourt will be nasty. Let's just hope they play out right.

My take has been that it won't work out and their both egomaniacs. I hope to God I'm wrong because I want a championship, but again... these guys have to prove to me and alot of people that we're wrong. Most of us just can't look on the bright-side of things when their ugly pasts are glaring in our faces. PROVE ME WRONG.

[Edited by - nyk4ever on 10-12-2006 2:52 PM]
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
fishmike
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10/12/2006  4:56 PM
nyk4ever, great post... what I have been saying for some time. I'm not hating on ANY of these guys. I'm calling it like I see it. Isiah makes dumb moves, Francis quits, Curry is fat, Jerome is fat, Marbury is a problem, etc etc
This is hating, this is stating the obvious. Change it.. please change it. These guys have all done nothing in the NBA. Nada, zilch, but run their mouths and watch playoff games on their expensive TVs sitting at home.

DO SOMETHING.

I would LOVE to say "gee, Marbury really locked down _____ late in the game huh?"

or

"wow... Eddie was really moving well tonight, clogging the lane, swatting a couple shots."

ANYTHING
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
gunsnewing
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10/12/2006  5:01 PM
I agree with you guys. its time to show us something. but im still not expecting certain things from certain players. I just hope that the positive aspects of the team really outweigh the negatives



[Edited by - gunsnewing on 10-12-2006 5:04 PM]
Bippity10
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10/12/2006  5:02 PM
I think we are all on the same page
I just hope that people will like me
nyk4ever
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10/12/2006  5:21 PM
Posted by fishmike:

nyk4ever, great post... what I have been saying for some time. I'm not hating on ANY of these guys. I'm calling it like I see it. Isiah makes dumb moves, Francis quits, Curry is fat, Jerome is fat, Marbury is a problem, etc etc
This is hating, this is stating the obvious. Change it.. please change it. These guys have all done nothing in the NBA. Nada, zilch, but run their mouths and watch playoff games on their expensive TVs sitting at home.

DO SOMETHING.

I would LOVE to say "gee, Marbury really locked down _____ late in the game huh?"

or

"wow... Eddie was really moving well tonight, clogging the lane, swatting a couple shots."

ANYTHING

I couldn't agree more, Fish. I'm an extremely loyal fan, I will root my ass off for teams that are giving it their best and giving me something to root for, even if their losing and losing on a consistent basis. This hasn't been the case with the Knicks honestly since Isiah and Marbury came here. I WANT to root for these guys but I'm not going to get all happy like a lot of people because these guys are saying great things in the paper, you have to show me something on the court, where it matters before I get my hopes back up with this team. Just like you said and I've said it before as well, this isn't being a hater, this is being a realist. I'm sorry that unlike some people around here, that I'm being real about the Knicks situation instead of creating fantasy scenarios in my head that might or might not happen. I wait until things happen to be happy and spouting off about how great this team is. As of right now, this team has given me the right to be pissed off about the situation that their in and to boo my ass off until things get right. Francis, Marbury, Curry, PROVE TO ME that I'm wrong about you guys. Prove to me that you are not an egomaniac or you are not an overweight blob of talent who can't stop eating. PROVE TO ME that you will let your ego take a backseat to winning. When I see things like this happen, THEN I will say this team is ready to play for a championship and I’ll be sounding like some on this board. Until then I'll keep rooting, that will NEVER change, but I won't believe for a second that their ready for a championship and it won’t mean anything watching these games. There is a big difference in perspective in the two scenarios, a BIG difference.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
crzymdups
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10/12/2006  6:15 PM
good thread, I agree with most of the sentiments. it's funny, I felt this team could be a 40 win group this year while assuming Francis and QRich would give us nothing. If they're here with their heads right and their bodies healthy - this team could actually be very interesting.

but with Francis and QRich, I need to see it to believe it. I know Marbury will play well this year to prove Isiah right and Larry wrong, and I'm not worried at all about Frye, Lee, Jefferies, Nate, Jamal. Curry, QRich and Francis are the big question marks for me.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 12-10-2006 6:17 PM]
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nixluva
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10/12/2006  6:25 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

good thread, I agree with most of the sentiments. it's funny, I felt this team could be a 40 win group this year while assuming Francis and QRich would give us nothing. If they're here with their heads right and their bodies healthy - this team could actually be very interesting.

but with Francis and QRich, I need to see it to believe it. I know Marbury will play well this year to prove Isiah right and Larry wrong, and I'm not worried at all about Frye, Lee, Jefferies, Nate, Jamal. Curry, QRich and Francis are the big question marks for me.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 12-10-2006 6:17 PM]

My take is that Curry is the main one to question. Even if we didn't like how Francis plays, for the most part he always gives effort. Q had a horrible offensive season, but he NEVER stopped trying to play D and rebound. His effort level was always high. I think most of the guys on this team will give an honest effort every game. It's Curry that remains the real key to this season. If this guy improves this team can be so much better. You pretty much know what you're gettting from everyone else if they're on their game. Curry is the X factor. If he has a monster year, this team is on another level.
crzymdups
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10/12/2006  6:33 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by crzymdups:

good thread, I agree with most of the sentiments. it's funny, I felt this team could be a 40 win group this year while assuming Francis and QRich would give us nothing. If they're here with their heads right and their bodies healthy - this team could actually be very interesting.

but with Francis and QRich, I need to see it to believe it. I know Marbury will play well this year to prove Isiah right and Larry wrong, and I'm not worried at all about Frye, Lee, Jefferies, Nate, Jamal. Curry, QRich and Francis are the big question marks for me.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 12-10-2006 6:17 PM]

My take is that Curry is the main one to question. Even if we didn't like how Francis plays, for the most part he always gives effort. Q had a horrible offensive season, but he NEVER stopped trying to play D and rebound. His effort level was always high. I think most of the guys on this team will give an honest effort every game. It's Curry that remains the real key to this season. If this guy improves this team can be so much better. You pretty much know what you're gettting from everyone else if they're on their game. Curry is the X factor. If he has a monster year, this team is on another level.

Qrich's effort isn't a question, but his attitude and skill level vs. injury are for me.

Francis gave the worst effort I have ever seen here last year.

Curry is probably one of the biggest keys for the team, of course and probably the biggest question mark. I don't know if he can ever take this team to another level by himself. But I think he and Frye and Lee and Craw can.
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tkf
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10/12/2006  7:15 PM
The fact that Q and Jamal played well, does not suprise me. I hope they get to play a lot together..
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Mature Francis takes shot at winning

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