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i think our draft is donme i think we gave promises to boone and lowry
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BRIGGS
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6/15/2006  2:40 PM
i think this is a mistake i think we shouldve kept our eyes open these kids werent going back to school anyway, so if they were there--they were there is that was the knicks opinion---its just the way things are run, its why the management is terrible and we will continue to suffer theyre way to rigid in their thinking-they always think they have everyone else beat out---- josh boone is a reasonable pick at 29 IF no one else fell OR other attractive options presented themselves, but lowry at 20 is absurd given we already have nate.


i still would much rather get into trade dialogue for JR Smith and this is coming from a guy who usually wanst to keep the pick[s] we couldve possibly paired the picks with a vet and moved up for someone much more apealling--i just believe we took options off the table--im almost convinced they have done this.

[Edited by - BRIGGS on 06-15-2006 2:42 PM]
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crzymdups
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6/15/2006  2:42 PM
Lowry and Boone would not be a bad draft. And this organization has PLENTY of problems. But the draft is not one of them.

Our primary needs are a pure SF, a pure PG and a physical PF. This fills two of three. Maybe Isiah knows that Shawne Williams is going to go higher than 20. Maybe he has a trade lined up for a SF (Darius?). Let's see how it actually plays out before making too many assumptions.
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Rich
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6/15/2006  3:10 PM
I think Isiah has kept open the option to trade up if the opportunity presents itself.
Anji
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6/15/2006  3:11 PM
Honestly I'm sick of this Larry Brown/Hitler talk about a Pure this or a pure that. How about the knicks get WINS, Period!!! Do the Mavs have an "PUre POint Guard"???? Who is the "PURE SHooter" on the Heat??? Is Josh Howard even a SmallForward at 6'6???? HOw "Pure" is Walker as an Small forward???
We need PLAYERS, who cares what cookie cutter they are closest to. Dirk isn't a powerforward or a center, He is a damn good player though. If Lowery and Boone is who Isiah wants I'm fine with it, but inferring what Brown wants on Isiah as an coach is wrong. Marbury and Nate maybe the point Guards for Isiah. Frye and Lee maybe what Isiah wants from his forwards, so why should he be making promises to second round talent?????
"Pure" Rubbish.......

[Edited by - Anji on 06-15-2006 3:13 PM]
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  3:12 PM
I have to say, I really think Shawne Williams is going to be good. If he's there at 20, I would hate to pass on this kid.
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purple012870
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6/15/2006  3:34 PM
Yes....Nate & Lowry overlap. But I'd be ecstatic with that draft.

Lowry to me is Speedy Claxton.

I don't want yet another enigmatic, primadonna like Shawne Williams.

Lowry, plus Boone, plus Jared Jefferies via the MLE, plus whatever Marbury or Francis yields are several steps in the direction of adding toughness & defense.
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  3:38 PM
To me it's eerie how similar Nate and Lowry look on the court. I don't know if we can get away with having two guys that small in the rotation, even if they are both tough as nails and good defenders.

If we get Lowry, we HAVE to move Francis or Marbury. I think Francis is more imperative to move, he's an actual cancer. Marbury, as difficult as he is to get along with, seems to get along with rookies.

I don't know about adding Jared Jefferies - I think he's a little overrated.
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crzymdups
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6/15/2006  3:42 PM
Posted by Anji:

Honestly I'm sick of this Larry Brown/Hitler talk about a Pure this or a pure that. How about the knicks get WINS, Period!!! Do the Mavs have an "PUre POint Guard"???? Who is the "PURE SHooter" on the Heat??? Is Josh Howard even a SmallForward at 6'6???? HOw "Pure" is Walker as an Small forward???
We need PLAYERS, who cares what cookie cutter they are closest to. Dirk isn't a powerforward or a center, He is a damn good player though. If Lowery and Boone is who Isiah wants I'm fine with it, but inferring what Brown wants on Isiah as an coach is wrong. Marbury and Nate maybe the point Guards for Isiah. Frye and Lee maybe what Isiah wants from his forwards, so why should he be making promises to second round talent?????
"Pure" Rubbish.......

[Edited by - Anji on 06-15-2006 3:13 PM]

With the new zone rules and perimeter fouls that are and aren't being called, penetrators, playmakers and shooters are at a premium. A guy like Shawne Williams would destroy a zone, so would Lowry. The thing that frustrates me about Brown is that Nate and Marbury should be able to as well and they weren't given a system that allowed it.

Also, I know Howard is listed at 6'6" or 6'7", but watching him on the court, he looks like he's 6'8" or 6'9". I don't know if it's his length or he's actually grown, but he looks a lot bigger than listed.


edit: one reason I really want Shawne Williams is that a shooter like him could really space the floor for Curry. We need better spacing for Curry, and part of that is getting shooters on the floor. And I think Shawne is a great shooter who can bring a lot of other things. I don't know too much about his attitude, but I've heard some of his interviews haven't gone well. But going by what I saw from him in actual games, he looked like a great fit for us.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-15-2006 3:44 PM]
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McK1
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6/15/2006  3:42 PM
Nate is a slasher who can spot-up shoot. Lowry is a penetrator. they can play together and not trip over one another

and we never heard reports of Steve saying he doesn't care what the coach thinks.

last 2 comments from Steve were about starting and being a pointguard for the Knicks.

100 mill steph is thinking about asking for the max

[Edited by - McK1 on 06-15-2006 3:43 PM]

[Edited by - McK1 on 06-15-2006 3:44 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  3:45 PM
mck, didn't you say Orlando played much better simply because they dumped Francis? I think Francis is the easier guy to move anyway.
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Anji
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6/15/2006  3:51 PM
I know Isiah will pick S williams if he is there. I don't know about making promises to Lowery and Boone which are only rumores. I think the knicks should get players, not Wing spans or Cone Drills, WE NEED PLAYERS!!!

"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
McK1
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6/15/2006  3:53 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

mck, didn't you say Orlando played much better simply because they dumped Francis? I think Francis is the easier guy to move anyway.

3 teams got better after dumping Steph

and yeah getting Howard away from Steve was key. however Curry is the opposite of Howard. Curry's best moves is off the attention drawn to others. Francis will get in there and lob it. Steph is shooting if he drives it.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  3:58 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by crzymdups:

mck, didn't you say Orlando played much better simply because they dumped Francis? I think Francis is the easier guy to move anyway.

3 teams got better after dumping Steph

and yeah getting Howard away from Steve was key. however Curry is the opposite of Howard. Curry's best moves is off the attention drawn to others. Francis will get in there and lob it. Steph is shooting if he drives it.

One of Steph's best moves is the drive and dish, he destroys defense doing this and creates all sorts of opportunities inside or for open shooters. He always gave it up to Sweets and Nazr in the paint. Unfortunately, Larry didn't let him drive as much as he had in years past.

Steph and Brown clashed. Francis just didn't even try once he showed up. Not once. I'll take the player that tries.

edit: also, those three teams that got better when Steph left ADDED significant pieces to replace him. Jersey got Kidd, Minnie got Brandon (and didn't really improve, not making it out of the first round til Cassell showed up...) and PHX got cap room to get Nash and had a healthy Amare and signed QRich.

Orlando got better because Francis left, unless you want to give credit to Ariza. But you've already laughed at me for claiming Ariza is a worthwhile player, so you can't have it both ways here.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-15-2006 4:01 PM]
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MS
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6/15/2006  4:01 PM
That would be a good draft I think Williams will slip to 29, you need to take Lowry the kid is going to be a star and does everything very well he is strong defends and plays hard he is nothing like Nate he is much more in control he plays better defense and his decision making is better....he is almost 4-5 inches taller obviously doesn't jump as high but they are a good pg combo.....

To bad dip **** made the Francis trade......because things would be much easier right now if he hadn't and adding a young pg to the team would have been great......

I say we move Crawford for whatever we can get right now he has some offensive skills but we don't need roster spots taking up by player that are turnover prone and play no defense, let no defend the guy he is value is going up but he may be the easiest player to move.....I would like to see him moved for a PJ Brown type as a one year rental to try to change the culture.....
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  4:04 PM
Posted by MS:

That would be a good draft I think Williams will slip to 29, you need to take Lowry the kid is going to be a star and does everything very well he is strong defends and plays hard he is nothing like Nate he is much more in control he plays better defense and his decision making is better....he is almost 4-5 inches taller obviously doesn't jump as high but they are a good pg combo.....

To bad dip **** made the Francis trade......because things would be much easier right now if he hadn't and adding a young pg to the team would have been great......

I say we move Crawford for whatever we can get right now he has some offensive skills but we don't need roster spots taking up by player that are turnover prone and play no defense, let no defend the guy he is value is going up but he may be the easiest player to move.....I would like to see him moved for a PJ Brown type as a one year rental to try to change the culture.....

no way, keep Jamal. Do everything you can to trade Francis. Marbury and Jamal backed up by Nate and Lowry is a good mix for right now. QRich can play some SG against bigger guys and also some SF. Also, use some damn ZONE to take advantage of our quickness on the perimeter - if they take Lowry. I wouldn't be against Lowry at all. He's a lot of fun. He's got a heart.
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Anji
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6/15/2006  4:06 PM
Posted by crzymdups:




edit: also, those three teams that got better when Steph left ADDED significant pieces to replace him. Jersey got Kidd, Minnie got Brandon (and didn't really improve, not making it out of the first round til Cassell showed up...) and PHX got cap room to get Nash and had a healthy Amare and signed QRich.

Orlando got better because Francis left, unless you want to give credit to Ariza. But you've already laughed at me for claiming Ariza is a worthwhile player, so you can't have it both ways here.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-15-2006 4:01 PM]

Great Obersavtion....
"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
McK1
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6/15/2006  4:08 PM
Posted by crzymdups:



Orlando got better because Francis left, unless you want to give credit to Ariza. But you've already laughed at me for claiming Ariza is a worthwhile player, so you can't have it both ways here.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06-15-2006 4:01 PM]

the other part of what happened for Orlando:

Jameer being given the keys and producing + Darko's play at the four.

Ariza is a bit player.



[Edited by - McK1 on 06-15-2006 4:09 PM]

[Edited by - McK1 on 06-15-2006 4:09 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
MS
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6/15/2006  4:08 PM
you need to move players that you can to try to get rid of players that do the same thing he is the most value he can get.....and is signed through 2010
crzymdups
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6/15/2006  4:10 PM
Jameer was already the PG and Francis was the SG. Francis was a cancer. He absolutely tanked games for a month in Orlando and then showed up in NY and did the same damn thing.

Marbury and Brown TRIED to come to an understanding and for the most part did before Marbury's injury. By the time Marbury came back, things had spiraled so far out of control that it was moot. Even when Marbury came back, he tried hard, like the game in Memphis. Francis played like a pile of warm poop. He sucks and is one of the biggest cancers in the league.
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McK1
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6/15/2006  4:12 PM
the platform is the same be it for steph 3 times over or Francis in Orlando.

you target guys to replace them then you take a laxative and flush.

Steph has been here undermining coaches and alienating teammates longer than Steve. which means presently Steph is the bigger cancer. Big cancer goes first.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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i think our draft is donme i think we gave promises to boone and lowry
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