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Q1 out Knicks win
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Caseloads
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3/17/2006  11:20 PM
This has been a pattern all season!
AUTOADVERT
djsunyc
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3/18/2006  12:26 AM
quentin played the final 3 games of the win streak and played in those two wins prior to this one.
tomverve
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3/18/2006  12:36 AM
Knicks record without Stephon Marbury: 0 - 11

Knicks record without Quentin Richardson: 8 - 3
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Caseloads
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3/18/2006  12:54 AM
tom - exactly...
simrud
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3/18/2006  1:07 AM
We are actually 8-3 w/out Q.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
simrud
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3/18/2006  1:07 AM
And 0-11 w/out Marbury.

Thats some food for thought.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
OldFan
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3/18/2006  7:05 AM
Posted by tomverve:

Knicks record without Stephon Marbury: 0 - 11

Knicks record without Quentin Richardson: 8 - 3

31 5-9 0-0 2-2 0 2 2 3 1 0 7 4 12

That's Marbs line from last night - 12 pts 7 turnovers 2 assists - does this game count as WITH Marbury?

[Edited by - oldfan on 03-18-2006 07:21 AM]
SlimPack
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3/18/2006  7:37 AM
I think q1 should still start though, he's playing better now than he was earlier this season.
simrud
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3/18/2006  8:29 AM
Q1 playin better means not being a total, utter, gigantic failure.

There are at least 3 players better then him at both SF and SG. He just plain and simple sucks. His back injury has turned him into a waste of a roster spot.

Let's face reality here, why would the Suns trade him AND a 1st round pick for KT if he wasnt done as a player. They saw him in practice, and realized all he could do is shoot wide open 3's, soemthing that he seems to have lost the ability to do nowdays as well.

Who would you rather play at SF, Rose, Woods, Lee or Q? Thats 3 players ahead of him.
Who would you rather play at SG, Fancis, Craw, or Nate? Thats 3 playes ahead of him.

Case closed.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
simrud
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3/18/2006  8:30 AM
P.S. The guy used to be a monster postup guard, now he can't do it at all. Never haid midrange game, if you look up his stats, his midrange shooting pecrentage is prolly in the 20's. All he ever did was postup and shoot 3's. Now he can't postup cause of his back, and god knows why he can't shoot anymore.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
jaydh
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3/18/2006  10:14 AM
Posted by Caseloads:

This has been a pattern all season!

i think it has a lot to do with Woods, Nate and Lee getting his minutes. They bring energy, cohesiveness and consistency.

[Edited by - jaydh on 03-18-2006 10:19 AM]
nykshaknbake
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3/18/2006  10:28 AM
KInda agree. Though not a whole lot we can do about it now. His back might not be shot though. He's playing much better now, especially in the rebounding dept. I think he's been terrible in general but he can compete for the SG/SF spot if he continues to play well.
Posted by simrud:

Q1 playin better means not being a total, utter, gigantic failure.

There are at least 3 players better then him at both SF and SG. He just plain and simple sucks. His back injury has turned him into a waste of a roster spot.

Let's face reality here, why would the Suns trade him AND a 1st round pick for KT if he wasnt done as a player. They saw him in practice, and realized all he could do is shoot wide open 3's, soemthing that he seems to have lost the ability to do nowdays as well.

Who would you rather play at SF, Rose, Woods, Lee or Q? Thats 3 players ahead of him.
Who would you rather play at SG, Fancis, Craw, or Nate? Thats 3 playes ahead of him.

Case closed.
OldFan
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3/18/2006  10:43 AM
Posted by simrud:

Q1 playin better means not being a total, utter, gigantic failure.

There are at least 3 players better then him at both SF and SG. He just plain and simple sucks. His back injury has turned him into a waste of a roster spot.

Let's face reality here, why would the Suns trade him AND a 1st round pick for KT if he wasnt done as a player. They saw him in practice, and realized all he could do is shoot wide open 3's, soemthing that he seems to have lost the ability to do nowdays as well.

Who would you rather play at SF, Rose, Woods, Lee or Q? Thats 3 players ahead of him.
Who would you rather play at SG, Fancis, Craw, or Nate? Thats 3 playes ahead of him.

Case closed.


Brown thinks he's one of the better defensive players on the Knicks - sort of like being the worlds tallest midget but it counts for something.

[Edited by - oldfan on 03-18-2006 10:57 AM]
gunsnewing
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3/18/2006  10:51 AM
Q bricking 3'w all season really killed the flow of the offense. I love what I'm seeing without Q & Marbury
tomverve
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3/18/2006  11:25 AM
Posted by OldFan:

That's Marbs line from last night - 12 pts 7 turnovers 2 assists - does this game count as WITH Marbury?

Sure it does. I'm just going by minutes played-- without X means X played 0 minutes. There was a game where the Knicks won and Q played only 6 minutes, but I counted that as "with" Q. And of course, if bad stat lines are equivalent to the player being out altogether, then Q has missed a lot more games this season than Marbury.

I'm not trying to rag on Q. Caseloads made that comment at the outset about winning without Q being a pattern and I went to look up the stats to see if he was right. Surprisingly, he was very right. I don't know to what extent this trend shows causality or to what extent it's a string of coincidences, but it is pretty striking. Perhaps Q hurts the team by gumming up the offense more than he helps by playing solid D.
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OldFan
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3/18/2006  12:29 PM
Posted by tomverve:
Posted by OldFan:

That's Marbs line from last night - 12 pts 7 turnovers 2 assists - does this game count as WITH Marbury?

Sure it does. I'm just going by minutes played-- without X means X played 0 minutes. There was a game where the Knicks won and Q played only 6 minutes, but I counted that as "with" Q. And of course, if bad stat lines are equivalent to the player being out altogether, then Q has missed a lot more games this season than Marbury.

I'm not trying to rag on Q. Caseloads made that comment at the outset about winning without Q being a pattern and I went to look up the stats to see if he was right. Surprisingly, he was very right. I don't know to what extent this trend shows causality or to what extent it's a string of coincidences, but it is pretty striking. Perhaps Q hurts the team by gumming up the offense more than he helps by playing solid D.


My original comment was just an off the cuff shot at Marbs. I'm feeling pretty annoyed with him right now - which comes and goes.

As far as Qs impact - he's had a rough year but I don't think he's beyond hope. You're pretty into stats so I'm sure we can agree that the knicks weren't going to win 73% of their games if Q-rich didn't play this year.
djsunyc
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3/18/2006  12:31 PM
i've never seen a player in such a season long slump before. it's uncanny. and even by his career standards, his %'s aren't that great to begin with either. he is the definition of volume shooter. but i still think he has a place here. he works really hard, and is one of the few that's been going all out since the beginning of the year. i keep saying we should try to mold him into our version of bruce bowen. don't really feature him on offense and let him get his in the flow of the offense. but more importantly, have him committed to defense. i don't know if he will be our longterm answer as a starting SG/SF but he's a good guy to have around...just like malik.
tomverve
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3/18/2006  1:09 PM
Well, there's no doubt in my mind that the Knicks without Marbury would be better than .000 for the season, or that the Knicks without Q would be worse than .727. The great record without Q may largely be a coincidence-- perhaps he just happens to have been injured during those stretches where the Knicks have played well for a series of games.

Still, on the face of it, the sheer magnitude of the Knicks' winning percentage without Q suggests that it's unlikely to all be due to chance. I like the hard work Q has brought to the team this year, and undoubtedly that hard work has endeared him to a number of fans, but it very well may be that we're better off without him. We're certainly not lacking for replacements at this point anyway. Of course, the way Q has played for us in conjunction with the size and length of his contract makes him very much like a better version of Shandon Anderson for this team-- whether we're better off with or without him, we're likely stuck with him.
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TMS
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3/18/2006  3:24 PM
we have no choice because no team's taking him off our hands w/that non-insurable contract anyway... personally i'd rather see Q Woods getting more playing time at the 3, & Q Rich playing at the 2... that would give us 2 good rebounders at the swing positions, & would improve our perimeter d as well.
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Marv
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3/18/2006  3:54 PM
Posted by OldFan:

sort of like being the worlds tallest midget

[Edited by - oldfan on 03-18-2006 10:57 AM]
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