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isiah's prophet uses both sides of mouth (lupica)
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djsunyc
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3/2/2006  7:46 AM
Isiah's prophet uses both sides of mouth

Isiah Thomas wasn't in that ballroom with James Dolan yesterday at the Peabody Hotel in Memphis. But he might as well have been. Thomas really should have been standing right behind Dolan. That way the real sport for the reporters watching Dolan and listening to his amazing assessment of the Knicks would have been trying to see if Thomas' lips were moving every time Dolan said something. You can see where we're going with this. If Thomas is the ventriloquist now, what does that make Dolan?

James Dolan sounded yesterday as if he worked for Thomas, not the other way around. Everything Thomas usually says about the Knicks, Dolan said yesterday. Everything Thomas thinks, Dolan now thinks. Maybe it is easier than Dolan thinking for himself. No wonder Knicks fans think the owner of the Garden is more thick than ever on basketball matters. No wonder they will start booing him out of the place when they get tired of doing the same thing with Isiah Thomas.

If Dolan wants to run off Larry Brown, if he wants his 65-year-old coach to think that the Knicks are still going to be in Thomas' rebuilding program when that coach is pushing 70, he is doing some job of that.

"(Thomas') ability to execute (the plan) is what makes me keep faith," Dolan said yesterday.

His fans have no faith in Isiah Thomas, they have no faith in James Dolan, they have no faith that either one of them can ever get things turned around, even with Larry Brown working for them. No faith, no hope.

There is no strategy here, other than the one that involves Thomas' keeping the last big job he will have in the NBA for as long as possible. There is no plan. This thing is over. The last people to know this are Isiah Thomas and James Dolan, his brand new puppet.

"We're going to continue on the strategy," Dolan said. "I believe in the plan. I believe in the strategy. I believe in the guys that are executing it. Maybe people think I'm brain dead because of that and the record. But you know what? Time will tell."

"Brain dead" is his own inelegant choice of words, and much too dramatic for the owner of a sports team on the skids. Dolan just sounded like a sucker yesterday. He kept talking about Glen Sather yesterday, as if there is some kind of sweeping comparison to be made between Sather and Thomas besides the obvious one, that he stayed with Sather through one losing season after another when Sather was spending more money on players than anybody in his sport.

But on what planet does Thomas have the chops as a basketball executive that Sather once had with the Edmonton Oilers? Or the kind of chops that Brown has had as a coach, for that matter? No matter. Dolan now sounds like as much of a groupie for Thomas as he always did for Sather.

And still Thomas is scared silly that he might actually be accountable for the epic mess he has created with the Knicks. No wonder he canceled a European scouting trip (why would he scout Europe, by the way? He has never signed a foreign star and shows no signs of ever signing one, he just likes guys from Chicago) and decided to join Dolan on this road trip to San Antonio and Memphis. Why? Thomas didn't want Dolan to be alone with the coach of the Knicks for three days, because there was at least the chance that once or twice over those three days, Larry Brown might tell James Dolan the truth.

Instead of the truth, we get the Book of Isiah, as told to James Dolan. Of course that's why everything sounded so wooden yesterday at the Peabody Hotel. So wooden, so dumb.

"(My faith) is not necessarily a mistake," Dolan said to the writers at one point. "I know it's hard to take when it's 15-41. To say it's a mistake now is to say that the strategy is wrong. I believe the strategy is right.... It will be wrong if we don't make progress."

Progress? With this group? When? Does he actually think that Knick fans believe this is Year 1 of some long-term blueprint for success? Does he really? There have been a lot of awful caretakers of the Knicks over the years. Never one like this guy.

All those losing seasons with the Rangers before this season. Five losing seasons in a row for the Knicks. If James Dolan believes that the way the Rangers are finally playing is some sort of validation of his management style, he is more of a rank amateur about these things than anybody dreamed, about sports and the Garden and the city in which he operates, than anybody imagined.

He needs to make a change the moment this season ends in April, before the Garden goes dark for the basketball playoffs again. He needs a young guy to come in here, one with no ties to the past, one who can work with Larry Brown. He needs a Cashman or a Theo.

Instead, he stays with Isiah Thomas, says that he gets as much time as he wants, as much money as he needs. They say a great ventriloquist is supposed to be able to create a second personality. At least Isiah is good at that.
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djsunyc
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3/2/2006  8:06 AM
To say it's a mistake now is to say that the strategy is wrong.

no, to say it's a mistake now shows that you're assessing the situation and are pulling out before it gets worse. there's patience that's needed in this business to execute a plan, but that patience should be instilled in first time guys or in proven commodities. none of which isiah belongs to. all these players accumulated, and now a majority of them will be shipped out...that's not a strategy or plan persay. that's doing stuff on the fly and changing strategies mid-stream.
Swishfm3
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3/2/2006  8:09 AM
say what you want about the front office but this is the best course.

I dont care about the spending..
I'm not pleased with ALL of I.Thomas moves
and I don't like the coaching job done thus far.....

but firing the coach or GM every year is not the right way to do things either. Everyone in the sports world is aware of the Knicks situation....firing them or letting them resign is taking the easy way out. Hold them responsible and let the world see what their capable of
djsunyc
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3/2/2006  8:12 AM
Posted by Swishfm3:

say what you want about the front office but this is the best course.

I dont care about the spending..
I'm not pleased with ALL of I.Thomas moves
and I don't like the coaching job done thus far.....

but firing the coach or GM every year is not the right way to do things either. Everyone in the sports world is aware of the Knicks situation....firing them or letting them resign is taking the easy way out. Hold them responsible and let the world see what their capable of

do you not see the TOTAL MISMATCH in coach and players here? lb just got here. all these players were accumulated for alot of money over the past 2 years. now, we have to start moving some of them to fit the coach. that's total mismanagement in my eyes. it's almost like two years wasted b/c the roster overhaul starts again this summer.

patience is what kept layden here for 4-5 years. he had a strategy and dolan stuck with him. that wasn't a smart thing to do.

isiah has sold dolan on the flash but no substance. dolan likes the flash. we all want the substance. dolan has the power, we don't. case closed.
Nalod
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3/2/2006  8:53 AM
I kinda thought Dolan abandoned the Layden plan a bit too early. We were close to "crawling from the wreckage" as the assets were starting to pile up. I know the team sucked and there was nothing positive to point at but we stopped panicing and that was ok.

Likewise we went the complete other direction and to pull back now would be a mistake.

We can move a few players to get larry his team. Its not unsermountable.

maybe its as simple as moving Marbs or buying him out. If that the no. 1 problem!

He can play, and maybe having Francis keeps Marbs humble and competitive.

We are too far along to change the course.

martin
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3/2/2006  10:10 AM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by Swishfm3:

say what you want about the front office but this is the best course.

I dont care about the spending..
I'm not pleased with ALL of I.Thomas moves
and I don't like the coaching job done thus far.....

but firing the coach or GM every year is not the right way to do things either. Everyone in the sports world is aware of the Knicks situation....firing them or letting them resign is taking the easy way out. Hold them responsible and let the world see what their capable of

do you not see the TOTAL MISMATCH in coach and players here? lb just got here. all these players were accumulated for alot of money over the past 2 years. now, we have to start moving some of them to fit the coach. that's total mismanagement in my eyes. it's almost like two years wasted b/c the roster overhaul starts again this summer.

patience is what kept layden here for 4-5 years. he had a strategy and dolan stuck with him. that wasn't a smart thing to do.

isiah has sold dolan on the flash but no substance. dolan likes the flash. we all want the substance. dolan has the power, we don't. case closed.

I don't disagree with you, and I may be trying to fit a solution to what is happening instead of offering the plan that was followed, but what if the plan was to get younger, more athletic, and upgrade the assets while riding Marbury and Houston for as long as they could? And that plan kinda crapped out when Houston went down?

OK, on to plan B. Bring in LB even knowing his style does not fit the roster, but now continue fixing the roster to fit him. Kind of a do-over of sorts, but better than nothing.
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McK1
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3/2/2006  10:13 AM
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
McK1
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3/2/2006  10:20 AM
"There is real hope that Eddy will develop into a league-leading center," Dolan said. "If you watched the second quarter of the San Antonio game he was pretty good. That's Larry's job ... to get him from one quarter to four quarters."

Dolan wants fans to give the Knicks something that he has shown Thomas: patience.

"I always listen to the fans....I just don't necessarily do what they want me to do," Dolan said. "I'm going to stick with it until we stop making progress or until we achieve our goal. One or the other."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/story/396137p-335763c.html

with 10 mill comes the expectation you can turn chicken **** into chicken salad.

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the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
bigbeast
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3/2/2006  10:40 AM
"There is no strategy here, other than the one that involves Thomas' keeping the last big job he will have in the NBA for as long as possible. There is no plan. This thing is over. The last people to know this are Isiah Thomas and James Dolan, his brand new puppet."

I always find it dubious how these self indulging journalist, who are more interested in promoting themselves, and injecting there own ideologies/voices into these newspapers which have become less credible than those supermarket-rags, can make such bold statements as if it were straight from nostrodamus,then when they are proven wrong, they run as far away fromthses statemnets as possible.

I'm not trying to act like I'm fully confident in Isiah/Dolans plan, or lack there of, but when and if this team finally turns the corner, will Lupica dn the rest of these juornalist Man-up and acknowledge that they jumped the gun too soon? Heck no!

2 things will happen. The first group of journalist will catch amnesia, and totally detach themselves from these torid personal digs they are taking at Isiah. (If the team sucks, then report on the play on the court or Isiahs bad trades) No need for these sniping journalist to get as personal as they have turned this into.

The the second group will begrudgingly hold onto the hatred they have of Isiah, and continue to dig and dig until they find more bullet wounds in his cape. For some reason, many memebers of the media (Russo, Lupica) can't stand Isiah and have made it personal from day-one and seemed as if they were rooting for his failure the first day he took the podium and was introduced as the new Team president.

As i stated in another thread, Isiah is building in an unsual way. A way we have never seen before. Peoples forst reaction to anything new is to hate it. If Isiah and Dolan say there is a plan, why can;t we just taked there word for it. Just because Isiah's way of rebuidling doesn't fit the definiton that we all understand the word to be, why must we call him DUMB and incompotent. Let the plan unravel this summer and see the finished product.



[Edited by - bigbeast on 03-02-2006 10:48 AM]
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
djsunyc
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3/2/2006  10:41 AM
lupica expected some good things from this club (i remember some articles from early in the season and during teh 6 game winning streak) and is dissapointed just like all of us.
bigbeast
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3/2/2006  10:49 AM
Posted by bigbeast:

"There is no strategy here, other than the one that involves Thomas' keeping the last big job he will have in the NBA for as long as possible. There is no plan. This thing is over. The last people to know this are Isiah Thomas and James Dolan, his brand new puppet."

I always find it dubious how these self indulging journalist, who are more interested in promoting themselves, and injecting there own ideologies/voices into these newspapers which have become less credible than those supermarket-rags, can make such bold statements as if it were straight from nostrodamus,then when they are proven wrong, they run as far away fromthses statemnets as possible.

I'm not trying to act like I'm fully confident in Isiah/Dolans plan, or lack there of, but when and if this team finally turns the corner, will Lupica dn the rest of these juornalist Man-up and acknowledge that they jumped the gun too soon? Heck no!

2 things will happen. The first group of journalist will catch amnesia, and totally detach themselves from these torid personal digs they are taking at Isiah. (If the team sucks, then report on the play on the court or Isiahs bad trades) No need for these sniping journalist to get as personal as they have turned this into.

The the second group will begrudgingly hold onto the hatred they have of Isiah, and continue to dig and dig until they find more bullet wounds in his cape. For some reason, many memebers of the media (Russo, Lupica) can't stand Isiah and have made it personal from day-one and seemed as if they were rooting for his failure the first day he took the podium and was introduced as the new Team president.

As i stated in another thread, Isiah is building in an unsual way. A way we have never seen before. Peoples forst reaction to anything new is to hate it. If Isiah and Dolan say there is a plan, why can;t we just taked there word for it. Just because Isiah's way of rebuidling doesn't fit the definiton that we all understand the word to be, why must we call him DUMB and incompotent. Let the plan unravel this summer and see the finished product.



[Edited by - bigbeast on 03-02-2006 10:48 AM]

"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
islesfan
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3/2/2006  11:56 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

lupica expected some good things from this club (i remember some articles from early in the season and during teh 6 game winning streak) and is dissapointed just like all of us.

Exactly, Lupica was extremely high on Isiah and where the Knicks were going. It's only recently that Lupica, and most of the media, has harshly criticized Isiah, Dolan and the Knicks. I don't need to rehash why but how else are people going to react to this mess? And it only gets worse when Isiah, Dolan and the rest of the organization continue to treat everybody like complete morons with their nonsensical spin. If you treat people like morons then how do you expect them to treat you?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
isiah's prophet uses both sides of mouth (lupica)

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