I like your thinking, people think that rebuilding is the answer to it all. Rebuilding is a huge risk. And I agree players who are in their 4-5 years would be good, they are still young but not green.We do not need any 19 year old players now. they are just not ready... Dice is only 27, Houston just turned 31, so our core still is not old, especially deyse. I like Jason terry but we have no need for a 6'0 SG... We should develop Frank Williams and try to get guys like Stromile swift, and Lorenzen wright from the Grizz. they are young and Swift has a ton of upside, plus they are expendable with the grizz. I am sorry I also like Q richardson bus so does the clipps, he won't be going anywhere...

Posted by OasisBU:

Reading the last post and thinking about some of the things I have heard - I came to a realization - the players on the Grizz are only there for training. Think about it - which one of them is going to stick around with that club to win a championship? Gasol can bolt when his rookie contract it over and get a nice payday from a winning team. Salary cap might play a role in him staying - but I highly doubt it. They brought in West because they know a team of young players isnt going anywhere. He is gonna make some deals - the question is, can we deal with them, do they want some knicks for some younger talent when they are ripe to be picked? Just a crazy thought, it is 1:40am and I am way too tired to be posting. I am still excited as ever for this season to start though. I dont care what the odds are for us, I will always favor this team through thick and thin - We are serviceable for now and thats a lot more than I can say for a team who was limping with Camby at the helm. I just want to see a larger presence in the middle and then I will be pretty happy. I have a little more faith in Layden these days, he is showing signs of some smarts. Lets wait and see.

I have more faith nowadays in Layden also. We have an owner that's making personell moves who has admitted that he knows nothing about basketball. Also, the retention of Chaney supposedly has to do with Chaney's strong relationship that he has with Dolan. But honestly, Chaney wasn't just "tossed" this job. Chaney was head coach of the year in 92 i think with the Rockets. He coached the Pistons. "tibs" has never been a head coach. Chaney, in all fairness needs a full season to show what his skills are - last season, he honestly stunk it up, but inherited a team in dissarray with severe injuries - Spoon and Camby. And to tell you the truth, the Spoon injury was more critical than the Camby one - because the knicks were solid without Camby (holding around .500) but once spoon went down, everything fell apart. We were using Felton Spencer and Travis Knight for long stretches (or at least until they fouled themselves out).

I agree we should see what Tibs can do, but don't be hasty.

Plus - I have more confidence in Layden and I believe at this point, Layden is doing whatever he can - not to upgrade the Knicks, but to keep his job with the Knicks, and that means doing whatever Dolan says is OK.

Let's see if Frank Williams is any good. Let's see if Postell can bring IT. Lets see if Othella Harrington improves at all. Let's see what the deal is with Doleac - if he's going to break out anytime soon (if not, he's only signed for 3 years). Those guys are all under 25. People talk about the Knicks not having any young players, but we have some young guys, they're just not allstars.

Harrington is a good/great role player.

Postell thinks he has all-star game (he's slightly under richard jefferson on the offensive end, and no defense on the other end).

Frank Williams - supposedly the second best PG from this year's draft. Could be a future contributor - more potential than Charlie Ward - who was solid as a rock until his knees gave out.

Doleac - will have alot expected of him - on the defensive end/rebounding/pick and roll. Let's see if he rises to the occasion or crumbles under the pressure.

and don't forget Milos - who some say could be a better PG prospect than Frank Williams. Milos will be leading team Yugo in the "World's Championship" this year. Let's see if he has game - THEY WILL BE TELEVISED. He's young and poised, and can develop for a few seasons in Europe. Great pick Layden - we don't lose anything by picking this guy, and we have everything to gain. Basically, we have two young PGs in the wings, Frank and Milos - Layden must have realized that getting Baron or Andre Miller were real longshots. And if Milos is any good at the Worlds, we have huge tradebait on our hands, more valuable than anyone on our roster, really.

Scott Layden has the distinction of being the *most hated* sports personality that I can remember in NY Sports going back 25 years. His personell moves have made Al Bianchi look like Red Aurebach. Only a few people may know what type of influence Dolan has over the Knicks but one thing is for sure---he has been able to work with a budget that most GMs would dream about. He came in and moved Patrick Ewing for Glenn rice and scrubbs apparently because he was snookered into the deal by David Falk. Each personell move became worse and worse and was compounded by over paying with long term contracts. Even his supposed specialty--drafting players has been a complete ruse. This team is a mosh posh of a MESS! If Dolan is now making some business decisions it is because Cablevision is staring CHP11 in the face. Dolan is the Layden of the business world--just as disliked by Wall Street. The word shmuck fits both of them very nicely. The Knicks had no problem operating from 1987 through 1999 even with some material changes to management and or coaching positions. Layden has come on and subsequently taken a finals team and molded into a playoff lottery bound loser with no excitement and no future. Now it's gone beyond just a bad team--it's laughingstock of a team in the opinions of the entire NBA and it's fans. You can't go to any spot on the Internet that deals with basketball-- thousands upon thousands of fans and find a different teams fan that doesn't laugh at the Knicks. I'm sorry but that's what NY is not all about. He's turned this team into the anti-newyork with the Mike Doleac's the Travis Knights Howard eisley's andersen and down the line. He would've NEVER EVER EVER traded for Sprewell and he was dumb enough to make a 125,000 dollar fine and some tardiness become public knowledge and thus dropping Sprewell's trade value like CVC stock. Even in the Mcdyess trade the stupidity continued. It is common knowledge that Layden went out seeking a veteran for the draft choice and went from team to team seeing who he could acquire. Even Rod thorn said that the Knicks were inquiring about Mutumbo on draft night. And let's face reality Kiki made a darn good deal considering Antonio was coming off MAJOR surgery and told him he did not plan on coming back to Denver. So why couldn't we force HIS hand a bit? Instead of trading our only center away we couldve satisfied the CBA with Charlie ward and Othella Harrington--ward contract was set to expire in the same time Jackson s was an othella is a good little role player with a nice salary--easy to move both really because thats what Kiki is attemting to do with camby and MJ. Moving camby was dumb because it left us with no athletes upfront. there are a bunch of centers in this league who have fallen prey to Camby's injury bug--it's up to management and the coaching staff to determine if a player should play less minutes and less games to conserve his play for the playoffs like they have basically done with shaq. Well we traded off camby even though we had three 4 s who had a very similar type of play for another 4 who now makes those other guys obsolete. And who do we sign? A 262 pound small forward!

can't wait to see the lineup of Travis Knight at center Mike Doleac at forward Shanden Andersen at the three Lavar at the two and howard stern eilsey at the 1! We like the team And remember we are always looking to improve the team--but you have to be wearing goody two shoes to join our club:>)


It will be a fine day indeed when Cablevision is forced to sell the team!

. We all love the Knicks here--so we all have something in common no matter what walk of life we may be from. I love basketball and although it's big business--from a diehards fan perspective--ANYTHING less than a 100% effort to build a championship contender is just not acceptable to me. Part of what I do for a real job is evaluating many different companies performance. So I have a tendency to bring my expertise into play. My opinion is that the current management team of the Knicks is VERY weak--and they have more to work with than 95% of the other clubs. It is apparent in fact--look at the decline in wins. When you break it down into a business aspect--weak management and losing will effect much more than potential playoff ticket sales-it will effect the enitre MSG unit. If you are an advertiser are you willing to payX amount of dollars for a team that is losing games and viewing audiences? It would be different if the Knicks were losing but had a young marquee player that the town and was excited about the team building around--but the Knicks don't have this. They don't have the exciting blue collar star anymore like a Oakley a Starks- a Johnson. The Knicks made a HUGE HUGE error by making Sprewell's late seasons problems known publicly. Now Sprewell's luster has lost some shine to the fans besides management's open position to move him out of town. Now being a huge basketball fan comes into play--I know this team is awful as currently constructed. I know the coaching of the team is highy suspect. I know the Knicks team lacks speed size and quickness. I know the team lacks a floor general. I know they lack a lane intimidator. And I also know that their new *MAIN* attraction is coming off a major injury and only God knows how long it will take to mesh with other players--or if he even plays up to his old standards. we all hope he does--but that does not remove the FACT that he has never taken a team to the next level--even when surrounded by pretty good teamates. So now you expect a player who has missed an entire season to walk in and propell the Knicks right back into playoff contention? You don't look at a similar story that unfolded at shea with Mo Vaughn? It took him more than half a season to get his timing back.

How do I know what transpired in the talks between Denver and NY. No clue other than what I saw on angles. But I do know that the management did not do full dilligence on this trade and because it was a major--it might just sting them in the bu tt just as hard as their brutal past transactions.

I see the 92 Celtics coming and seven years of bad luck and I just don't think things needed to turn out this way. The Cablevision company moved a REAL weak mangement team into place who now seem to be Yes sir men. So if you ultimately have a terrible GM who is now being lead around by a man who says he has no clue about basketball--what do you think you're ultimately going to get--a CR PPY product and years of losing.


Cheers

Posted by nwny:

Posted by BRIGGS:

Part of what I do for a real job is evaluating many different companies performance. So I have a tendency to bring my expertise into play.

...and all this time I thought your expertise was posting trades that will never happen.

that was not even fair... (ROFL)