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brown may use zone
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Mac
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2/11/2006  1:53 AM
After the game he said that he's been reluctant but may "resort" to using zone defense.

mms://msgvox2.cv.net/msgnetwork.com/02_2006/nyk_coach_post_021006.asf

Just thought I'd throw that out there.
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EnySpree
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2/11/2006  2:04 AM
Resort?

I gotta keep saying it man....Larry Brown has been a joke this year. I mean damn....what the hell is he doing? The team doesn't play defense the way he wants....and I have heard Davis and other players describe the defense as complicated(that is obsurd to me).....now he figures running a zone is an option as a last resort? Kinda too late you senile bas tard.

[Edited by - enyspree on 02-11-2006 02:06 AM]
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holfresh
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2/11/2006  2:18 AM
What a joke!!!
joec32033
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2/11/2006  8:56 AM
I've been suggesting this for YEARS because we haven't been able to man up defense, especially with the players we have now....

We go to Zone I am gonna predict that we get at least 2-3 wins in the next 5 games. That's if we stick to Zone.
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Ira
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2/11/2006  10:00 AM
It's worth trying. Our players can't play man defense. Maybe they'll be better at zone.
jaydh
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2/11/2006  10:05 AM
Posted by EnySpree:

Resort?

I gotta keep saying it man....Larry Brown has been a joke this year. I mean damn....what the hell is he doing? The team doesn't play defense the way he wants....and I have heard Davis and other players describe the defense as complicated(that is obsurd to me).....now he figures running a zone is an option as a last resort? Kinda too late you senile bas tard.

[Edited by - enyspree on 02-11-2006 02:06 AM]


the real joke is our players, and there unwillingness to learn and listen. several have so much potential to be great players and to learn defense but they are just so damn stubborn.
Bippity10
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2/11/2006  10:08 AM
Zone opens up a whole new can of worms, like working to box out and rotating out on shooters. Judging by our lack of commitment to any sort of man to man defense I'm not so positive this will be any different.
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rojasmas
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2/11/2006  11:43 AM
Brown has done a lousy job with this team. Period. Blame the players all you want but good coaches get through. I would give him an F so far this year. What has he done?
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TheSage
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2/11/2006  12:16 PM
A teacher can only teach to the level of the lowest tier student. Even if we assume that Lee and Frye are sufficiently malleable and some of the vets can get it, it doesn't mean some of the others have the mental acuity to absorb the lessons and if the entire team on the court can't do it as a unit the zone doesn't work. As for some of the Larry bashing, I am willing to bet that most of those with negative opinions about LB have an average age less than his years of coaching. You are quick to praise and even quicker to attack.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but before you throw out the negative expletives please set forth your coaching or basketball experience.

[Edited by - TheSage on 02-11-2006 12:17 PM]
EnySpree
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2/11/2006  1:53 PM
Posted by TheSage:

A teacher can only teach to the level of the lowest tier student. Even if we assume that Lee and Frye are sufficiently malleable and some of the vets can get it, it doesn't mean some of the others have the mental acuity to absorb the lessons and if the entire team on the court can't do it as a unit the zone doesn't work. As for some of the Larry bashing, I am willing to bet that most of those with negative opinions about LB have an average age less than his years of coaching. You are quick to praise and even quicker to attack.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but before you throw out the negative expletives please set forth your coaching or basketball experience.

[Edited by - TheSage on 02-11-2006 12:17 PM]



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oohah
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2/11/2006  2:11 PM
A teacher can only teach to the level of the lowest tier student. Even if we assume that Lee and Frye are sufficiently malleable and some of the vets can get it, it doesn't mean some of the others have the mental acuity to absorb the lessons and if the entire team on the court can't do it as a unit the zone doesn't work.

There are only 5 players on the court at once.

As for some of the Larry bashing, I am willing to bet that most of those with negative opinions about LB have an average age less than his years of coaching. You are quick to praise and even quicker to attack.

paraphrase: "You must be 31 or older to criticize LB!" I bet the average age on this board or any other internet board where sports are being discussed are less than LB's coaching experience.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but before you throw out the negative expletives please set forth your coaching or basketball experience.

paraphrase: "LB can only be criticized by those who have as much or more experience than he!" Therefore only Lenny Wilkens, Dean Smith, Don Nelson, Hubie Brown, and John Wooden may criticize him. He may only be praised by the likes of us.

Furthermore, one who has not played point guard in the NBA, may not criticize Marbury. Kobe? When was the last time you scored 81? Kobe may not be criticized by anyone who has not won three Championships and scored 60 3 times and 81 once!

Etc.

oohah



[Edited by - oohah on 02-11-2006 2:12 PM]
Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
rojasmas
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2/11/2006  3:12 PM
Exactly. Real dumb post Sage. So if you don't have coaching experience you can't say Brown is doing a lousy job? Ridiculous. So with that logic, there would be no sportswriters unless they were ex-coaches. And there would be no one to criticize players unless they were ex-players. Flawed argument. Vastly flawed for someone calling themself The Sage. Later.
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rojasmas
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2/11/2006  3:13 PM
Oh yeah, I am 44. Am I old enough to have an opinion?
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TheSage
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2/11/2006  5:23 PM
rojasmas and oohah -learn to read before you attack. you are both combining separate thoughts. Feeling self conscious are we?

The youth portion is obvious from the posting. The experience portion is separate and apart. Off the top -a Larry Frank or an Eric Mangini may be young but have the experience to criticize or opine in their respetive sports.

[Edited by - TheSage on 02-11-2006 5:27 PM]
rojasmas
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2/11/2006  5:36 PM
Sage, what is there to screw up? You said the posters are mostly young and know nothing about coaching. Don't try to backpedal and clean it up now. Revisit your exact quote and get back to me.
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oohah
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2/11/2006  6:04 PM
rojasmas and oohah -learn to read before you attack. you are both combining separate thoughts. Feeling self conscious are we?

I am not feeling self concious at all. Nor did I attack you.

I do find your "points" amusing, and your attempt at reverse psychology is humorous as well.

Please point out where I misread or misinterpreted what you wrote, if you can.

The youth portion is obvious from the posting.

I don't know exactly which posts you are writing about. Is every post that criticizes LB written by a callow youth?

The experience portion is separate and apart. Off the top -a Larry Frank or an Eric Mangini may be young but have the experience to criticize or opine in their respetive sports.

So are you qualified to opine about basketball? Please set forth your coaching or basketball experience. By your own criteria I'll bet the answer is no. Or are you only qualified to judge the quality of another's opinion?

It is funny when the only argument one can bring is: "Well LB, has been coaching a long time so he knows more than you."

I have a better idea: Watch the games and make a judgement for yourself. You might find it liberating.

If you think that LB is doing a good job, well I can't help that.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
OldFan
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2/11/2006  10:57 PM
Posted by oohah:
rojasmas and oohah -learn to read before you attack. you are both combining separate thoughts. Feeling self conscious are we?

I am not feeling self concious at all. Nor did I attack you.

I do find your "points" amusing, and your attempt at reverse psychology is humorous as well.

Please point out where I misread or misinterpreted what you wrote, if you can.

The youth portion is obvious from the posting.

I don't know exactly which posts you are writing about. Is every post that criticizes LB written by a callow youth?

The experience portion is separate and apart. Off the top -a Larry Frank or an Eric Mangini may be young but have the experience to criticize or opine in their respetive sports.

So are you qualified to opine about basketball? Please set forth your coaching or basketball experience. By your own criteria I'll bet the answer is no. Or are you only qualified to judge the quality of another's opinion?

It is funny when the only argument one can bring is: "Well LB, has been coaching a long time so he knows more than you."

I have a better idea: Watch the games and make a judgement for yourself. You might find it liberating.

If you think that LB is doing a good job, well I can't help that.

oohah


I don't think you can give LB a total pass because of his history. But I also don't think you can totally discount it.

If I'veworked with a guy at a previous company, the guy has an excellent resume, comes highly recommended by almost everyone I know in the profession, and has shown in his interview that he has excellent knowledge and he becomes project lead for a number of guys who have no professional experience and others who have pretty poor histories, when the team gets off to a bad start do I figure that maybe it had more to do with the team then the project lead - yes.
oohah
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2/11/2006  11:37 PM
I don't think you can give LB a total pass because of his history. But I also don't think you can totally discount it.

To me it is not about LB's history one way or the other. I am simply make a judgement on what I am observing this season.

If I'veworked with a guy at a previous company, the guy has an excellent resume, comes highly recommended by almost everyone I know in the profession, and has shown in his interview that he has excellent knowledge and he becomes project lead for a number of guys who have no professional experience and others who have pretty poor histories, when the team gets off to a bad start do I figure that maybe it had more to do with the team then the project lead - yes.

To use the same analogy: What if that project had some hotshots on the team albeit for the most part unproven. But you noticed during the project that they are repeatedly being given tasks that are not where their particular expertise and talent is strong.

Then at the same time your project lead/Project manager with an excellent history is making decisions that are baffling and seemingly contrary to a successful outcome. And when he/she discusses the team, the team is spoken of very poorly and in a disrespectful way, from the very begining.

What would you think then? Here what I would think: That despite his/her magnificent history, the project lead is not doing so well on this particular project.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
djsunyc
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2/11/2006  11:46 PM
but what if every project this lead/manager takes control over, turns to gold. all he asks for is some different people to work underneath him. it may take a few more weeks to find the right guys but since there's no deadline, let him get his guys in here so he can turn this project into gold also?

what comes first, the chicken or the egg?

do you bring in a proven coach and cater to his demands or do you bring in a coach to cater the players already here?

which one will yield sustained winning and eventually building towards a championship?

who's judgement and decision making capabilities do you believe in?

what responsiblity is it of the guy in charge of marrying these two entities?

the answer to those questions decides who's to blame in this situation.
joec32033
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2/11/2006  11:54 PM
Simple version......

The coach needs players who can play a certain brand of ball and the coach needs to have the flexibility to tweak his philosophy..

The players need a coach who can put them in the best position to win, but the players need to be willing to be coached in overall strategy.

With 30 something losses BEFORE the all-star break I think there is plenty of blame to go around for everyone, but if I had to take sides, I bunker with LB...there are certain players who don't want to change and these players are the ones we NEED to change.

On a side note, my brother thinks LB is a horrible coach and he is absolutely dreadful while the players share a minimum amount of the blame because Larry's strategy doesn't fit them...

As DJ said.....the chicken or the egg?

But as I see it the real question is why do we park on driveways and drive on parkways?
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