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JimmyV
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1/27/2006  11:32 AM
Wassup?

I'm JimmyV, a long time fan of the NY Knicks. First time posting here, but have been around enjoying guys' opinions for a while now. I like this site. It's nice to be participating in the discussion on knicks matters.

I guess its common trend in many forums where posters are labeled as either koolaid drinkers or haters. I don't care for this labelling cuz we are all Knicks supporters. Come on, where's the love? It's just that we differ on our approach to building teams. Me? I'm utterly disgusted with the current state of this Knick franchise. Who wouldn't be... Like sir charles says, "Ewing, Oakley, and Stark are rolling in their graves!" It's been what? over 5 yrs of never ending misery for us Knicks fans. What do I want? I want to see a blueprint of what the team is going to do to make this team a contender again. Cuz we're in shaithouse. Having traded away several of our future picks, we pretty much put all our eggs in one basket called "Marbury & the youth" experiment. If this doesn't pan out (or Curry's heart issue come back to bite him in his big arse), we're screwed. I love the fact the we got youth who have enough skills to earn PT, and I commend Isiah for that. But I want to know what Isiah is planning on doing from now on. We're investing so much financially, emotionally, time-wise, relationship-wise, etc on this team, and as a fan base, we deserve to know what this franchise is trying to do both in the short & long-term.

So Isiah, show us the light. I mean this is the team you created. No more blaming Mr. Layden. Yep, we got some good players, but we got no chemistry and this team isn't being a team. We got no asset to trade except for the youth which you refuse to part with. So you gonna insist on riding out the storm as is and hope for the best? We're in the dark here. Where we heading, Mr. GM? Cus this shait of an act where you disappear during tough times is getting old. Come on out and let us know what you're thinking about the team NOW, and your plans for the FUTURE.

So am I a hater, cuz I'm fed up?

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:34 AM]

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:36 AM]
AUTOADVERT
Nalod
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1/27/2006  11:37 AM
a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.
Marv
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1/27/2006  11:42 AM
Jimmy, I'm smelling hater all over you but I'll give you a break since it's your first shot and I'll put you somewhere in the middle:



Btw I like your thread title. We can always use guys who can maintain a perverse sense of humor under duress.
martin
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1/27/2006  11:43 AM
welcome jimmyV
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JimmyV
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1/27/2006  11:46 AM
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

So in your model, the future of this franchise rests on the shoulders of Curry, Frye, Nate, Q2, Crawford, Ariza, Butler. Hmmmmm... One thing these guys lack so badly is DEFENSE. Just so that I can be comforted, give me some names of players who turned from bad defensive players into good ones over time.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  11:48 AM
Posted by Marv:

Jimmy, I'm smelling hater all over you but I'll give you a break since it's your first shot and I'll put you somewhere in the middle:



Btw I like your thread title. We can always use guys who can maintain a perverse sense of humor under duress.


Thanks, Marv. What are you? Isiah-lover?
islesfan
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1/27/2006  11:50 AM
Welcome Jimmy, you seem like a right thinking level headed God fearing Knicks fan. We could use more of your kind around here.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Bonn1997
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1/27/2006  12:03 PM
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]
Welcome aboard! I wouldn't pay so much attention to what any GM says to the media. What better way for a GM to drive up their trade value than to make it look like he's interested in keeping them? Conversely, if he told the media he'd have no concerns about trading our youth, it would drive down their trae value.



[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-27-2006 12:04 PM]
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  12:14 PM
Posted by islesfan:

Welcome Jimmy, you seem like a right thinking level headed God fearing Knicks fan. We could use more of your kind around here.


As the head honcho of the Isiah-haters, are you going to take me under your wing?
islesfan
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1/27/2006  12:17 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]
Welcome aboard! I wouldn't pay so much attention to what any GM says to the media. [Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-27-2006 12:04 PM]

Yes, don't believe Isiah for a second when he tells the media that he didn't sexually harrass anybody and didn't call them a "bitch".
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Nalod
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1/27/2006  12:19 PM
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

So in your model, the future of this franchise rests on the shoulders of Curry, Frye, Nate, Q2, Crawford, Ariza, Butler. Hmmmmm... One thing these guys lack so badly is DEFENSE. Just so that I can be comforted, give me some names of players who turned from bad defensive players into good ones over time.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]


Good point, But im not that intuned with the NBA to list players who became good from bad. Thus, no comfort! Defense is an attitude and teams can become better at it when its given a priority. I think many players on good defensive teams improve when embeded in a defensive culture.

Thats the best I can do. But Change for the sake of change does not always equate improvement. I don't have the answers you seek.
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  12:19 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]
Welcome aboard! I wouldn't pay so much attention to what any GM says to the media. What better way for a GM to drive up their trade value than to make it look like he's interested in keeping them? Conversely, if he told the media he'd have no concerns about trading our youth, it would drive down their trae value.



[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-27-2006 12:04 PM]

Yeah, I know. McHale was saying 2 days ago that he was not trading his players. Then the next day he sent 3 players packing. What I don't get is the fact that Isiah didn't go after Artest. He's nuts, but he's good.
islesfan
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1/27/2006  12:21 PM
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by islesfan:

Welcome Jimmy, you seem like a right thinking level headed God fearing Knicks fan. We could use more of your kind around here.


As the head honcho of the Isiah-haters, are you going to take me under your wing?

Well first you have to be baptised into our group.

Do you reject Isiah?

Do you reject Isiah and all his works, including signing Big Stiff for 5 years and trading away 4 lottery picks?
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Bonn1997
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1/27/2006  12:27 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]
Welcome aboard! I wouldn't pay so much attention to what any GM says to the media. [Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-27-2006 12:04 PM]

Yes, don't believe Isiah for a second when he tells the media that he didn't sexually harrass anybody and didn't call them a "bitch".
I don't take that at face value either. I have no opinion one way or the other about the sexual harrassment suit other than that you're innocent until proven guilty. How did you manage to even get this topic into this thread? Are you gonna throw it into every thread?
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  12:31 PM
Posted by Nalod:
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by Nalod:

a fan running out of patience. Like most of us!

Maybe the future is just letting the kids play it thru and get better from within. That takes some imagination. Some will disappoint, others will suprise! IT happens.

We have a lot of upside here, but we tend to wish trades are the answer.

I guess that's the only realistic course of action unless we trade the expring contracts for some players past expiry dates (Jalen, Ratliff) and picks since Isiah says youth are off-limits.

So in your model, the future of this franchise rests on the shoulders of Curry, Frye, Nate, Q2, Crawford, Ariza, Butler. Hmmmmm... One thing these guys lack so badly is DEFENSE. Just so that I can be comforted, give me some names of players who turned from bad defensive players into good ones over time.

[Edited by - JimmyV on 01-27-2006 11:49 AM]


Good point, But im not that intuned with the NBA to list players who became good from bad. Thus, no comfort! Defense is an attitude and teams can become better at it when its given a priority. I think many players on good defensive teams improve when embeded in a defensive culture.

Thats the best I can do. But Change for the sake of change does not always equate improvement. I don't have the answers you seek.

No comfort?! Thanks, man.
But I agree with what you're saying. Defense is an attitude - desire, pride, etc. Unless you're slow footed or too weak, if you have the competitive nature and the desire to play 100% on both ends of the court, you'll likely get better. The defensive culture will be created as long as Larry is in charge. Do the youth have the mental drive to become solid defensively? Who knows. We shall see. I wanna see the return of the Ewing-Oak-Starks Knicks toughness.
attaboy2005
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1/27/2006  12:35 PM
Welcome, Jimmy V!

Don't pay attention to anyone who labels people as haters when they don't even know someone, it's called pre-judgment syndrome, they just love to put people in certain catergories because they have nothing better to do.
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  12:44 PM
Posted by islesfan:
Posted by JimmyV:
Posted by islesfan:

Welcome Jimmy, you seem like a right thinking level headed God fearing Knicks fan. We could use more of your kind around here.


As the head honcho of the Isiah-haters, are you going to take me under your wing?

Well first you have to be baptised into our group.

Do you reject Isiah?

Do you reject Isiah and all his works, including signing Big Stiff for 5 years and trading away 4 lottery picks?

LOL!
I loved Isiah as a player. Man, he was awesome! but as a GM... nope.

I was an advocate of rebuilding since the end of Ewing era. I believe in drafts, cap space, defense, rebounding, and feeding the post. I'm an oldschool kind. So, it's been tough.

You're not gonna cut my foreskin, are you?
joec32033
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1/27/2006  12:53 PM
Posted by islesfan:

Welcome Jimmy, you seem like a right thinking level headed God fearing Knicks fan. We could use more of your kind around here.

Yup...that seals it...if isles likes you we are in for some trouble.....

~You can't run from who you are.~
JimmyV
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1/27/2006  12:53 PM
Posted by attaboy2005:

Welcome, Jimmy V!

Don't pay attention to anyone who labels people as haters when they don't even know someone, it's called pre-judgment syndrome, they just love to put people in certain catergories because they have nothing better to do.

I know. When someone labels me as whatever without knowing me, I say to myself - "I'm good enough, I'm smart enough......."
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