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looks like babc ck will be fired in toronto at 2pm
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djsunyc
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1/26/2006  1:15 PM
can we capitalize in a salary dump?
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martin
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1/26/2006  1:16 PM
maybe they want Zeke back. ba-dum-bum.

Wow, bad joke.
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TymeLessKnicks
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1/26/2006  1:18 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

can we capitalize in a salary dump?


i definately feel a trade coming...my trader sense is tingling!!!!
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attaboy2005
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1/26/2006  1:27 PM
The Toronto Raptors have scheduled a 2 p.m. news conference for this afternoon where it is anticipated they will announce the firing of general manager Rob Babcock.

In just the second year of his contract, Babcock has been the focus of plenty of speculation about his job security following a number of questionable moves and decisions during his brief tenure.

The Raptors, having just returned from a 1-4 west coast National Basketball Association road trip, looked lethargic last night in a 104-88 loss last night to the Chicago Bulls at the Air Canada Centre before a sparse gathering of 14,198 fans.

The loss, Toronto's third in a row, dropped the Raptors record to 14-29 on the season, one of the worst marks in the NBA.

In Babcock's first year in Toronto last year he was roundly criticized for the signing of volatile point guard Rafer Alson and for receiving next to nothing in return for the trade involving franshise star Vince Carter. The Raptors struggled to finish with a 33-49 record, missing the playoffs for the third consecutive season.

He's also faced significant criticism for the selection of centre Rafael Araujo with the No. 8 pick in the 2005 NBA draft. Araujo has struggled in his first two season.
Bonn1997
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1/26/2006  1:37 PM
I actually didn't think he did that bad a job over the past 2 years. I'm giving him a pass on Araujo because he was GM for about a week before the draft and didn't have a reasonable amount of time to assess the players. I thought Charlie V was a risky and good pick. and the Mike James trade was an excellent one.
Bonn1997
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1/26/2006  1:38 PM
They probably won't be doing the Jalen Rose, Mike James, Den pick for Penny trade right now. Maybe a new GM will make an offer because he'll want cap room this offseason.
djsunyc
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1/26/2006  1:43 PM
vince carter trade was pretty bad.
fishmike
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1/26/2006  1:55 PM
what we need is someone looking to sell their franchise and go into sick cost cutting mode
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MsBklynStyle
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1/26/2006  2:09 PM
I was hoping Zeke would be the first one to go.
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Mac
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1/26/2006  2:38 PM
I wonder if this means that a trade will be brewing... IT took over and almost immediately traded for Marbs.
Bonn1997
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1/26/2006  3:30 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

vince carter trade was pretty bad.
Yeah, I wasn't thinking about that, actually. That was a horrible trade--FAR worse than anything Isiah has ever done. They basically traded a top 5 MVP candidate last year for Joey Graham and pick #20 this year (Denver's pick).

[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-26-2006 3:30 PM]
fishmike
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1/26/2006  3:32 PM
Isiah has one bullet left. Penny/AD and some of the kids. Chad Ford says he will trade, so it must be true
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Killa4luv
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1/26/2006  4:15 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

I actually didn't think he did that bad a job over the past 2 years. I'm giving him a pass on Araujo because he was GM for about a week before the draft and didn't have a reasonable amount of time to assess the players. I thought Charlie V was a risky and good pick. and the Mike James trade was an excellent one.

I agree.

But they gave away Vince for table scraps. Vince is a top 20 talent in the NBA. No way they should get Eric Wiliiams, Zo, and a $100 gift certificate to Old Navy for him.
SlimPack
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1/26/2006  5:31 PM
well the raptors are ahead of the knicks in the standings right now, so........ I cant see how zeke's job is all that secure.

[Edited by - slimpack on 01-26-2006 5:33 PM]
Bonn1997
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1/26/2006  5:55 PM
Posted by SlimPack:

well the raptors are ahead of the knicks in the standings right now, so........ I cant see how zeke's job is all that secure.

[Edited by - slimpack on 01-26-2006 5:33 PM]
GMs are (or at least should be) fired based on their long-term plan, not fluctuations in the standings. Layden got SEVERAL years to attempt to carry out his plan. I expect Isiah will get the same.

SlimPack
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1/26/2006  8:24 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by SlimPack:

well the raptors are ahead of the knicks in the standings right now, so........ I cant see how zeke's job is all that secure.

[Edited by - slimpack on 01-26-2006 5:33 PM]
GMs are (or at least should be) fired based on their long-term plan, not fluctuations in the standings. Layden got SEVERAL years to attempt to carry out his plan. I expect Isiah will get the same.

is it really a fluctuation?, the raptors have been a consistently better team than us all season long except when we went on the 6 game winning streak. but anyway whether or not isiah should be fired now or not, if the he were being judged with the same standard babcock was he'd be fire by now too. hey bonn I have a question for you, if we wind up giving up a top 5 pick to chicago this season should IT get fired then?

[Edited by - slimpack on 01-26-2006 8:27 PM]
Bonn1997
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1/26/2006  8:34 PM
I don't get the question. Should Jerry West have been fired when the Grizzlies gave up the #2 pick? No, he was beginning to develop a good young team that hadn't yet learned how to win and still had significant wholes. NOt too much later they won 50. Isiah should be fired if after 4 years his plan is still not working. Same with any GM. If you didn't think someone was smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you shouldn't have hired them. If you did think they were smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you give them the 4 years you hired them for. If you hired them hoping for a 2 year plan, you had no idea how long it takes to turn around a bad lottery team.


[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-26-2006 8:37 PM]
SlimPack
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1/26/2006  9:07 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

I don't get the question. Should Jerry West have been fired when the Grizzlies gave up the #2 pick? No, he was beginning to develop a good young team that hadn't yet learned how to win and still had significant wholes. NOt too much later they won 50. Isiah should be fired if after 4 years his plan is still not working. Same with any GM. If you didn't think someone was smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you shouldn't have hired them. If you did think they were smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you give them the 4 years you hired them for. If you hired them hoping for a 2 year plan, you had no idea how long it takes to turn around a bad lottery team.


[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-26-2006 8:37 PM]

yeah but isiah thomas has changed plans, so do we give him a new 4 years? if his plan is to win with the young players than that will take 3 or 4 more seasons. the memphis example i guess makes sense, but I sure wish I knew why they traded that pick, becuase I dont know if it's the same situation. oh well they lucked out becuase detroit wasted that pick on darko, I can only hope that paxson makes a similar mistake. In the event that it happens, especially since we are in the same conference.

[Edited by - slimpack on 01-26-2006 9:08 PM]
McK1
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1/26/2006  9:19 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

I don't get the question. Should Jerry West have been fired when the Grizzlies gave up the #2 pick? No, he was beginning to develop a good young team that hadn't yet learned how to win and still had significant wholes. NOt too much later they won 50. Isiah should be fired if after 4 years his plan is still not working. Same with any GM. If you didn't think someone was smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you shouldn't have hired them. If you did think they were smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you give them the 4 years you hired them for. If you hired them hoping for a 2 year plan, you had no idea how long it takes to turn around a bad lottery team.


[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-26-2006 8:37 PM]

Jerry West didn't make that trade. People who try and compare Zeke to West please get your facts straight.

Prior to the 02-03 season, West was in LA as a personnel exec of the 3-peat Lakers.

Otis Thorpe was traded to the Griz by Detroit prior to the 97-98 season.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/otis_thorpe/
[Edited by - McK1 on 01-26-2006 9:20 PM]

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-26-2006 9:26 PM]
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
SlimPack
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1/26/2006  9:49 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by Bonn1997:

I don't get the question. Should Jerry West have been fired when the Grizzlies gave up the #2 pick? No, he was beginning to develop a good young team that hadn't yet learned how to win and still had significant wholes. NOt too much later they won 50. Isiah should be fired if after 4 years his plan is still not working. Same with any GM. If you didn't think someone was smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you shouldn't have hired them. If you did think they were smart enough to develop a 4 year plan, you give them the 4 years you hired them for. If you hired them hoping for a 2 year plan, you had no idea how long it takes to turn around a bad lottery team.


[Edited by - Bonn1997 on 01-26-2006 8:37 PM]

Jerry West didn't make that trade. People who try and compare Zeke to West please get your facts straight.

Prior to the 02-03 season, West was in LA as a personnel exec of the 3-peat Lakers.

Otis Thorpe was traded to the Griz by Detroit prior to the 97-98 season.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/otis_thorpe/
[Edited by - McK1 on 01-26-2006 9:20 PM]

[Edited by - McK1 on 01-26-2006 9:26 PM]

wow mck1 did you know all of that off the top of your head or did you have to look it up? well even though what bonn says makes sense I still think that he is being to patient with isiah. what bonn said about waiting 4 years is logical becuase obviously no one would be able to turn the crap that layden left into a winning team overnight. but the reason I think isiah should be fired before then is becuase is is clear, to me at least, that he wont be able to turn this team into a winning team at the rate that he is going now within four years. the reason why I think this is is becuase isiah constantly makes "win now" moves and "win later" moves at the same time and I dont think this team will ever prosper that way. but I suppose there is a small chance that IT's moves will start to work within the next two seasons, so maybe letting him stay is the fair thing to do. I dont know anymore, all I know is watching this knicks team sickens me
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looks like babc ck will be fired in toronto at 2pm
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