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the pulse of the board - how many people want to keep marbury?
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djsunyc
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12/18/2005  3:11 PM
i've voiced, AD NASEUM, about why we should move steph and turn the page already but i'm just curious to see how many people agree with that and how many still believe that we can turn this around WITH marbury. there are valid arguments for both sides but i'm curious to see who falls where.
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nykshaknbake
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12/18/2005  3:14 PM
I don't think the question is whether to keep him or not. Everyone is movable for the right price. I think we need to get someone of taking up the scoring slack if we do move him. Getting a back-up point for him is Layden like and if we were to do that(Isiah would never) we could expect lots of double digit blowouts even when the team does gel.
BlueSeats
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12/18/2005  3:27 PM
The sooner we get that mope queen outta here the better.
martin
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12/18/2005  3:29 PM
If LB can make a PG out of Craw, then no. If you can get an all-star SG in return, yes. If you can get an all-star SF in return, yes.
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nyk4ever
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12/18/2005  3:33 PM
Posted by martin:

If LB can make a PG out of Craw, then no. If you can get an all-star SG in return, yes. If you can get an all-star SF in return, yes.

I second what Martin said.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
SlimPack
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12/18/2005  3:40 PM
I actually think the knicks play better when crawford is at the point.
jaydh
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12/18/2005  3:47 PM
i love marbury and have been one of his biggest supporters. Although, i'm getting to the point(no pun intended) where i wouldnt mind seeing him gone. My only problem is, what could we possibly get in return that makes it worth moving him for. What teams would take a chance on marbury?
Bonn1997
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12/18/2005  3:50 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by martin:

If LB can make a PG out of Craw, then no. If you can get an all-star SG in return, yes. If you can get an all-star SF in return, yes.

I second what Martin said.
For the most part, I'd agree with it. I've long given up on any hope of Crawford being a full-time PG, but I agree with Martin's latter two sentences. I'd trade Marbury for a younger near all-star SG or SF, though of Josh Howard's calibre; it doesn't have to be an all-star.

attaboy2005
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12/18/2005  3:52 PM
I say send him on his way, to a team that he can be the leader, and do whatever he wants, because I wanna see how this team flourishes after he is gone, just like NJ and Phoenix.
SlimPack
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12/18/2005  4:21 PM
Posted by attaboy2005:

I say send him on his way, to a team that he can be the leader, and do whatever he wants, because I wanna see how this team flourishes after he is gone, just like NJ and Phoenix.

if only it were that simple, we dont exactly have a jason kidd or steve nash to acquire after marbury is traded. I wouldnt trade marbury unless I was sure the knicks could be better without him. I have a theory that the knicks would be better off with a PG that has PG skills, but maybe Im wrong. Since crawford doesnt play the PG spot on a consistent basis I cant be sure that he couldnt do so well consistently but if I had to guess whether or not Crawford could be a consistently good PG I would guess no.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:28 PM]
PhilinLA
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12/18/2005  4:28 PM
keep him, we can't get value. Brown needs to grow up.
http://amonthhoffundays.blogspot.com/ We got a ringer.
SlimPack
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12/18/2005  4:36 PM
oh yeah and as blueseats pointed out, Another reason to consider trading marbury would be if his on court demeanor becomes so negative that it may actually start hurting the team. As of right now I think that there is a distinct possibility that it might

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:37 PM]
bobs3304
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12/18/2005  4:40 PM
Well, for one, Marbs is a pretty hesitant 3-point shooter. That hurts in the long run b/c when Curry/Frye kick it back out all he'll do is fake the shot and drive, which is utterly pointless in that situation. Hell, if Jason Kidd can learn to hit it, then Steph should.

2nd, there's only so many scorers we're gonna need in the backcourt with Frye and Curry set to become our offensive targets in the future. Having a juggernaut froncourt is always better than having a juggernaut backcourt. And they're only 22....they WILL get better.

Third, since we are "rebuilding", it would be nice to have some cap flexability in the future. Trading Steph for cap space would allow us to clear out alot of salary, and try to normalize the situation.

DLee is the best thing to happen to NY in Isiah's 4 year tenure. And that alone, though a positive on the radar, is sad as hell.
SlimPack
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12/18/2005  4:47 PM
Posted by bobs3304:

Well, for one, Marbs is a pretty hesitant 3-point shooter. That hurts in the long run b/c when Curry/Frye kick it back out all he'll do is fake the shot and drive, which is utterly pointless in that situation. Hell, if Jason Kidd can learn to hit it, then Steph should.

2nd, there's only so many scorers we're gonna need in the backcourt with Frye and Curry set to become our offensive targets in the future. Having a juggernaut froncourt is always better than having a juggernaut backcourt. And they're only 22....they WILL get better.

Third, since we are "rebuilding", it would be nice to have some cap flexability in the future. Trading Steph for cap space would allow us to clear out alot of salary, and try to normalize the situation.

unfortunately the grim reality is that the knicks receive so little bang for their buck, that the knicks wont have a chance of getting cap flexibility until 09/10, when marbury's contract expires, even if they trade marbury for exprings before then.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:54 PM]
Bobby
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12/18/2005  4:50 PM
well, well, well...brown can't go to war with star because larry is at war with star so now the question is star a keeper?.....please! what the heck we paying brown 10 mil for? 10 million excuses?
"Like they always say, New York is the Mecca of basketball,"I read that in Michael Jordan books my whole life and I played here in the Big East tournament, so it's always fun to play in the Mecca of basketball."---Rip Hamilton
jaydh
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12/18/2005  5:09 PM
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by bobs3304:

Well, for one, Marbs is a pretty hesitant 3-point shooter. That hurts in the long run b/c when Curry/Frye kick it back out all he'll do is fake the shot and drive, which is utterly pointless in that situation. Hell, if Jason Kidd can learn to hit it, then Steph should.

2nd, there's only so many scorers we're gonna need in the backcourt with Frye and Curry set to become our offensive targets in the future. Having a juggernaut froncourt is always better than having a juggernaut backcourt. And they're only 22....they WILL get better.

Third, since we are "rebuilding", it would be nice to have some cap flexability in the future. Trading Steph for cap space would allow us to clear out alot of salary, and try to normalize the situation.

unfortunately the grim reality is that the knicks receive so little bang for their buck, that the knicks wont have a chance of getting cap flexibility until 09/10, when marbury's contract expires, even if they trade marbury for exprings before then.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:54 PM]

in order to have capspace for the 07/08 season, we would have to unload marbs and 2 of these contracts(qrich,jc,rose,james). Thats also, with letting AD and Penny come off the books. Its not conceivable to be under the cap until Houstons contract comes off the books.
SlimPack
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12/18/2005  5:50 PM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by bobs3304:

Well, for one, Marbs is a pretty hesitant 3-point shooter. That hurts in the long run b/c when Curry/Frye kick it back out all he'll do is fake the shot and drive, which is utterly pointless in that situation. Hell, if Jason Kidd can learn to hit it, then Steph should.

2nd, there's only so many scorers we're gonna need in the backcourt with Frye and Curry set to become our offensive targets in the future. Having a juggernaut froncourt is always better than having a juggernaut backcourt. And they're only 22....they WILL get better.

Third, since we are "rebuilding", it would be nice to have some cap flexability in the future. Trading Steph for cap space would allow us to clear out alot of salary, and try to normalize the situation.

unfortunately the grim reality is that the knicks receive so little bang for their buck, that the knicks wont have a chance of getting cap flexibility until 09/10, when marbury's contract expires, even if they trade marbury for exprings before then.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:54 PM]

in order to have capspace for the 07/08 season, we would have to unload marbs and 2 of these contracts(qrich,jc,rose,james). Thats also, with letting AD and Penny come off the books. Its not conceivable to be under the cap until Houstons contract comes off the books.

well in order to make an even half decent play of the 07/08 free agent market, we would have to refrain from any FA signings using the MLE next offseason, abandon ariza, butler, and woods, and trade q, craw, rose, marbury and james for expirings. the problem is no one would trade expirings for james, rose, and q unless we coupled them with our young cheap players. when you consider the fact that we have no 1st round draft picks for this and next season, trading all of our valuable players for expirings in order to sign a mediocre 07/08 FA would be a bad move anyway. were better off just letting our young guys develop and upgrading the roster so long as doing so doesnt mean adding a long contract.







[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 6:07 PM]

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 6:09 PM]
attaboy2005
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12/18/2005  5:58 PM
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by attaboy2005:

I say send him on his way, to a team that he can be the leader, and do whatever he wants, because I wanna see how this team flourishes after he is gone, just like NJ and Phoenix.

if only it were that simple, we dont exactly have a jason kidd or steve nash to acquire after marbury is traded. I wouldnt trade marbury unless I was sure the knicks could be better without him. I have a theory that the knicks would be better off with a PG that has PG skills, but maybe Im wrong. Since crawford doesnt play the PG spot on a consistent basis I cant be sure that he couldnt do so well consistently but if I had to guess whether or not Crawford could be a consistently good PG I would guess no.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:28 PM]

I don't really care what we get for Marbury, at this time, as long as we get rid of the Maestro of Mope, I'd be happy!

Believe me we would be better without him, if FW had any of the potential he was hyped to have, I would go out on the limb to say he would be a PG that LB would like, so my point is we can do well with a PG that doesn't have to be a Star, just a Good PG who could run the offense that LB wants.


[Edited by - attaboy2005 on 12-18-2005 5:59 PM]
EwingsGlass
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12/18/2005  6:07 PM
dump him.
You know I gonna spin wit it
jaydh
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12/18/2005  6:13 PM
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by bobs3304:

Well, for one, Marbs is a pretty hesitant 3-point shooter. That hurts in the long run b/c when Curry/Frye kick it back out all he'll do is fake the shot and drive, which is utterly pointless in that situation. Hell, if Jason Kidd can learn to hit it, then Steph should.

2nd, there's only so many scorers we're gonna need in the backcourt with Frye and Curry set to become our offensive targets in the future. Having a juggernaut froncourt is always better than having a juggernaut backcourt. And they're only 22....they WILL get better.

Third, since we are "rebuilding", it would be nice to have some cap flexability in the future. Trading Steph for cap space would allow us to clear out alot of salary, and try to normalize the situation.

unfortunately the grim reality is that the knicks receive so little bang for their buck, that the knicks wont have a chance of getting cap flexibility until 09/10, when marbury's contract expires, even if they trade marbury for exprings before then.

[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 4:54 PM]

in order to have capspace for the 07/08 season, we would have to unload marbs and 2 of these contracts(qrich,jc,rose,james). Thats also, with letting AD and Penny come off the books. Its not conceivable to be under the cap until Houstons contract comes off the books.

well in order to make an even half decent play of the 07/08 free agent market, we would have to refrain from any FA signings using the MLE next offseason, abandon ariza, butler, and woods, and trade q, craw, rose, marbury and james for expirings. the problem is no one would trade expirings for james, rose, q and craw. when you add that to the fact that we have no 1st round draft picks for this and next season, trading all of our valuable players for expirings in order to sign a mediocre 07/08 FA would be a bad move anyway. were better off just letting our young guys develop and upgrading the roster so long as doing so doesnt mean adding a long contract.





[Edited by - SlimPack on 12-18-2005 6:02 PM]

thats not true at all. if marbs&qrich(for example) were unloaded for ending deals, AD expires, Penny expires, that leaves us at around 35mil in 07/08(not including whatever we give to ariza and butler). It could leave us with around 8-10mil to sign someone. This is the year AH, SA, and JYD all come off the books as well.

[Edited by - jaydh on 12-18-2005 6:13 PM]
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the pulse of the board - how many people want to keep marbury?
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