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djsunyc's quick hits on the game (@golden state)
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djsunyc
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11/12/2005  9:17 AM
what's the word that sums up that game for me...ENCOURAGING. why?

- we saw lb lift his reigns from his guards. steph and jamal were allowed to play a little looser and the offense really started with the guards instead of dumping it down and watching what happens. we played a little more looser and fluid in the 1st half MAINLY b/c we played crawford at the point alot of it. marbury did a good job but the ball movement started with crawford in the 1st half. the outlets went to him and the first pass came with 19 on the clock. and marbury was allowed to really do his thing offensively. that's what we need - craw to run the point and give marbs the green light.

- craw at the point is AWESOME. he's such a better passer within the flow of the offense. his game really has made tremendous improvements. the first 3 games, he was in a funk due to being pulled but you could see now that he's starting again, he's playing VERY solid. the biggest telling moment is when craw was open for a 3, but passed it up, dribbled in, and hit a midrange jumper...which, if you haven't noticed, is beggining to go down with consistency. yes, he may take one or two errand shots but he's clearly learning to become a more complete player. and when he dribble penetrates, he's passing out. AWESOME. defensively he's come a long long way. he still has a ways to go but he's staying with his man up the court and getting in passing lanes. but then our offense started stalling in the 2nd half, and it was b/c we stopped using crawford at the point. the ball started getting dominated by marbs again and the first pass came with 12 on the shot clock (i was paying attention to that). so it totally slowed up and took the fluidity out of the game. but that's ok...we're growing. and i don't know if you guys noticed this too but he likes taking big shots...and he hits them.

- marbs may have had his best game in a long long time. he played all out on both ends of the court. he was allowed to go for his and he took advantage. he rebounded like a monster. i said before the only way this could work is if steph is moved to the SG. it was a great statline and moving him to more of the SG role in the 1st half really had our offense clicking. it was when he started having the ball in his hands more in the 2nd half, did we start having problems. but otherwise, it was a really good game from our guards. i will say this also, after all the hate spewed forth to marbs yesterday, he really stepped up his game and in my eyes, played a great great game...maybe one of his best all around games as a knick. we just need to keep him in that SG role, he can seriously flourish there.

- i'm still trying to figure out Q's spot on the team. he's rebounding nicely tho. at the end there, he looked up at the clock instead of trying to secure that loose ball after jamal was stripped which pretty much sealed the game for us.

- as each game passes by, my thoughts on curry and frye become stronger and stronger. our post game should go to frye and not curry right now. frye is much more aggressive, polished, and smart. he's begging for the ball down low. he's taking shots within the flow of the offense AND he'll pass it out. soft? fellas, this guy is going to be a beast. curry has a LONG way to go. he will be most benefitted getting the ball off of guard penetration so he can get easy dunks. his hands are way too weak right now and he doesn't know how to position them. it's going to take time with him...frye is ready now.

- and speaking of frye...WTF was malik doing in there at the end of the game. that substitution pretty much cost it for us. the play of the game was the adonal foyle layup. he turned around and put it in without any problems b/c malik was guarding him from behind. frye should've been out there.

- it looks like it took lb 4 games to figure out what type of talent we have at the guard spot. they need freedom to do some things and craw needs to run the team more than playing off the ball. i almost look at it like this is the REAL 1st game of the season as it was a CLEAR building block for us. i'm not sure why he didn't call a time out there at the end. maybe he wanted to see them try to win a game if they didn't have a timeout in the first place...but damn if we didn't need a win tonight. i don't mind that craw tried to take that shot either. he was hitting big shots down the stretch. and malik rose needs to be permanently benched. there's nothing that he's bringing to the table that frye or lee or even mo can't.

- it's glaringly obvious that we need another guard that can handle the ball. Q can't do it. penny gave us a solid, heady 17 mins (took nate's minutes tonight). but steph CAN NOT go 40 mins a night this way...playing on both ends of the court. he's going to kill himself out there. we need to give him spells. craw is 25 and doesn't get beat up, but steph does so we need to help him out.

- our defense...i mean what do i say about our defense? it's not all world yet but it's pretty good seeing guys play that hard defensively. our backcourt may have had their best defensive showing EVER and you can see the chemistry between steph and craw.

- all in all, a pretty good game from us and a TRUE building block. we must now expand on this for the next game. we saw it worked with craw playing point more. the ball moved around alot better. we saw steph have a great game when he was allowed to go for his. our big men FED off our guards. frye keeps demanding the ball down low so hopefully he'll start getting it. curry hit his ft's and he's rebounding the ball. HE IS STARTING TO GET IT!!! a VERY encouraging game. it's like we played a TOTALLY different game offensively tonight. i'm not mad at the loss (although technically you can say lb, in his ways to find out what we are, may have cost us a shot at the game with the non-timeout). we now have to make up those first 4 losses somewhere down the road. and we have to carry this over to sacratomato.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 11-12-2005 09:27 AM]
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HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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11/12/2005  9:48 AM
Solid post, DJ, especially the points on Stephon and Craw. If they can hit their shots, keep hitting off the open bigs, and keep up the effort on D, the Knicks should end up better than just OK.

Last night's game was very encouraging, indeed.

[Edited by - HARDCOREKNICKSFAN on 11-12-2005 09:49 AM]
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
martin
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11/12/2005  11:21 AM
wow, good read. I have some reactions but I gotta take my mom to the mall and she's been telling my to hurry up.
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BigRedDog
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11/12/2005  11:51 AM
sorry but i don't think penny really addded anything last nite. Very happy with the overall defense of the team and it should keep getting better. I think you have to give lb,isiah 2 yrs at least, so really this is game 5 out of 164 games. Just imagine how much better we will be given so time.
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attaboy2005
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11/12/2005  12:06 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

what's the word that sums up that game for me...ENCOURAGING. why?

- we saw lb lift his reigns from his guards. steph and jamal were allowed to play a little looser and the offense really started with the guards instead of dumping it down and watching what happens. we played a little more looser and fluid in the 1st half MAINLY b/c we played crawford at the point alot of it. marbury did a good job but the ball movement started with crawford in the 1st half. the outlets went to him and the first pass came with 19 on the clock. and marbury was allowed to really do his thing offensively. that's what we need - craw to run the point and give marbs the green light.

- craw at the point is AWESOME. he's such a better passer within the flow of the offense. his game really has made tremendous improvements. the first 3 games, he was in a funk due to being pulled but you could see now that he's starting again, he's playing VERY solid. the biggest telling moment is when craw was open for a 3, but passed it up, dribbled in, and hit a midrange jumper...which, if you haven't noticed, is beggining to go down with consistency. yes, he may take one or two errand shots but he's clearly learning to become a more complete player. and when he dribble penetrates, he's passing out. AWESOME. defensively he's come a long long way. he still has a ways to go but he's staying with his man up the court and getting in passing lanes. but then our offense started stalling in the 2nd half, and it was b/c we stopped using crawford at the point. the ball started getting dominated by marbs again and the first pass came with 12 on the shot clock (i was paying attention to that). so it totally slowed up and took the fluidity out of the game. but that's ok...we're growing. and i don't know if you guys noticed this too but he likes taking big shots...and he hits them.

- marbs may have had his best game in a long long time. he played all out on both ends of the court. he was allowed to go for his and he took advantage. he rebounded like a monster. i said before the only way this could work is if steph is moved to the SG. it was a great statline and moving him to more of the SG role in the 1st half really had our offense clicking. it was when he started having the ball in his hands more in the 2nd half, did we start having problems. but otherwise, it was a really good game from our guards. i will say this also, after all the hate spewed forth to marbs yesterday, he really stepped up his game and in my eyes, played a great great game...maybe one of his best all around games as a knick. we just need to keep him in that SG role, he can seriously flourish there.

- i'm still trying to figure out Q's spot on the team. he's rebounding nicely tho. at the end there, he looked up at the clock instead of trying to secure that loose ball after jamal was stripped which pretty much sealed the game for us.

- as each game passes by, my thoughts on curry and frye become stronger and stronger. our post game should go to frye and not curry right now. frye is much more aggressive, polished, and smart. he's begging for the ball down low. he's taking shots within the flow of the offense AND he'll pass it out. soft? fellas, this guy is going to be a beast. curry has a LONG way to go. he will be most benefitted getting the ball off of guard penetration so he can get easy dunks. his hands are way too weak right now and he doesn't know how to position them. it's going to take time with him...frye is ready now.

- and speaking of frye...WTF was malik doing in there at the end of the game. that substitution pretty much cost it for us. the play of the game was the adonal foyle layup. he turned around and put it in without any problems b/c malik was guarding him from behind. frye should've been out there.

- it looks like it took lb 4 games to figure out what type of talent we have at the guard spot. they need freedom to do some things and craw needs to run the team more than playing off the ball. i almost look at it like this is the REAL 1st game of the season as it was a CLEAR building block for us. i'm not sure why he didn't call a time out there at the end. maybe he wanted to see them try to win a game if they didn't have a timeout in the first place...but damn if we didn't need a win tonight. i don't mind that craw tried to take that shot either. he was hitting big shots down the stretch. and malik rose needs to be permanently benched. there's nothing that he's bringing to the table that frye or lee or even mo can't.

- it's glaringly obvious that we need another guard that can handle the ball. Q can't do it. penny gave us a solid, heady 17 mins (took nate's minutes tonight). but steph CAN NOT go 40 mins a night this way...playing on both ends of the court. he's going to kill himself out there. we need to give him spells. craw is 25 and doesn't get beat up, but steph does so we need to help him out.

- our defense...i mean what do i say about our defense? it's not all world yet but it's pretty good seeing guys play that hard defensively. our backcourt may have had their best defensive showing EVER and you can see the chemistry between steph and craw.

- all in all, a pretty good game from us and a TRUE building block. we must now expand on this for the next game. we saw it worked with craw playing point more. the ball moved around alot better. we saw steph have a great game when he was allowed to go for his. our big men FED off our guards. frye keeps demanding the ball down low so hopefully he'll start getting it. curry hit his ft's and he's rebounding the ball. HE IS STARTING TO GET IT!!! a VERY encouraging game. it's like we played a TOTALLY different game offensively tonight. i'm not mad at the loss (although technically you can say lb, in his ways to find out what we are, may have cost us a shot at the game with the non-timeout). we now have to make up those first 4 losses somewhere down the road. and we have to carry this over to sacratomato.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 11-12-2005 09:27 AM]

Good Post, Dj, it's nice to see a positive spin on a disappointing time for us and our Knicks, it's hard pill to swallow with being 0-5, but with the progress stated above I think we are getting closer to being a better team. It was difficult seeing Rose out there in the closing moments I wanted to scream what the heck is he doing taking that shot, he isn't Allan Houston with that sweet automatic jumper, he's a stiff!. Anyways, this team is a Diamond in the Rough so to speak!.
Allanfan20
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11/12/2005  12:09 PM
Good read DJ. I missed most of the game b/c of work last night, but it's good to know that Crawford is settling down. I saw the last 6 or so minutes, and Crawford did a lot of good things. He is playing hard on D, but it was unfortunate that the guy he guarded most of the time was Baron Davis. Or at least it seemed so. But he is coming along. I never gave up on the kid and during his struggles, I rooted for him harder than anyone while everyone else demanded that he get traded. I'm happy now.
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gunsnewing
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11/12/2005  12:33 PM
Great, truly great post DJ! its about time we get the ball of of Marbury's hands and let him do what he does best. Too bad Marbury had the ball in his hands in the 2nd half as the offense went completely stagnant. I swear if Malik, Penny, Barnes are not on IR tomorrow I'm going to flip out!
HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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11/12/2005  12:52 PM
Big game's already in the IL for the reaggravated hamstring...
Barnes should end up active.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
tkf
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11/12/2005  12:54 PM
good read Dj, very good read, but as far as penny goes, he should be inactive forever.... I like craw comming off the screens, he looked really good, taking those mid range jumpers... Running the point he was effective, even in the 4th when he drove and found davis wide open for that jumper to give us the lead was grea..

I dissagree about curry, he needs to get the ball and last night he passed out of the double team well, he was efficient, right now he is getting doubled as if he were shaq and fouled as well, but he is crashing the boards, just want to see him in better shape and work on the defense more.. Frye is going to be some player, that hammer dunk he had last night was nasty...

Q is not there yet, but he is a skilled player, hit some shots and crashed the boards, I like that..

overall,we need to play better late, and that includes guarding the 3 point line better....

Mo taylor, holds the ball just too long, he almost sickens me with that..
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tomverve
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11/12/2005  1:33 PM
Hey, good to know I wasn't the only one who saw a lot of good things out there. I'll piggyback on dj's observations a bit:

- How bout them turnovers? Only TEN turnovers this game, really exceptional. By abandoning the pound-it-in-to-Curry approach, not only did the offense flow better, but we avoided Curry's plethora of giveaways trying to make moves against triple teams.

And when Curry did get double teamed, he was very good about recognizing it and passing out. And despite not being the featured guy on offense, he still got his and put in a great effort on the boards (10 in 25 minutes). Very encouraging signs for Curry.

I wouldn't put the slowing down offense in the second half entirely on Marbury's shoulders. GS was obviously more pumped up in the second half and was playing much tougher D.

We let another 10+ lead slip away, but this time it seemed more like a natural progression rather than a crumble. When you play good teams on the road, you have to expect that you won't dominate them the whole game. It took GS most of the third quarter to catch up, and once they did we hung tough with them throughout the rest of the game. Compare with what happened against Portland, where we gave up the double digit lead in about 3 minutes and completely folded the rest of the way.

Another loss, but not a big deal. We are getting much better. Give it some more time.
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LJforFOUR
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11/12/2005  1:37 PM
Yo DJ! Nice to hear an intlligent Knick/basketball fan. I get so sick of some of the boards and the spewing of negativity. I had to join this one. Keep hope alive, bench penny, Rose and James, bring in the Butler!
Go kncks.
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newyorknewyork
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11/12/2005  4:52 PM
Curry, Frye, Lee, and maybe even Butler are the frontcourt of the future. Frye should be getting 30mins,Lee should be getting 25mins.

Curry & Frye playing at a high level, controlling the boards. Altering shots, providing intimidation with there length. Frye working the high post, with screens and pick and rolls and all the good stuff. Curry working the low post getting the put backs and the dump offs. The way some of us invisioned Sweetney & Lampe. Is whats going to make us a good team now and the future. Its clear Lee makes an impact when he plays as well with his rebounding, passing, and hustle. He is averaging 8.5rebs, 7pts, 2assist on 66.7% for 15.5mins for 2games. We can really have a good frontcourt. I don't want to 2nd quess Brown since he has such a good track record. But Im hoping he has the same plan for these guys. But I still wouldn't get why he is prolonging the development. Getting these guys going would get us wins. Curry is getting the opportunity though. The foul trouble is killing him but when he plays he has put a good effort to rebound.
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rvhoss
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11/13/2005  8:31 AM
I just saw the game (dvr) and I just have one question.

Is it me, or did it seem Brown took Curry out (he had 14/10 and this was an off night) and substituted Rose to prove a point?

If so, that's what lost the game.

Curry's off night produced 14 and 10...I mean, he's still out of shape as well.

I'm looking extremely forward to the season even more now.

Rose is looking better and can definitely help a team in need of a hustle veteran with limited offensive skills. Don't get me wrong, so could the knicks, but we have Lee, who IMHO is a younger more athletic Rose.

I'm liking what I see.
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HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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11/13/2005  8:40 AM
Imagine Curry's statline whne he's in shape and stays out of foul trouble. It's going to take time for him to fully bloom, but man, is he gonna be a monster for our team! YES!! 20/10/2 shouldn't be a stretch at all.

Lee needs to get some of that PT Larry would use on Malik Rose.
Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
WOODMANnYk
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11/13/2005  8:49 AM
I was one to questioned Marbury's defense but i will admit that he's been playing both ends of the floor especailly rebounding..

You know you have a great pg. when he adds rebounding and defense to his repertoire. Ex. jason Kidd

Yep, you're right, MAlik Rose did kill us in the game by not defending that Foyle play and taking that stupid jumpshot..

This was the best we've looked since starting pre-season and looked to be clicking on all cylinders.. hopefully they'll get on a nice winning streak.
The Future. GO KNICKS!
djsunyc's quick hits on the game (@golden state)

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