Clips are presuming Wilcox is gone, if he's available they will take him over Nene

Personally I think they really want Wagner.

Posted by BigSm00th:

They want Hilario, because he could play center AND would be able to play his contract in Brazil out, wouldn't count against the cap, and therefore LAC wouldn't have to pay him, therefore paying zero rookie contracts instead of two for one year. The 1 to 5 picks are going to be Ming, Williams, Dunleavy, Gooden, Tskitisvili. Then at 6 the Cavs would probably take front court help, like Wilcox. If the Knicks at 8 and 12, (Hilario would go 7), I would take Butler with 8 (that would give the Knicks the ability to trade Sprewell). Then Jeffries, Woods, and Wagner would go 9 to 11. That would leave Amare Stoudemire, who could mature into a player as good as Wilcox or Hilario. The Knicks would be able to solidify the small forward and power forward.

With Postell at 2-guard and drafting a point like Maddox or Parker, 4 of 5 positions would be taken care of after the draft. By signing a guy like Keon Clark to play center (he is skinny, but with an up-tempo offense this team would have), that wouldn't be a bad team, especially once Butler and Stoudemire matured with Parker or Maddox.

Complain about a point guard jam, but they could put one in a trade. Since Layden wants to shake things up, you could package Sprewell with either Thomas or Camby and then either Eisley, Ward, or Jackson in a trade. The Knicks might be able to fetch a package of players with expiring contracts.

[Edited by - bigsm00th on 06/24/2002 21:33:00]

Good analysis bigsm00th. The Knicks need one of Butler or Tskitisvili to go in the top 5 for them to get a shot at either Wilcox or Nene. If Cleveland takes Wilcox with the 6th (and if I were GM) I would think long and hard about the 7th for the 8th & 12th. Not having seen the workouts first hand, Nene could be a C/PF "tweener" who could lock up the center spot for years to come. That's hard to pass up. Think of a more athletic Mourning.

Now, is Butler really a small forward or a big 2-guard? Will Amare still be there, and more importantly, will he pan out? What if Miami takes Jeffries with the 10th to shore up their SF position and Phoenix takes Amare with the 9th to shore up their size needs? You are left with drafting Butler and Wagner with a team that already has Spree, Houston, Anderson and a jillion overpaid, slow point guards. What next?

Posted by BigSm00th:

Then you're left with Wagner and Butler and go from there. At least then you commend Layden for taking a chance, a practical chance that might pan out, and don't criticize him even more for doing nothing.

I'm not saying you criticize him, I'm saying as a whole, the Knicks fan community hate Layden. So if you're left with Butler and Wagner, go from there. What if they do pan out? Undersized, who cares, you're telling me you wouldn't take a team with Allen Iverson at 2 and Paul Pierce at 3? If they pan out that's what you're practically looking at. The draft is a crapshoot, tons of players don't pan out. But if they do, that's a hell of a team just with those two.

have you guys seen butler? he's a 6'5" SF. he's gonna get torched by the 3's in the league who are all like 6'8"+. Also, butler is not a SG, too stocky, and slow...

Iverson is not as good as them. If I had a team and I had a choice between Iverson, Kobe, and T-mac I would select in this order,
T-Mac
Kobe
Iverson

Him being 6' he is not able to guard others at his position. He can't realistically threaten to block their shots and he doesn't stand a chance if the post him up because he is too small. Height matters alot in the NBA and there are times when it doeasn't too. Like Nene for example is 2 inches shorter, be his wingspan is 7'4" which more than makes up for that. Iverson has no such advantage. His only advantage is speed. He is a great player and it is incredible what he is able to do with his size, but he has to work so much harder to do it, i don't think he will play more than 5 more years with the abuse his body takes to get things done. I always said he should have learned how to play the point guard position where he really would be able to dominate all players in his position. Right now, he can't even guard the players in his position, but he can score on them.

but back to your point about butler, I don't think 1 or 2 inches will stop you, Hakeem and Zo are both 6-10 and were both in the 50 greatest.

I don't know what the rest of his body is like though. Consider other players who are shorter and have narrower shoulders. Like have you ever noticed the difference in size between ray allen and Allan houston? I don't mean height I mean the width of their shoulders. I think that is why Allan is able to post 2 guards up successfully, although he doesn't do it much at all, when he does it looks textbook.

Look at the difference between Nene and Wilcox. Wilcox is 6-10 220 and Nene is 6-10 250-260 with room for more muscle. That becomes very significant if you are looking at players with similar skills.

look at the difference between KT and Ben Wallace. they are the same height but Ben's Arms and shoulders are like tree trunks and Kt's arms aren't. that coupled with Ben's jumping ability and overall athleticism means alot.

But I think you are right in the sense that Spree is about 2 inches undersize and he scores and defends at a high level. Did I just right all of that and say nothing?