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Throw me a bone
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Panos
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9/14/2005  11:10 AM
Goddam, something happen!!! Please!
AUTOADVERT
Caseloads
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9/14/2005  12:31 PM
Posted by Panos:

Goddam, something happen!!! Please!

Wait until october - things will heat up then
EnySpree
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9/14/2005  1:02 PM
Posted by Panos:

Goddam, something happen!!! Please!

I feel you man.....I'm running out of stuff to talk about.

Is this thing on?



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Nalod
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9/14/2005  2:19 PM
Ok, here you go.

Ewings demand for max contract or leave, getting it and then forcing a trade when he was delegated to a less than starring role was the true genesis for the KNick decline. Ernie/Checketts should have been more forceful with him and let him walk then pile on the problems that Layden was so inept to handle.

So while Layden is the poster boy for our 5 year problem, is it infact checketts and grunfeld whom both mishandled the ewing decline (allowing it to manifest into such a problem), and the Houstan extension, thus putting Layden over his head and mishandling the AFTER effect?

Tawk amung youselves!

Nalod
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9/14/2005  2:23 PM
Posted by Panos:

Goddam, something happen!!! Please!

Throw you a bone?

Here ya go!




EnySpree
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9/14/2005  6:13 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Ok, here you go.

Ewings demand for max contract or leave, getting it and then forcing a trade when he was delegated to a less than starring role was the true genesis for the KNick decline. Ernie/Checketts should have been more forceful with him and let him walk then pile on the problems that Layden was so inept to handle.

So while Layden is the poster boy for our 5 year problem, is it infact checketts and grunfeld whom both mishandled the ewing decline (allowing it to manifest into such a problem), and the Houstan extension, thus putting Layden over his head and mishandling the AFTER effect?

Tawk amung youselves!




LMFAO!!!!
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Silverfuel
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9/14/2005  7:21 PM
Posted by Nalod:

Ewings demand for max contract or leave, getting it and then forcing a trade when he was delegated to a less than starring role was the true genesis for the KNick decline.
This brings back the days of Nedyal.

That was the begining of the decline but it should've ended a lot sooner. In my book, Layden gets blamed for mainly 2 points and I have always stuck to this:
1) Trading Glen Rice and his expiring contract for Howard Eisley and Shandon Anderson and their huge contracts. (this was a problem because we had 2 PGs and 2 SFs at the time)
2) Trading Camby and the #7 pick for McDyess. (This was his move and he has to take the fall for it. He would've been celebrated if McDyess returned to form)

I was corrected on this by martin a few years ago. Houston signing was all Dolan. I cannot blame this all on Layden. He made a ton of bonehead moves. He never got us a true center. He traded away all our assests for nothing. He was just a bad GM. He shouldnt be blamed for the Ewing trade (nicknamed: 'King Kong' at the time) and he had 2 years to help the Knicks after that trade but he never did. I am giving Isiah 2 years. I will judge him at the trade deadline of the upcoming season.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Nalod
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9/14/2005  11:22 PM
Nedyal returns!

Its a chicken or the egg knick question.

Really, I think Dolans tightening the purstrings and moral character building crusade scheme did much to handicap Layden to go in his "utah-fest".

Granted, those teams played hard and were swell group of mature professionals.

If its Nedyal, there must be a Starphuch conspiricy! The Dice trade was a last ditch effort to take a leap forward.

When that did not work, it was time to rebuild and go young, which was happening, and Dolan panicked at the death march the knicks and Rangers were exibiting. Enter the Starphuching GM and out with a fine introvert good guy shoytty GM Laydog!

Isiah finds the lost "Starphuch Scrolls of Layden" and rushes up the castle to show Dolan, whom has been shown a light of epiphiny and the voice from god stating "you can buy your way out of this if you ditch the high character moral crusade", so gone were the overpaid good guys for the even more overpaid under achieveing group. Reading the statue of liberty the new mantra we "give us you rich, injured, Your Gazy and discruntled self absorbed stars".

Isiah ego inflates and fires chaney on national TV drunk with self esteem in some bad vaudville act trying to be funny. Told Don he was there to help just a few weeks earlier. Hires Mike Fratello but bungles up as its leaked and Mike wants big time say on personel. Panicked his pulls Lenny from his Rotary Club and signs him quick to look good. Blows some big time cash. Lasted less than a year, and Lenny is laughing "what a country!"

Isiah blows what is left of morale by shutting down Shandon's game streak in his home town. A proud man, a professional man, a utah man! and Isiah just had to flex his popcorn and cut the man down! Yeah, we suck and it was shandons fault. Please! Pays Shandon 20mil to leave cuz he felt shandon disrespected him! 20 million cuz he walked out on his exit meeting! Dam, what utter disrespect can a man bestow on another! 20 mil, and you'd a thought the man defecated on his Bently and impregenated Mrs. Isiah the same day!

33 wins later, Isiah the teflon Popcorn don still is loved and in unison preaches that we are younger and more athletic. Fails to say we are dumber and less caring. But we got picks, we got expiring contracts, but as Mrs. Balboa would say, " but we got everything but the truth!"

Nedyal thinking, This guys is better than Layden? Here 18 months, has 3 coaches, bungling personel moves, the team is regressing and the only trade this guy is praised for was the brain child of Layden? damm the Kool aid works round here! This guy trades for mo. t for no apparent reason, and turns KVH into somthing even worse! At least Keith would get hurt a lot! TT just lingers. And the payroll swells on and on!

3 first round picks, all 4 year college guys (back to higher moral ground), A blue chip good dude angel in Reezy, and while all of this was good, who can get excited with Herb at the Helm? I ain't talking no Dick Helm either.

The seas parted, blue moon rising up today, hell done froozen over, and Isiah with 12 mil in his pocket is able to charm Mrs. Brown. Isiah makes 4 mil, Larry 12. Thats a lot of popcorn!

All is wonderful as LB brings a legit rep and saves the day for Isiah!

I gotta say it, things look good, but if they ain't, Isiah gotta go and let some LB croney figure it all out.

Its amazing how Isiah come out of this smelling all fresh. HE actually buys himself a boat load of time cuz the rooks! This guy is amazing! Whats ourpayroll now? How much more is it than the no. 2 payroll team?

It not our money! What a country!

Regards,

Nedyal
Nalod
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9/14/2005  11:26 PM
Nedyal is Jr. Jekell.
HARDCOREKNICKSFAN
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9/15/2005  12:04 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Nedyal is Jr. Jekell.

Are you bringing Nedyal back? I smelled the stench and followed it here...

We're going throwback mode? That could get real messy in a hurry. I feel my eyes getting green already...



Let's leave the past in the past, and look towards a seemingly bright future.




Another season, and more adversity to persevere through. We will get the job done, even BETTER than last year. GO KNICKS!
Nalod
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9/15/2005  9:25 AM


Viv says "peace be still".

We needed a bone to throw, and what better way to revive the passions than the old Laydog vs. the world arguement! I did not expect you to take the bait, but the board was dying there for a moment!

I will finish this and you might actually agree with "Nedyal":

It was wrong to sent the wrong man to do the wrong job! What I mean is, Layden was part of the bigger problem, but not the core! I blasted Dolan for allowing Checketts for going hog wild and not addressing the Growing Ewing problem. Dolan was behind most of this, and castrated Ernie. The Earnie-JVG riff was very underrated, and the core of that problem was Dolan meddling. IN the end, Dolan had to choose between one or the other but lost both! That was very stupid! Layden was last man standing and was the wrong man to do the wrong job!

So if we were gonna send in a team of thick specs MBA's to chart the organizational failures, there would be some blame spread around. Sure it ends with Layden, but Nedyals quest was not to obsolve Layden of his failures, but dig deeper into the thought process that makes bad decisions.

Bottom line is two fold going forward. Wins and losees. And operationg profits. One thing that glares at me is our payroll is about double of the Spurs. 60 mil vs. 120? Just guessing. 90% higher? 80% higher? How much higher than the next high payroll? 40%?50%? It ain't my money, but damm! Definitley shows a long history of ineffieciency!

Bottom line is Isiah is a better GM than Layden, and Isiah is the right man for the job even though his screw ups are perhaps even greater than Laydens (individual)ever was. But they are and were very different set of circumstances. And, Isiah was able to mess up but still move the team forward because of the many assets he was given. I contend that Layden given a directive different than Isiah and that unto itself was destined to doom!

Isiah was allowed to do things Layden was likely not allowed to. And by the time it was aparent that it can be undone by spending, the right man, a charasmatic man was bought in to do the job. Yes I agree with many that Laydens firing was proper. But I just long contend that "layden sucks" is more complicated than what it seemed.

Nedyal has exhausted his time on this, and will forever be exiled to a better place!

Silverfuel
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9/15/2005  9:31 AM
Posted by Nalod:

Nedyal has exhausted his time on this, and will forever be exiled to a better place!
LOL Good posts btw. They make a good case.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
Throw me a bone

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