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Ariza! How good do you think he is?
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BigC
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8/7/2005  10:06 PM
Some people think this kid is ready to start what is your take on Ariza's game?
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Rich
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8/7/2005  10:10 PM
He will be limited offensively until and unless he can consistently hit a 15 foot jump shot. If he does, his ceiling is high because he has a great first step. He has the physical tools to be a shut down defender.
BigC
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8/7/2005  10:16 PM
Posted by Rich:

He will be limited offensively until and unless he can consistently hit a 15 foot jump shot. If he does, his ceiling is high because he has a great first step. He has the physical tools to be a shut down defender.

Agreed! I think he also has to work on his handle. Most sf's can handle the ball better than Ariza.
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technomaster
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8/7/2005  10:31 PM
This topic has been covered numerous times... but I think he could become a lot like Josh Howard (of the Mavs), another long young player who has tapped a little more of his potential than Ariza thus far. Another player might be Tayshaun Prince... but Princess already had a jumper and a wealth of big time college experience before he even got to the NBA. But he's a guy who clearly developed bigtime under Larry Brown.
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BigC
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8/7/2005  10:40 PM
Posted by technomaster:

This topic has been covered numerous times... but I think he could become a lot like Josh Howard (of the Mavs), another long young player who has tapped a little more of his potential than Ariza thus far. Another player might be Tayshaun Prince... but Princess already had a jumper and a wealth of big time college experience before he even got to the NBA. But he's a guy who clearly developed bigtime under Larry Brown.

True the topic has been covered, however I know summer league is not a way to measure Ariza, but I did not see a real improvement in his shooting.

Also I don't know about Ariza being like Josh Howard. I feel Horward might be better than Prince. Howard can score at will. His handle is as good as any point guard and he can also shoot, and pass like guard. If Josh Howard was getting 30 plus minutes a game I think he could easily drop 22 plus a game.

[Edited by - BigC on 08/07/2005 22:42:10]
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Bonn1997
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8/7/2005  10:53 PM
Posted by Rich:

He will be limited offensively until and unless he can consistently hit a 15 foot jump shot. If he does, his ceiling is high because he has a great first step. He has the physical tools to be a shut down defender.
RJ has no jumper and he's not exactly limited offensively. A jump shot is just one way of scoring. Ariza can still be a good scorer without a jump shot, but not a great one without a jump shot.
gunsnewing
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8/7/2005  11:20 PM
but RJ can handle the ball
Bonn1997
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8/7/2005  11:21 PM
Posted by gunsnewing:

but RJ can handle the ball
But when he was 19 did he handle the ball any better than Ariza does now?
misterearl
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8/8/2005  12:03 AM
And besides, he's only 20

Ariza fun facts:

in 10 fewer min per gme (17 minutes per gme to TTs 27 / 1,382 to TTs total of 1,940 ) Trevor Ariza averaged 6 pts (only 6 fewer) 3 boards (same) shot a higher percentage (.442 to .439) had more steals (70 to 41) and nearly as many assists (85 - just a shade under Tim's 110)... did I mention Trevor is the better defender?
(arbitrarily projected @ 8 and 6 reb for 22 minutes of focused perimeter defense and at least one spectacular dunk)
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Knight
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8/8/2005  12:11 AM
If Ariza somehow finds a great jumper he could be another Pippen--add Lebron to the roster in a couple years and we could have another dynasty in the making...there needs to be a smilie that looks like it's dreaming.
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crzymdups
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8/8/2005  12:16 AM
Ariza absolutely needs to start at SF.
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Killa4luv
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8/8/2005  12:23 AM
Posted by crzymdups:

Ariza absolutely needs to start at SF.
yeah for the Bobcats.
Knight
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8/8/2005  12:23 AM
Posted by crzymdups:

Ariza absolutely needs to start at SF.

I can see Steph/Craw/Ariza/Sweets/James starting and the second unit being Nate/Q/TT/Rose/Frye...I think that is one hell of a second team.
"He only went to Georgia Tech for one year, and that's an engineering school." -LB
Ray15
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8/8/2005  12:50 AM
Posted by Knight:
Posted by crzymdups:

Ariza absolutely needs to start at SF.

I can see Steph/Craw/Ariza/Sweets/James starting and the second unit being Nate/Q/TT/Rose/Frye...I think that is one hell of a second team.

Why not start Q and TT rather than Craw and Ariza. They would both fit into the halfcourt game better and it would allow us to put together a second unit of Nate, Craw, Ariza, JYD/Rose, Fyre. That team comes in with energy, would play defense, and would run other teams out of the building. It would be a very nice change of pace unit to protect leads (so we don't get flat like we did so often under the JVG teams) or to spark a run. That second unit would force turnovers and get easy buckets. Also, I think Crawford should be in the game whenver Nate is in. They complement each other perfectly -- Crawford can share the point role on offense and allow Nate to be more of a scorer while Nate will really get after people on defense making up for Craws lack of perimeter defense. I could also see the two of them pressing and creating a lot of steals due to their quickness.
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djsunyc
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8/8/2005  1:08 AM
RJ?

look fellas. ariza has not been given the time to show us what he can do. all we know right now is that for the LIMITED time he does get, he plays well and produces. and with him, it does appear that the more minutes he gets, the better he gets and more he produces in multiple categories.

but to ask for him to start over tim or even Q means we are in FULL REBUILD MODE.

he's crazy raw and yes, i would like to see him get extended minutes, but that's not the philosophy of this organization right now. dmiles got extended minutes from the get go and produces decently. ariza could do the same, we won't know (although i think dmiles was more polished when he came out).

so for this team, and the way it's thinking, ariza will still come off the bench UNTIL tim gets traded or let go after the season. then if Q is still on this team, LB would have to decide which way he wants to go...and by his history, it looks like ariza would start.

but i warn you guys, don't sleep on lee. he has a better game than ariza right now and may push for some serious play by the end of the year or next season.
Allanfan20
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8/8/2005  2:53 AM
I know I've said the same stuff over and over again regarding this. First of all if you want to say RJ is realistic, then you have to say Shandon Anderson is also realistic. You have to look both ways. In Summer league, he showed during some of the games that he really hadn't improved that jumper, which will kill his offensive game. Of course Richard Jefferson has SOME jumper. Maybe nothing special, but it's good enough that it's worth respect. And he can use that to balance his offensive attack, making him one of the better 3s in the league. Ariza doesn't have half the skill RJ has right now. And believe me everyone, I LOVE Ariza, but lets not kill ourselves. Lets look at some fair comparisons. Who does he really play like? How about on the defensive end, Marcus Camby, a shorter version of him at least. He plays like him on the offense as well, b/c he mainly just cuts and gets points from offensive rebounds and feeds from his teammates. He may have JUST enough skill to maybe create a couple of buckets a game ON HIS OWN, but nowhere near a go to option. Kinda like Tay Prince. GOOD THING overall. Is there any semblence to freaking Richard Jefferson there? NO. Lets not get silly.
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Bonn1997
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8/8/2005  7:44 AM
if you want to say RJ is realistic, then you have to say Shandon Anderson is also realistic.
I definitely agree with that.
Nalod
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8/8/2005  7:49 AM
Prince comps come to mind because of the ball instincts this kid has to rebound, block, putbacks and steels. His defensive pressure creates much that does not show up on the stat sheet.

This kid should be groomed!
gunsnewing
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8/8/2005  7:56 AM
Posted by djsunyc:

RJ?

look fellas. ariza has not been given the time to show us what he can do. all we know right now is that for the LIMITED time he does get, he plays well and produces. and with him, it does appear that the more minutes he gets, the better he gets and more he produces in multiple categories.

but to ask for him to start over tim or even Q means we are in FULL REBUILD MODE.

he's crazy raw and yes, i would like to see him get extended minutes, but that's not the philosophy of this organization right now. dmiles got extended minutes from the get go and produces decently. ariza could do the same, we won't know (although i think dmiles was more polished when he came out).

so for this team, and the way it's thinking, ariza will still come off the bench UNTIL tim gets traded or let go after the season. then if Q is still on this team, LB would have to decide which way he wants to go...and by his history, it looks like ariza would start.

but i warn you guys, don't sleep on lee. he has a better game than ariza right now and may push for some serious play by the end of the year or next season.

yeah I've thought about that before don't be surprised if Lee gets more minutes than Ariza at SF since he's got better game right now
gunsnewing
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8/8/2005  7:59 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:

I know I've said the same stuff over and over again regarding this. First of all if you want to say RJ is realistic, then you have to say Shandon Anderson is also realistic. You have to look both ways. In Summer league, he showed during some of the games that he really hadn't improved that jumper, which will kill his offensive game. Of course Richard Jefferson has SOME jumper. Maybe nothing special, but it's good enough that it's worth respect. And he can use that to balance his offensive attack, making him one of the better 3s in the league. Ariza doesn't have half the skill RJ has right now. And believe me everyone, I LOVE Ariza, but lets not kill ourselves. Lets look at some fair comparisons. Who does he really play like? How about on the defensive end, Marcus Camby, a shorter version of him at least. He plays like him on the offense as well, b/c he mainly just cuts and gets points from offensive rebounds and feeds from his teammates. He may have JUST enough skill to maybe create a couple of buckets a game ON HIS OWN, but nowhere near a go to option. Kinda like Tay Prince. GOOD THING overall. Is there any semblence to freaking Richard Jefferson there? NO. Lets not get silly.

completely agree. I always thought he played like a smaller Camby except he gets steals while camby blocks shots. Neither guy is good enough to demand the ball, they get scrap buckets off effort. Not Prince because he can shoot

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 08/08/2005 08:00:46]
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Ariza! How good do you think he is?
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