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BRIGGS
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8/4/2005  9:41 PM
- Procedural issue with Atlanta. Hawks trying to resolve this. (referring to S&T)

- Thinks it will go through...but is really hesitant about whether or not it actually will.

- Elected not to sign JJ last year because he had just bought the team and committed a TON of money. Hadn't proven how successful the team would be and didn't want to lock in a starting 5 with big contracts without knowing how well the team would perform together. (Good point).

- Thought Joe would make more money the next season. Told him he really liked him and knows he'd be making more money than what his offer was (but not expecting him to be a MAX player) and hope he'd be in a Suns uniform (this was all last year).

- Didn't really receive any indications that Joe wasn't happy (other than the typical things that anyone may not be happy with sporadically....didn't see anything bad though)

- Realized about halfway through the season (especially after the Miami blowout) that they would match for Joe. Doesn't have a problem paying Joe more money.

- Last season's team performance exceeded all expectations.

- Allen, Redd marquee players. Joe got a team to give him a lot of money and good for him.

- Moving Q allowed us to get Defense and stay quick.

- Q deal and Kurt Thomas was not done to make room for Joe. Paying $3 million more this year (because of trade kicker with Q). Made the deal to make us a better team.

- Tried to meet with Joe. Tried to do the same thing as they did with Nash. Day after making appointment his agent called and said they don't want to meet, no reason to.

- Never thought the rumors were true of Joe wanting to leave. Figured it was all posturing. Kept thinking, okay, that's fine, let's just meet and tell us how much you want. Told him they want Joe, want him as a Sun. Based their offer off of Steve's and Manu's offers thinking it was fair. Told him, here's the offer, come back to us. They said, "We're not interested." They asked "Well, do you have a counter?" "NOPE". Kept trying to meet with Joe after this. Sarver thought of flying out to Arkansas himself. Got in contact with his mom. Agent's assistant called Sarver and said he wasn't meeting him. Kept trying, Joe finally called and said, "I want to play in Atlanta."

- Once he heard the offer from Atlanta, yes there were questions, but the decision was that they were going to match. Just trying to get confirmation from Joe that he wanted to stay with Phoenix. Once he talked with Joe, and Joe said what he did, that's when the hesitancy came.

- No response from Joe's agent from the 6 year $75 million dollar offer.

- Not trying to throw Joe under the bus. He's worked his tail off and deserves whatever he wants. BUT, at the end of the day, after talking with him for 25 minutes, (spent 2 minutes of that time talking about his frustration with not immediately getting an offer from us). After talking, Robert said, "We know you're offer, are you telling me you don't want us to match it?" Joe's answer was "Don't match."

- Thought of "It's all business" came across, Told him, if he signs an offer sheet with Atlanta, we'd match it because it's our right as he's restricted. So, Joe better get his agent on the horn with Atlanta and work out a fair deal if he really wants to go to Atlanta.

- WE WILL MATCH JOE'S OFFER IF THE TRADE FALLS THROUGH. WE WILL NOT LOSE JOE WITHOUT COMPENSATION.

- Sounds like if we match, ticket prices are going to rise to help cover costs. Lower prices right now than Clippers.

- With the contract being front loaded, can't really trade him after 1 year if things actually don't work.

- Honestly thinks that Joe is just getting bad advice (buddies, friends, agents, advisors). ...He also thinks he's only 22 (sic) and that he's immature and not making good decisions.

- Spent $10,000 making a book (Like we did with Nash) showing Joe's future with the Suns (ring of honor, etc). Made donations to Joe's camps. Did everything to try and make Joe feel wanted here.

- Feels good about our team with or without Joe for the next 3-5 years. Amare Stoudemire is our future.

- WE WILL LOCK UP AMARE. NO QUESTION ABOUT IT. PLENTY OF CONVERSATIONS WITH AMARE. HE LOVES IT HERE. LOVES PLAYING WITH NASH AND SHAWN. AMARE IS DOING 2 A DAY WORK OUTS ON HIS OWN RIGHT NOW. AMARE'S A MAN ON A MISSION TO WIN A TITLE...WITH OR WITHOUT JOE.

- Told Joe, "If you don't come back to Phoenix, my wife will kill me, my kids will be bawling, the fans will kill me. Are you telling me you don't want to win a championship?" "More important to be happy"

RIP Crushalot😞
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TheloniusMonk
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8/4/2005  10:05 PM
What would u expect coming from the gm who is in question as an idiot right now? Covering his as.s!

No more, no less.
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
TheloniusMonk
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8/4/2005  10:10 PM
Funny how another gm can say things and people here take it literally. Isiah says something and it's taken with a grain of salt. When will people learn that a part of a gm's job is to keep the fans calm so that they won't get upset with the current moves?

Phoenix's gm is an idiot. Cased closed. Can't wait until Nate dunks on a putback over Kurt Thomas. Sorry Kurt, but you're no longer an Knick.
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
Nalod
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8/4/2005  10:33 PM
Gms spin it like gold!

Isiah, Colangalo, Ainge, etc. They are a new bread of communicaters to calmt season tix holders.

thats not hating, just understanding GMs tell us what we want to hear.

Example Isiah last summer. The Chad told us the squad was flawed, but we believed Isiah. We Chose isiah, and we were disapointed.

I think this year its more real and more substantial by the way, don't paint me a hater. Im a Centrist!

Phx is getting good assets back and if joe does go back, they will be alright. Players know its business.

Colangalo got to say he traded Q to make team better, what else is he gonna say? " I done Phuched up"?

He got "Dijon", He got some Grey Poupon!
BRIGGS
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8/4/2005  10:34 PM
Posted by TheloniusMonk:

Funny how another gm can say things and people here take it literally. Isiah says something and it's taken with a grain of salt. When will people learn that a part of a gm's job is to keep the fans calm so that they won't get upset with the current moves?

Phoenix's gm is an idiot. Cased closed. Can't wait until Nate dunks on a putback over Kurt Thomas. Sorry Kurt, but you're no longer an Knick.


thats the owner of the Suns talking. obviously the money that came in the deal had to do with a kicker. i think they believed Q was a weak link and I dont think they care about pick 21 from their prospective when they have steve nash signed for 4 years. i wouldnt call the suns GM an idiot, i mean their team won 62 games last year--just drafting amare stoudemire trumps almost any other GM's 10 moves
RIP Crushalot😞
Rich
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8/4/2005  10:47 PM
I agree that it's part spin.
Bonn1997
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8/4/2005  10:51 PM
Any GM who can refer to the deal involving Marbury and Penny for McDyess, Lampe, Vujanic, Eisley, Ward, and 2 picks as the "Macei Lampe deal" is a spin genius
Killa4luv
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8/4/2005  11:25 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Any GM who can refer to the deal involving Marbury and Penny for McDyess, Lampe, Vujanic, Eisley, Ward, and 2 picks as the "Macei Lampe deal" is a spin genius
Thats hilarious.
Killa4luv
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8/4/2005  11:27 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

I wouldnt call the suns GM an idiot, i mean their team won 62 games last year--just drafting amare stoudemire trumps almost any other GM's 10 moves

I have to agree with this. Amare has to count for like a whole career. He can **** up forever and his team will always be at least decent because they have what will be the most dominant player in the NBA.
Killa4luv
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8/4/2005  11:27 PM
btw BRIGGS GREAT BREAK DOWN!!!!! This was a really good read don't you guys think?
nyshakespeare
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8/4/2005  11:37 PM
If I'm Atlanta, I call Phoenix's bluff and offer JJ a heavily frontloaded max contract. No trade. They might be able to get him without giving up anything. If Phoenix matches, no big deal, they're a lottery team next year anyway. Plus they still have a lot of cap space for next offseason.
It Is Solved By Walking
BRIGGS
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8/4/2005  11:46 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:

Any GM who can refer to the deal involving Marbury and Penny for McDyess, Lampe, Vujanic, Eisley, Ward, and 2 picks as the "Macei Lampe deal" is a spin genius

well, they were able to get rid of enough contract$ to get under the cap and acquire the MVP of 2005 steve nash--it can be called any trade you want marbury deal lampe deal ward deal, bottom line that deal was darn good for them and hasnt produced much for us.
RIP Crushalot😞
Pharzeone
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8/5/2005  12:06 AM
by the same cord if the Suns would had just resigned McDyess there was a good chance that they could have gotten past the Spurs. McDyess is still a better player than KT, how ironic. Resigned JJ when he was cheaper, not sign Q if he was that bad and pick up a more quality 2 guard. But I guess no one has that type of insight.
I also find it ironic that people are calling JJ crazy for leaving the Suns because they are more likely to win a championship while everyone was patting Nash, and Q on the back for joining a 29 win team. Dallas was a hell of a lot closer to the championship than the Suns were in 2004.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Bonn1997
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8/5/2005  12:53 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by Bonn1997:

Any GM who can refer to the deal involving Marbury and Penny for McDyess, Lampe, Vujanic, Eisley, Ward, and 2 picks as the "Macei Lampe deal" is a spin genius

well, they were able to get rid of enough contract$ to get under the cap and acquire the MVP of 2005 steve nash--it can be called any trade you want marbury deal lampe deal ward deal, bottom line that deal was darn good for them and hasnt produced much for us.
He said it would be known among fans as the Lampe deal. Obviously he either never believed that or was delusional. It can be called any trade you want? That's silly. Trades, teams, drafts are always referred to after the better players involved. Was the trade last summer of Shaq for Lamar Odom, Brian Grant, and Caron Butler the "Brian Grant trade"? Are the Pistons Darko Milicic's team? Was the 2003 draft (with Lebron, Wade, Carmelo, Bosh) the Boris Diaw draft?
TheloniusMonk
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8/5/2005  12:53 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by Bonn1997:

Any GM who can refer to the deal involving Marbury and Penny for McDyess, Lampe, Vujanic, Eisley, Ward, and 2 picks as the "Macei Lampe deal" is a spin genius

well, they were able to get rid of enough contract$ to get under the cap and acquire the MVP of 2005 steve nash--it can be called any trade you want marbury deal lampe deal ward deal, bottom line that deal was darn good for them and hasnt produced much for us.

The object in being a part of the NBA is winning a championship. Yes, they got under the cap to get Nash. Nash is ringless thus far in his career, however. Amare is a great player and he'll get better but the main objective is winning a title. Kurt Thomas has NOT made them an official defensive squad. Defense wins championships and Phoenix has moved no closer to a ring in my opinion. What type of owner is Mark Cuban? He's put together 'winning' teams with Dallas but they have nothing to show for it. Nash will tell you, he was there too. Point blank, the '04-05 Suns went ringless (just like every other team not named the Spurs) nor will they win a ring for the '05-06 season. Period. So yes, that franchise added Amare (I'd love to have him) but unless they win within the next two years, Nash will be on the downside. Sorry but, loosing Q, JJ and the rights to Nate puts them no closer than last year. Which brings me back to their last moves being idiotic.

They're the Dallas Mavs from a few years back. And yes, they've added ONE slow but defensive minded player.
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
TheloniusMonk
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8/5/2005  1:04 AM
My point is, I don't give a damn how many games they won last season. Stevie Wonder can see that they're not as good of a team as they were last year, point blank. So who cares what they got done last season? A rock star is only as good as his NEXT hit. Same applies here. A team is only as good as their potential for the next season. Not the past season.
'You can catch me in Hollis at the hero shop!' -Tony Yayo
raven
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8/5/2005  3:33 AM
Posted by TheloniusMonk:

My point is, I don't give a damn how many games they won last season. Stevie Wonder can see that they're not as good of a team as they were last year, point blank. So who cares what they got done last season? A rock star is only as good as his NEXT hit. Same applies here. A team is only as good as their potential for the next season. Not the past season.

very good point.

I love the part where he states trading Q not to get cap space... how would he say otherwise, we did get some capsapce but a crappy town with a crappy team destroyed my genius plan ? lol

The suns were the flavor of the month last year, I hated that. I'm glad they'll crash down into flames even if that won't make us any better? The KT trade will get better for us as time passes. Nate is a steal, Q will be useful if well used or traded, and KT was on teh downside...
BRIGGS
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8/5/2005  7:43 AM


very good point.

---->I love the part where he states trading Q not to get cap space... how would he say otherwise, we did get some capsapce but a crappy town with a crappy team destroyed my genius plan ? lol



some people live in fantasy worlds or just may not believe that they didn't like Q. The Pheonix Suns took ON more salary by trading for Kurt Thomas, paying the 3mm$ trade kicker and then signing raja Bell.

If KT is an average of
7mm per year
Raja is 5mm per year ANd they paid out 3mm for the trade kicker
thats 15 MILLION compared to Q rich's salary of 6.5
this year. That means they took on substantial salary. I mean using common sense and basic math--where did they save money here? they are paying out much more! Q has shot below 40% now for 3 years--do you think it is possible that giving us pick 21 and paying the trade kicker and taking on more salary--perhaps they realized they didnt like the player????? Nate Robinson is going to be a fine player for us, but to the Suns, isnt that just pick 21 in the draft? They do have the mVP of the leauge playing PG and a pretty good back up in Barbosa--so while any team in the league couldve used nate, does it seem plausible that he wasnt even on their radar? Supposedly they had lost interest in the draft after Ike Diogu was off the board--maybe this is why they gave the pick up this year? Trades have two sides--we will have to see for ourselves what Q rich is, but to the Suns --obviously he was a guy that they realized they didnt want. We tried to get anyone to take KT and all of a sudden there throwing a pick at us + Q rich? They may not win 62 games, that type of winning is nuts, but anyone who thinks a team that has Amare Stoudemire Marion and Nash as a core is going to break down are crazy. The Knicks are better than the Suns now? get real

RIP Crushalot😞
Pharzeone
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8/5/2005  7:58 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:



very good point.

---->I love the part where he states trading Q not to get cap space... how would he say otherwise, we did get some capsapce but a crappy town with a crappy team destroyed my genius plan ? lol



some people live in fantasy worlds or just may not believe that they didn't like Q. The Pheonix Suns took ON more salary by trading for Kurt Thomas, paying the 3mm$ trade kicker and then signing raja Bell.

If KT is an average of
7mm per year
Raja is 5mm per year ANd they paid out 3mm for the trade kicker
thats 15 MILLION compared to Q rich's salary of 6.5
this year. That means they took on substantial salary. I mean using common sense and basic math--where did they save money here? they are paying out much more! Q has shot below 40% now for 3 years--do you think it is possible that giving us pick 21 and paying the trade kicker and taking on more salary--perhaps they realized they didnt like the player????? Nate Robinson is going to be a fine player for us, but to the Suns, isnt that just pick 21 in the draft? They do have the mVP of the leauge playing PG and a pretty good back up in Barbosa--so while any team in the league couldve used nate, does it seem plausible that he wasnt even on their radar? Supposedly they had lost interest in the draft after Ike Diogu was off the board--maybe this is why they gave the pick up this year? Trades have two sides--we will have to see for ourselves what Q rich is, but to the Suns --obviously he was a guy that they realized they didnt want. We tried to get anyone to take KT and all of a sudden there throwing a pick at us + Q rich? They may not win 62 games, that type of winning is nuts, but anyone who thinks a team that has Amare Stoudemire Marion and Nash as a core is going to break down are crazy. The Knicks are better than the Suns now? get real
No one is saying that Briggs, you miss the point. The Suns are far worst than what they were last season. And if you asked people in the know, they were pushing real hard just to finish last season on a strong note while the Spurs had injuries and still finish strong. The Suns were fortunate that they didn't have real big men to deal with in the playoffs and when they finally ran into some, it hurt them. Now I don't know where you put KT in the line of big men but while I think he was a solid KNick I don't think of him as being dominant. I think if he has to play guys like KG, Duncan, Ming and Dirk on a regular basis he will be really expose. He has lost a lot of lateral quickness over the years (I think it is extra weight he is carrying as much as him getting older). Bell is a nice pick up but he is only good in spots and not meant to be long term fix. I think this CBA is what caused the Suns ownership to get rid of Q, it really punishes teams over the luxury tax and with Marion contract coming up, there was no way that the Suns were going to be able to max out 3 players, keep Nash's contract and still have Q's contract and pay that luxury tax. Q was the expendable guy, while they were confident that JJ would return. Now they have egg on their face. If they could take a mulligan and get Q back don't you think they would knowing what JJ plan was all along. Do you think they really believed that KT was the answered to all their problems, or that Dijion will fill a void.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
raven
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8/5/2005  8:16 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

The Knicks are better than the Suns now? get real

please briggs, for once read the post you're replying to.

nobody ever said that.

now it'd may be your turn to get real.

Why do other gms make good decisions while the knicks would not ?

Is it so hard to accept that for once, mr magic touch collangelo mcould have made a mistake ?

comon, KT was nothing but stats.
good defender maybe, but with no influence on the game.
good jumper but that 's not what you need from the 4.
we all knew KT was not a starter in this league, so don't act as if we got f..... again.

Q was badly misused in phonexi. no postups, only perimeter shooting. they got him paid him and then, wow, relaized they had no need for him.

How many options did they have ? right, not that much. They'll be in cap hell soon enough with no NY knicks type means to get out of the hole.

Soon nash will break down, JJ a Q left and whoever think they can replace him with bell and Jim Jackson is totally insane.

The knicks front office can do good things briggs. With all repsect, you most often than not post great analysis, but you're not always right on everything.
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